Gambling's value to Florida debated

Most of the news coverage seems to think what Gardiner said has real meaning or that there is truth being what he asserted and I just don't see it that way. The legislature is not going to turn down potentially billions of dollars over the next few years because they have a small surplus. IMO its just posturing ahead of the negotiations.

The Disney-backed CoC is insanely influential in FL. What they want and what is most profitable for the legislature aren't necessarily the same thing. The CoC doesn't lose many battles.

Senate prez not holding breath that Seminole gambling deal will be renewed

Gambling legislation on the move in the Florida Legislature

No mention of ipoker in the article it seems. I tweeted at Dana Young to encourage her to license and regulate ipoker in FL. That should do the trick! easy game

Yeah. Unfortunately anything related to internet gambling or online poker is years from being seriously considered in either direction. There have been some poker bills introduced in the past but they haven't come close to going anywhere and last year while reviewing the Spectrum gaming report there was almost 0 discussion of online gaming. Its just not in the picture right now. Don't get me wrong, contacting your reps won't hurt but it probably won't help either.

IMO this session will be relatively quiet as far as 2+2 is concerned. This greyhound injury reporting bill looks like it will go through but it has no substance. I think there will be a real attempt at decoupling that could actually go somewhere. It would be nice if it does but there won't be too much changing regarding the current cardrooms or expansion without a new compact.

I still expect a deal to get done with the Seminoles, I'm just not sure it will happen right away. When it does, there will be some other things that fall in place. I'm guessing Seminoles get craps and roulette and the other rooms get California style games but nothing new about online poker.

GOP leader’s gambling bill heads to Florida lawmakers

http://www.myfloridahouse.gov/Sectio...x?BillId=54451

New Gambling Act bill that the article was talking about. It is long, but not as bad as last year's house bill.

Highlights so far (haven't read the whole thing):
- Gaming Commission
- Greyhound decoupling
- Up to 2 Destination Casinos
- No online poker

I have some thoughts but want to finish it before posting.

It's a very well written bill. Probably makes far too much sense to be able to be passed by the legislature - lol.

Here are some more highlights:

The 2 Destination Resort Casinos will be located in Miami-Dade and/or Broward Counties only. The licenses will cost $10M each, with an annual renewal fee of $5M, plus a guaranteed minimum payment of $175M per year to the state in gaming tax (on top of the annual license fee). Also, if total gaming revenues to the state fall below total gaming revenues for 2014-2015 fiscal year, the two resort licensees have to make up the difference. The tax is 10% of gross gaming revenues.

To be granted a resort license, the applicant must guarantee $2B in investment to create the resort. Must be built within 2 years, but can be extended another year if necessary.

The two resort licenses must be granted before the end of 2022. This means that if one goes out of business after that, another couldn't be granted to replace it (of course, the license for it would be likely sold and transferred to someone else).

To be granted a resort license, the applicant has to submit for retirement existing pari-mutuel licenses totaling 5 points - the points are assigned to each pari-mutuel on a sliding scale from 3 to 1, based on total gaming revenues paid to the state over 10 years. Bottom line, at least two existing pari-mutuel licenses will be forfeited (and any facilities operating under those licenses closed) for each resort license granted.

There is a "bad actors" clause: anyone who took wagers from Florida players for online gambling (including poker, but exempting legal horse race wagering) after UIGEA passed can't get a Destination Resort license. There is no exemption for the future in the case that online gambling is authorized and licensed in Florida.

Destination resorts can have at most 10% of their space for gaming. All gambling games (poker, slots, blackjack, craps, roulette, etc.) will be allowed (but no sports wagering), 24/7/365, minimum age 21 years. Alcohol can be served 24/7/365 anywhere in the resort facility.

Destination resorts can't have exhibit halls (un-carpeted halls for the setting up of exhibit events) of 250,000 sq ft or more. Carpeted halls for other purposes allowed of any size.

Poker rooms are de-coupled from racing at dog tracks.

Pari-mutuel poker rooms can run 24/7/365.

Any pari-mutuel in the state that has been running live races for at least 25 years can get slots, if a county voter referendum run on the same voting ballot as a federal presidential election passes it. (But can't start until one of the Destination resorts opens.)

All the pari-mutuels get historical racing (i.e., machines to bet on past races, but they can't look like slot machines). (But can't start until one of the Destination resorts opens.)

No cardroom license can be transferred if it leads to a relocation of the cardroom.

