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Heads Up NL Discussion of heads up NL Texas Hold'em cash games

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Old 08-25-2017, 06:24 AM   #1
fabi226
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50NL flopping flush but folding it on the river

Hey guys, Im just trying to get in the world of HU-NLH besides of playing 6max PLO, so please dont hate me too much for my play. I obv have to work a lot on my game to compete in these games.

In this hand I flop the Qhigh flush vs a relatively tight opponent and x-raise small.

On the turn I bet (probably as on the flop again too small).

The river pairs the board and I go for the potsize bet to extract a big amount out of a hand like a 6 + flush or straight draw. The answer I didnt expect waited for me, he shoved for 32 bbs more. With odds giving me almost 6:1 for a call I finally choosed to let it go after thinking for a while because I couldnt see me ever be good in this situation. Looking back my odds where pretty surely too good to ever fold a Qhigh flush here. But wouldnt villain shove a flush earlier or is villain really that likely to go crazy with something like A 6x?

Btw later that day I watched Jungleman making that monster fold vs PH, which made me feel a bit better in one way, because even a man like Daniel Cates takes sometimes weird decisions. In the other way he should have called as well as probably me, so maybe I shouldnt feel to good about it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=68O_aesE7jQ

[converted_hand][hand_history]Party, $0.25/$0.50 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 2 Players
Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #37817389

SB: $56.87 (113.7 bb)
Hero (BB): $197.78 (395.6 bb)

Preflop: Hero is BB with J Q
SB raises to $1.25, Hero calls $0.75

Flop: ($2.50) 6 5 4 (2 players)
Hero checks, SB bets $1.20, Hero raises to $4.50, SB calls $3.30

Turn: ($11.50) J (2 players)
Hero bets $8, SB calls $8

River: ($27.50) 6 (2 players)
Hero bets $26.50, SB raises to $43.12 and is all-in, Hero folds
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Old 08-25-2017, 10:54 AM   #2
flopturntree
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Re: 50NL flopping flush but folding it on the river

I'm calling here on the river

I think you played the hand fine but I would bet more like 70% on river instead of pot

Should 3b QJs here sometimes
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Old 08-26-2017, 04:07 AM   #3
Mondego
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Re: 50NL flopping flush but folding it on the river

call for sure, besides his raise is minimum in relation to pot size
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Old 09-17-2017, 09:59 PM   #4
AceofLaid
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Re: 50NL flopping flush but folding it on the river

It's pretty hard to put his entire range on a flopped set, higher flush, two pair with a 6 and that's it with just the info given. I think the fold is no good here
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Old 09-17-2017, 11:26 PM   #5
JudgeHoldem1848
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Re: 50NL flopping flush but folding it on the river

That's actually a good fold. His range is only about 8 combos wide and you aren't getting repopped OTF or raised on the turn with any measurable 65, 64, 55, 66, or 44. And some 32dd,37dd,78dd are making it through to the river, maybe .75 combos of the latter group. The total of those combos alone easily cover the entire width of his raising range on the river.

Weird spot, but due to the extremely wet flop and pairing river any flush is a clear fold here.

Another way of stating this is that you're about as close to pure bluffcatching as it gets with this hand. Would you randomly look someone up here?
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Old 09-18-2017, 11:07 AM   #6
AceofLaid
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Re: 50NL flopping flush but folding it on the river

The games are that dry? Every player with every combo of QQ-AA gets it in on this flop? No one calls and plays a safe turn?(you know like a jack of spades). No other hands are made stronger by the 6 pairing that aren't boats? How often do you have to be good here? What percent of time do rando's spaz? I'm not the best heads up player but I feel like folding with the odds your getting is kind of soft.

Last edited by AceofLaid; 09-18-2017 at 11:23 AM.
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Old 09-18-2017, 11:20 PM   #7
JudgeHoldem1848
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Re: 50NL flopping flush but folding it on the river

Players won't have all six combos of 64 by the river because they probably only open 12 or so pre, but it doesn't matter. The point is that his range is about 8 combos wide and we can easily account for that many combos, his whole range, with - if you wan't to be more precise - about 2.5 55, 2.5 44, maybe .75 66, .75 32dd, 37dd, 78dd, and then a few more 65 and 64. He'll also have some fraction of an AKdd combo.

That means we can actually account for more than his estimated range width, only counting hands that beat us.

What that means is that we are 1) pure bluffcatching and 2) pure bluffcatching in a spot that has overall, situation-independent low RCEs (river call efficiencies, meaning bluffcatching without cause is a bad default). And, in this case, the situation-specific RCE is very probably far lower than even the average RCE for this line.

In other words, it's an easy fold.
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