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Site: Ignition 200nlz

NL Holdem $2(BB)
UTG ($201)
HJ ($575.53)
CO ($385.76)
BTN ($1245.73)
HERO ($688.67)
BB ($200)

Dealt to Hero 6 6

UTG Folds, HJ Folds, CO Raises To $6 (Rem. Stack: 379.76), BTN Calls $6 (Rem. Stack: 1239.73), HERO Calls $5 (Rem. Stack: 682.67), BB Folds

Flop ($20) 3 6 K
HERO Checks, CO Bets $14 (Rem. Stack: 365.76), BTN Calls $14 (Rem. Stack: 1225.73), HERO Calls $14 (Rem. Stack: 668.67)

Turn ($62) 3 6 K 8
HERO Checks, CO Bets $32 (Rem. Stack: 333.76), BTN Calls $32 (Rem. Stack: 1193.73), HERO Raises To $145 (Rem. Stack: 523.67), CO Folds, BTN Folds

HERO wins $154


I have experienced this spot in mid stakes just seldom enough that I tried different lines every time. CO definitely has TP. BTN can have TP or FD. Most villains(CO) would check TP on half of rivers afraid that someone made 2P.

How should I play for most value?

What up Within,
I play Ignition quite a bit, I’m glad that you have DriveHud. It’s some solid and very useful software.
Playing zoom is a unique beast and honestly, as you know, playing zoom is all about value. The dynamic of playing zoom is very different and the lines people take can be different from classic cash games. Ranges tend to be tighter pre, and people either hit the flop and stay to the river or miss and fold. I would say zoom is the love child of cash games and hyper turbo SNG’S.
Keep this in mind.
You have been dealt 6d,6s. This is a very strong holding in zoom pre, and you can generally elect to open raise if you are first into the pot. But when it has been opened and there are some callers I think that 3-betting here isn’t the best option. Like I said above, people in zoom once they are in the pot, they seldom fold to 3-bets and your hand simply doesn’t play well post, unless you hit a set. So your 3-bet is getting called a lot, and your ability to rep hands post flop is a tad bitter harder, due to the fact that people tend to get stickier in zoom settings. Calling in spots like this are best. But that’s the thing. These players are not from EP, and that is key.
I want you too imagine some ranges for both the CO opening and the Button Calling. The CO can be opening wide here, hoping to take the pot down pre. For the Buttons calling range, you can ballpark some basic ranges using the gap concept. In general, the Buttons range here is stronger overall than the CO opening. 66 here is a hand that you can 3-bet given that you are going to take the pot down pre more often than if someone in EP raised. I don’t CO opens as much credit, and the fact that the button didn’t 3-bet means that you are ahead enough to just pop it pre. If you get called by one or both, you can elect to just shut down when you miss the set, and over cards like 10’s-A’s come.
Now imagine some flops that could come out that don’t contain a 6, not giving you a set. Flops with Aces, kings, and queens in them. No use in bluffing here in zoom. Even if you raised pre. I like a 3-bet pre from you, but when you wiff the flop, just check fold. I also don’t mind you calling either hoping to set mine. Either way works.
You call the $6 and see the flop 3d, 6c, kc.
Congrats you hit your set! However, there is a flush draw. The king falls into both the CO and Buttons ranges as well. The CO can have all Kx combos here and club combos. The button has some Kx combos as well, but in general they are going to be stronger than the CO, he has spade combos as well. There isn’t much use in going over every possible combo here, but you want to have a general sense of what hands they can have here.
You elected to check. I don’t mind this. But you should only be checking a board like this to check raise. Remember above when I said people get sticky post flop in zoom? If it checks through, it would be safe to assume that no one had a Kx or club draw, generally people in zoom would bet these. So if it checked through, you would be looking for an ace, queen, or jack to hit so your villains can possibly hit a pair and you could get some value.
However, the CO leads for $14 and the button calls. It’s safe to say someone has a kx or club draw. You have no club blockers as well.
You call the $14 here. Your question here is how you can get more value with this holding when flopping a set. You should be raising here. Kx combos cannot fold here to often to a check raise. So If they do they would be exploited too often in zoom, and like I said people get sticky with top pair and you addressed this in your post. You can value own them for sure. As for the flush draws, you want to be charging them to draw to their flush as well. With sets, this is where you get your “value.” If a flush draw bricks on the river, how are you getting value from a missed FD? If they bluff sure, you can pick them off, but you should be getting value along the way by charging them along the way…
Even if you min raised here I would be ok with it, rather than just calling. You can raise bigger as well but I won’t bog you down with what the “right” check raising size is at this time. This is zoom after all. Some things aren’t dead set standard, and balancing ranges isn’t as important.
You call and see a turn. 8s.
At this point I would elect to lead. You didn’t check raise the flop so now I would lead. I would pick a size that allows TP to call. I’m not worried about if the flush draw calls and gets there, if he does, he does. The times that he doesn’t you have gotten value from TP as well as the flush draw, and when the river bricks the FD, you can still get some value from TP and choose to size down on the river.
You check. The CO leads again for $32, the Button calls, and you raise $145. Believe it or not, as played… now is not the time to raise. The turn is the 8s, what are you repping now? You took a passive line pre and on the flop. No use in “waking Up” now and getting tp with weak kickers/bluffs to fold. Since you took a passive line, the ability of getting value from bluffs and tp weak kicker is more important than getting flushes to fold.
As played at this point I would just call, fade the FD, check the river, and raise jam over whomever bets out. If you are worried that no one is going to bet, you can lead very small in the hopes that someone will simply call with tpwk or jam over the top because you appeared weak leading the river with such a small bet size.
Let me know what you think.