No additional Class III gambling expansion can be authorized, i.e. not additional gaming, no additional facilities (including no new pari-mutuel licenses), etc. Of course, new legislation could always change that.

Amusement games statutes are re-written, making adult arcades with skill games legal, with prizes limited to low-value merchandise.

Creates both a Department of Gaming Control and a Gaming Control Commission - the Commission overseas the implementation of this legislation; the Department licenses and regulates all gambling in the state (including taking over all functions of the Division of Pari-Mutuel Wagering).

I heard from a gaming lobbyist that there is another plan being worked on--not sure if it is formal or otherwise. If an agreement with the parimutuels can't be reached that the doors to gaming expansion will open wider to include other parts of FL.

If they do work things out with the parimutuels Genting will get the destination casino bid. If they don't, the other gaming corporations get their shot. The current proposal is exactly what I heard from a member of the SH. If it doesn't go through at least on prominent SFL track will close shop because the dogs are losing them too much money. That particular track has stayed open in hopes of getting slots, with poker giving just enough revenue to get by for the last several years.

What's "SH"?

I assume this is the usual Genting-backed bill, tweaked to mollify the pari-mutuels.

And I am guessing the unnamed track that might close is Palm Beach Kennel Club?

PokerXanadu;

If this passes, what impact does it have on tribal gaming, compacts, etc.?

Seems like this would be instead of revenue-sharing with the tribes. Once the Destination Resorts go into operation, the tribes will be entitled to full gaming without any revenue sharing under IGRA. There still has to be a compact, but the state will be obligated to grant a compact that allows all the games to the tribes that the Resorts have without getting any tax revenue from the tribes.

Under the current compact, the tribal table games (blackjack, baccarat) expire this July (with 90 days for the tribes to shut them down), but the slots continue with revenue sharing. The current compact continues as is for another 10 years, so I think even after a Resort opens, the tribes can't demand a new compact until 2025. Which technically would mean no table games allowed for them until then. But revenue sharing goes away for slots under the current compact once the Resorts open (IIRC). But I'm sure they'll continue to run table games anyway, and let the state sue to close them down - and the state would lose that battle, imo.

No direct impact yet, but IMO this bill was created with the intent to use it in the negotiations with the Seminoles. I would be shocked if it goes anywhere as is. It is an attempt at anchoring at an extreme so that they can chop pieces off and still get somewhere.

I just read an article(can't find it again) that said current compact ends July 31st and then tribe would have 60 days to shut it down from that date if no new compact is made not 90 days like I think you said above.

Also if they had to shut down the games which is never going to happen then if new casinos opened in S. FL and have BJ and other games then they can have that also right? Anything that is allowed anywhere in the state they can run.

It's 90 days.

They have the right to run any Class III games that are allowed anywhere in the state, but still need a compact with the state to do so. Normally, the tribe and state would enter into negotiations to create the compact, with the state getting revenue-sharing for giving the tribe some sort of exclusivity (but in this case, there wouldn't be any exclusivity to give, except maybe table games, craps & roulette outside of Miami-Dade/Broward).

However, the State of Florida and the Seminole tribe already have a compact, and it already states what happens if the tribe loses its exclusivity. This section of the compact is titled "Reduction of Tribal Payments Because of Loss of Exclusivity or Other Changes in Florida Law". This covers all the contingencies that are included in this new bill, so there technically would be no need to negotiate a new compact. I just don't think that the tribe will give up on the table games and let the terms of the current compact ride.

By the way, taking a look at the compact again, I see that not all revenue-sharing ends if Destination Resorts start operating in Miami-Dade and/or Broward counties - just the revenue-sharing from the Seminole properties in Broward county. (But if slots are given to more pari-mutuels, or table games are given to anyone outside of Miami-Dade/Broward counties, all the tribal revenue-sharing ends.)

Also, the compact continues for 15 more years after this year, not 10 as I stated before. So under the terms of the current compact, if the table games are not renewed for the tribes by the state legislature, and Destination resorts are authorized for S. Florida as in this new bill, until July 2030 the tribes could not run table games and have to continue to pay revenue-sharing on the slots at all their properties except those in Broward county under the current compact.

SH=State House

Yes and yes. I hope I never play you heads-up--LOL.

HU4ROLLZ! - lol

There is a hearing today re HB 1233 at 8:00am. Q&A and presentation type thing. There will be testimony from the Division and others at the state regarding the impact of the bill. Might be worth checking out if you see this in time. Can find a link on the Florida Channel website. Just saw it, sorry for late notice.

