If you want to complain about or praise Politics, its moderators or users, give suggestions, whatever - rather than post o/t in other threads or start threads that are likely to be locked or deleted, please stick to posting in this dedicated thread and you will probably get away with most stuff.

Thank you.

***

Also:

I assume since Mason opened the thread in politics questioning the value of leaving that forum open (or indeed needing substantial improvement) that it will be a lot more relaxed around here for starting such similar threads in ATF for posters that are unable to voice their opinion in that thread Mason started that really ought to be heard in this debate (due to specific exiles)?

grammar next time plz

no i don't think so

Yeah, definitely not.

Well seems as though your failed attempts at closing the thread and getting it unstickied didn't work.

I must admit though you have to have a laugh at all the grovelling that has gone on in that thread from those that carry on like they are infallible (in politics and out of politics).

Also, I'm not sure what is going to happen to Clovis for speaking up but his points were very well made and really gets to the heart of what the politics ATF threads have been on about.

ATF 7

Agree with you about the tracking thread. It is a great idea in theory but that assumes level minded modding.

Everything thing including the responses to the ATF politics threads from Wookie and the other mods that have come and gone have been about trying to sweep things under the carpet.

I also had to have a laugh at Wookie's first response to the thread which was to ask for individual problem posts. If you can't see that there is a problem that Jman has somewhat acknowledged how can you be tasked with changing things?

It's important that also we liberals posting offending posts should be corrected. Otherwise our cause goes down the drain, and we are being *******s in the process.

Yes with great power comes great responsibility.

Jman is making some good first steps(not by exiling me though, that was kinda a douche move IMO). However his efforts will be in vain unless he and MrWookie have a paradigm shift in their thinking. A good start would be to eliminate the word "deplorable" from their daily vocabulary.

Supported.

Mike Haven will be moving posts like this to their own containment forum, but i want to address this one word. deplorable as a description of republicans has already been owned by the right.

see this example: https://www.citybeat.com/arts-cultur...-to-cincinnati

i've listened to radio shows where callers laughingly refer to themselves as a deplorable. i'm super opposed to censoring words that aren't 100 percent offensive. basically the only words in that category are racial epithets.

if you are only suggesting people should do this, themselves, that's fine. i stopped calling things ******ed after hearing so many people be offended, but i still won't censor that word on this site.

Then why do you censor the f word?

Using the word ******ed is probably deplorable.

that's a different sort of offensive (not to me), but part of the classic bleeped word set.

Matt, below is a PM I sent to Mason and Jman220 regarding the word "deplorable".

Can you have a forum of vigorous debate with a little fun when every one thinks the other side is a what ever slur they are using?

If everyone thinks it without saying it, there still won't be "vigorous debate with a little fun" imo. However, my involvement in the moderation of our politics forum is basically over.

Mason is now heading up that movement with the current moderators and users.

Conversely thinking the word “deplorable” is akin to a racial epithet is probably ******ed. It’s a paradox.

I was made aware of all of this by a PM from El Dabo Something. I think Mason becoming fed up with the state of "politics" on 2p2 is long over due. I had been proposing an alternative section with rules that would eliminate baseless attacks even when Chezlaw was failing at running a section that wasn't just a left wing community. I'm not in favor of Masons proposed solution to the obvious problem but it's certainly better than the present situation

If Mason is going to be keeping an eye on the politics forum and wants them to "do better" I think they should over turn exiles considering how biased the moderation has been. I know I was wrongfully exiled and Wookie has been presented the opportunity to defend his decision about a dozen times and chose not to. He was present and active in the thread but just didn't have any comment.

Well Named shared the same view I had expressed in the ATF thread I created about politics moderation. It's clearly a left wing community. If you want to find out if it can function as anything else, you should allow people with conservative views and even people in the center like me in there. This will accomplish a few things

1. Can the posters behave civilly to those with they disagree with?
2. Can moderators behave even remotely neutral?
3. If they aren't an intolerant left wing community/mob then why would their faces melt off at the idea posters with opposing views being allowed there?
4. If previously exiled posters were exiled for valid reasons, wouldn't the same thing happen again? This time with Mason able to witness if the moderation has been fair.