Hey

Thank you so much for the insight, I thoroughly read all of it. I 3-bet my lower pocket pairs when I was moving up 25z and 50z in Igntion but since I'm a newcomer in 200z I decided to take spots like these with lines with less variance. Your thoughts about the hand post flop makes a lot of sense and definitely cleared the fog for me for spots like this. If you don't mind me asking, do you have a Discord or Skype that I can keep in touch with you with?

PM sent.

I'd prefer a flop check/raise I think since we're in worst position and want to start building a pot right away. We would want to check raise combo club draws and 54s and KQ probably here too so good to have sets in that range.

As played, turn seems fine.

Pf seems standard

Flop check is good

Now I like a c/r on the flop. With a cbet, and a call, there is enough dead chips out there to want to have a c/r range here, as a post-flop squeeze play.

The pfr should cbet this flop a large % of the time, so a call in position could be a wide range as well.

So when we c/r we can and should be bluffing quite a bit... thus on balance we should c/r our value as well, which is mostly sets.

The pfr and caller know they have wide ranges here... mostly made up of non-top pair hands. So if they do have a king they will feel compelled to call here, else they would be over folding and could be exploited. This is a great spot for a value c/r imo, we can go big here too, around 70


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I strongly prefer a x/raise on wet flops to get value from draws, especially multiway. On dryer flops, x/call line can be better.

think it's a pretty clear call pre in these games. the main value in playing this hand is in set mining 3way, unless pop overfolds at some point, which would be a weird read to have. you want the SPR to be higher not lower.

leading flop would be especially bad if everyone bet all their kings and clubs on the flop, which is probably more or less true, so I don't think leading flop is good. turn lead doesn't really make sense either to me. small sizing is the only theoretically sound sizing to use, and small sizing isn't gonna get raised as often as it should at these stakes. but there is certainly no shortage of turn aggression when checked to.

I think you should just raise flop in these games. BT is probably pretty strong vs 3/4 pot bet on this board and people will have trouble laying down many fds and Kx vs a raise. PFR also stronger than usual cbetting this size. strong ranges, draw on board, nuts = p clear raise.

turnraise is definitely, definitely a raise. midstakes population just doesn't follow through on river near as often as they should after using that turn size. he's just gonna have KJ/KT too often. flatting vs half pot is probably worse by like 10bb. clubs just play higher EV when you overcall too. missed fd may not even bluff blank rivers, BT could have a lot of KT-KQ type hands too that aren't thrilled to vbet river IP 3way, etc.

it's possible some kind of turn minraise is highest EV at anon tables because you can try to play it off like you're a fish. weird population-read spots like that do occasionally come up at anon tables, but it becomes a bit harder to estimate the EVs because the spots are less common and we have less of a proxy with which to evaluate them. so while i kinda get the sense that KJ is more likely to stack off vs that line than a turn jam, it's hard to say, and then you give clubs clear odds to call too. hard to say.

What is your plan on clubs or cards between 2-9 if either calls your turn raise?

I like check/raise on flop best. Check/raise on turn seems fine too, especially if the population tends to be barreling too much.