Thanks for the heads up. Here is the feed page:

http://thefloridachannel.org/about-tfc/how-to-watch/

Push for resort casinos stalls in Florida Legislature

The hearing today in the Florida House was pretty predictable. Same stakeholders as always making the same arguments. A few salient points/arguments I picked up on:

Dog racing generates $10M/year in state revenues a year, but costs $11M-$12M to regulate due to the complexity of the statutes. It also runs at about a $40M/year loss for the tracks overall.

Passing HB 1233 will not create just two destination resorts in Florida but rather nine, as the tribal casinos will also get all casino gaming throughout the state (with no revenue sharing). [I'm not sure this is technically the case at least until 2030, as they are supposed to still operate under the terms of the 2010 Compact if destination resorts are opened. But I doubt they would comply.]

The citizens have a couple times voted down new casinos in Florida via statewide voter referendums. Therefore pari-mutuels should not be allowed to decouple as this makes them stand-alone casinos without voter approval. If they can't compete, they should turn in their license. (From one of the anti-gambling crowd.)

Online gambling was not addressed at all, except it appeared on one of the charts listing the possible ways that gambling could be expanded in Florida without affecting the Seminole compact.

Advanced deposit wagering was brought up as something that the state should recapture, rather than forcing it out of state.

The Florida lottery accounts for the vast majority of state gambling revenues. If you count the lottery, Florida ranks third in state gambling revenues (also the third largest state in population). Without the lottery, Florida is ranked 23rd out of 23 states for per capita casino-gaming state revenues.

If table games are eliminated at the tribal casinos, state revenues from the compact will drop by more than half (due to lower casino revenues + the revenue-sharing drops to a lower percentage tier).

All the presentations were about state revenues, viability of the industries, protecting compulsive gamblers, economic impacts, etc. No one spoke about who likes to play and what is best for them.

Although both of these statements were made they are both misapplication of law (IMO). As to the first point, class III games that aren't played in other parts of the state need to be in a compact for the Indian Tribes to play them. Essentially the Seminoles would be able to play the class III games that are played in other parts of the state (pari-mutuel wagering, slots, California styled banked games) but not house banked games. They would argue that because the state regulated some class III games all class III games are available to them and would likely end up in litigation for a long time until it gets dealt with. Its a losing argument IMO.

As to the second point, its an even greater misapplication of state law. Decoupling, as its being discussed, just means that the dog racing permitholders won't have a minimum amount of required performances. In Florida, operators need a pari-mutuel permit in order to receive a license for cardrooms or slots. They have already received voter approval for the cardroom and if they moved to a new location would need to obtain the same in the new county. All decoupling changes is that they don't have to run as many live races and can actually be profitable in one segment of their business.

The entire hearing was just kind of sad. No one from the state seemed to want to provide real information. The person that presented the revenue number seemed to be pulling things from a hat. How she can say people that come to south Florida wouldn't spend any more money if there were casinos is beyond me.

A lot of the answers should have been, "You paid hundreds of thousands of dollars to have a report created last year to answers this question, read it."

I also think its interesting that no one is talking about whats going on in some of the cardrooms with the new table games being played.

The destination stuff is dead. I think some things are still alive though. One that stood out was the amount of people that wanted the commission.

Here's my completely unfounded guesses:
Probable
- injury reporting (useless bill)
- medication overhaul (not useless)
- compact exclusivity extension
Maybe
- decoupling
- commission
Not Happening
- destination resorts

Pretty much my opinion as well. My list looks like this:

Probable
- injury reporting (useless bill)
- medication overhaul (not useless)
- compact exclusivity extension
- adult skill games rewrite (Dave & Busters)
Better than 50/50
- decoupling
- commission
- bigger cut of tribal gaming revenues
Maybe
- craps & roulette in compact
- online lottery sales
- licensing and taxation of ADW
- historic-racing machines
Not Happening
- more slots locations
- destination resorts
- online gambling

The first point is that if destination resorts were authorized as written in the bill, they would get craps & roulette along with all the games the Seminoles have currently. So the Seminoles would be entitled to them throughout the state, under a compact, without revenue sharing. I'm sure they wouldn't sit back and just operate slot casinos without table games, craps & roulette per the 2010 compact for the next 15 years if destination resort casinos were built.

Even without the resort casinos, the Seminoles aren't going to give up their table games if the compact isn't renegotiated in time. In fact, without a compact extension of table games, they might start running craps & roulette too, and let the state challenge them in court. Might as well since the legal argument is the same (i.e., any Class III gaming means all Class III gaming).