If you want to observe the current state of politics and the delusion that these posters are "liberal" just go here for the latest news. This is and endless cycle in the 2p2 echo chamber. This just happens to be today

It starts here https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/4.../index307.html

MAGA kids show up and are being kids. Someone snips an out of context clip to create some fake news. Like adult WWE fans they aren't just sitting back with popcorn, they're actually mad at the undertaker for hitting stone cold with a chair. Watch how they fall for it hook, line, and sinker. The outrage is just comical delusion and bias. To their (2p2) credit it's not as bad as social media where the minors have already been doxxed and they are planning/hoping the kids life is ruined. The indigenous drummer targeted a group of kids having fun and goofing around. They were interacting with a deranged group of black activists calling black MAGA kids the N-word and calling the white kids school shooters. The deranged activists were also clearly homophobic.

Anyways, as that is going on the indigenous drummer guy walks in to the crowd initiating the whole thing. One kid decides to just stand there. It gets super weird when the old drummer boy stands right in his face and inches closer. I assume the kid was trying not to laugh at the absurdity of the situation. Why wouldn't he just go around? the whole thing was absurd. Who exactly are the children and who are the adults here?

Don't just pay attention to the fake news and biased outrage. Pay attention to how fast the "liberals" in the politics forum don't actually care about liberal values. When they find out the black activists are homophobic losers, they won't care. When they find out the drummer boy's side kick is a straight up racist, they won't care either. The MAGA kids were acting the most liberal out of all 3 groups. They were also as mature, if not more mature than the actual "adults". They were just a group of young kids having fun. They were met with unhinged weirdos and they took it in stride without matching their absurdity. For kids, their behavior was totally fine. Personally I find activists from all sides to be weirdos but there can be exceptions

You can see/hear the racist indigenous guy at 1:30 and the homophobe at 7:00. Watch the outrage on 2p2 towards people with disgusting anti liberal values completely disappear (if the 2p2 politics regs ever get passed the fake news). Their faces will melt off at a minor committing a minor transgression but when adults go full bigot, they will yawn and move on... again

https://mirrorbot.ga/mirrors/ahtnos/

I'm curious where "40 percentiler" fits into this insult spectrum.

A case of circumvention itt.

If you're referring to me, I'm pointing out the bias, culture, and delusion going on in the 2p2 politics section which has been brought up by Mason. I couldn't think of a better example than taking a look at what's happening today

Try to be tolerant

I'm going to reply to juan valdez in a post that basically belongs in the politics forum, but cannot go there since he cannot post there. So he's accusing us of being basically a delusional left wing mob that can't discern for itself what is true and false in the news. I'm going to take his examples and show why he's completely wrong. In one case, he is actually the one citing something out of context that pushes a false narrative. In the other, he's throwing in an unrelated point and attempting to use it as evidence of his assertion.

You're taking what the guy you're talking about said completely out of context. About 15 seconds before that, you can see him turn around because someone said something to them. You can't hear what they said. His response, in full to the best I can hear it, is, "If you want to make America great, as a place just for white people, go back to Europe where you came from. This is not your land. No, it's not. You've been here two or three generations, compared to us, we've been here a million ****ing years. So get the **** out of my face with that ****."

The white kid says something about going all the way back to Africa to trace human population movements, and the guy yells back at him about how this was a Native American demonstration and they showed up to disrupt it and push their beliefs on the Native Americans.

So in discussing a large group of white MAGA teenagers surrounding, antagonizing and being racist toward Native American demonstrators, we are being delusional for not addressing a handful of black men spouting off views that are unrelated to all of it?

Yeah, they said some stupid/inappropriate stuff. No, I didn't really pay much attention to it. The racism coming from the group of white MAGA teenagers is part of a widespread problem in this country. As far as I know, we don't have a wide spread problem with Black Israelites expressing bigoted views and trying to oppress people. So if it's brought up, yeah, I'll condemn it, but I'm not going to spend time hunting around on the Internet watching long clips of unrelated stuff to find it.

Last but not least, you're not a person in the center politically, and your post I'm replying to is all the evidence anyone needs of that. At best, you're falling for alt-right narratives and out of context propaganda to make them look better and make people opposed to them look radical. By promoting this same narrative, you're moving yourself way to the right of where you seem to think you are.

It’s just the strangest thing that so many of the posters who have been exiled from the politics forum are also considered terrible posters in other forums and are about to be exiled from there as well (like, for example, OOT). It must just be one of life’s crazy coincidences.