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Old 07-24-2010, 02:03 PM   #76
NOSUP4U
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

Quote:
Originally Posted by isapistola View Post
I was harsh on purpose not because I wanted to be an *******, but to prevent others from getting into similar staking disasters like you. I've probably read dozens of threads like this on 2+2 and everytime I'm amazed that people are willing to send big sums of money to complete strangers.
Oh, so the extent of your knowledge of staking is limited to reading dozens of threads on 2p2 about people getting hosed? OMG staking must be terrible. I loved in your other post too how you pulled the 99% number out of your ass to show how really bad staking must be.

Again, to echo Jimmy's comments, you have zero idea of what you're talking about. Yeah, people get screwed staking. People also get screwed investing in the stock market. It's called risk. Look it up, understand what it is, then think about how it applies to staking.

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Originally Posted by isapistola View Post
A good general rule is not to stake anyone unless you really know the person and know what you're doing. And don't stake for amounts you can't afford to lose.
Ahh, more great advice from your wealth of staking knowledge? Is this what you use to determine your vast stable of horses? If you'd read ANY of the thread at all instead of just opened it purely to jump in and flame someone, you'd know the OP knew the stakee very well and certainly can afford to lose $22k.

It doesn't mean that he's should just shrug it off or be happy about it not post here and out he guy so none of the rest of us get screwed.

Mark
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Old 07-24-2010, 02:19 PM   #77
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

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Originally Posted by donniccolo View Post
gl OP, it sounds like you know what you are doing and you certainly aren't looking for sympathy. hopefully you get some $ back.

have you ever considered the idea below?




all it would take is a simple phone call to your attorney and instructions to create a document that your horse can fill out before the stake....


gl
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Originally Posted by barradri View Post
Current US legislation this could not happen
why can't this happen?!?!

i'd hope that 2 people can make a legally binding agreement regarding the use of a sum of money! do you have any reason for stating this?! admittedly, i am simply assuming, but i'm basing my assumption on reason. i understand that some forms of poker and gambling are not considered legal in the USA but this is much more "gray" than that! ex: it can't be illegal to do this in Vegas, no?

curious to see if this is really illegal! thanks.
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Old 07-24-2010, 03:10 PM   #78
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

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Originally Posted by Alobar View Post
That sucks and all, but man I really have a hard time feeling bad for people who get ripped off like this. I mean you know going in that this is a very real possibility, so it should be built into your staking deals extra margin to cover stuff like this. Kind of like how if you have ****ty credit your get a bigger interest rate on your loan. I mean I guess when it happens you should do everything to recover your losses, and making a thread is required for that, but like the emotions in the op of these things are always the same "I feel sick" "this is so awful". When it shouldnt be like that, it should just be "well I got ripped off, which is inevitable in this line of business".

Hope you get the money back tho, good luck.
+1000

why give some guy $25,000 who "blew his roll" at a game he sucks at? if he's got over 300k in profit in the hu nlhe games, why does he need your money unless he has no self control?
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Old 07-24-2010, 03:18 PM   #79
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

Sending him 25k with a 10k stoploss was a mistake imo. If he's got a 10k stoploss then send him 10k.
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Old 07-24-2010, 03:19 PM   #80
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

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Originally Posted by preflop_stones View Post
+1000

why give some guy $25,000 who "blew his roll" at a game he sucks at? if he's got over 300k in profit in the hu nlhe games, why does he need your money unless he has no self control?
because OP thinks the stake is a +$EV business decision?
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Old 07-24-2010, 03:25 PM   #81
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

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Originally Posted by clout View Post
because OP thinks the stake is a +$EV business decision?
do you not understand that the possibility of getting rolled on factors into whether an investment is +EV, just like Alobar said? i just don't have much sympathy for OP because there were warning signs of him being a degen and he didn't build that into the staking agreement well enough, just like Alobar said.
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Old 07-24-2010, 03:33 PM   #82
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

Quote:
Originally Posted by preflop_stones View Post
do you not understand that the possibility of getting rolled on factors into whether an investment is +EV, just like Alobar said? i just don't have much sympathy for OP because there were warning signs of him being a degen and he didn't build that into the staking agreement well enough, just like Alobar said.
Obviously. The risk factor of getting rolled is taken into consideration when creating the terms of the deal.

Your posts seem very results oriented. The staking deal could certainly have been +EV for OP, regardless of whether it worked out this time, just like any other poker decision.
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Old 07-24-2010, 03:35 PM   #83
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

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Originally Posted by Raziel26 View Post
Sending him 25k with a 10k stoploss was a mistake imo. If he's got a 10k stoploss then send him 10k.
I'm not sure if you've ever multitabled online, but it's pretty obvious why you'd need to send someone more than their stoploss. What happens when he's at -8k and he doesn't have enough cash in his account to multitable? Or for that matter, what happens if he's down 9200 and he doesn't even have enough to reload to full?
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Old 07-24-2010, 03:35 PM   #84
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

lol @ karma
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Old 07-24-2010, 03:39 PM   #85
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

Sympathies for the OP, but "more money than sense" springs to mind
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Old 07-24-2010, 03:47 PM   #86
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

Quote:
Originally Posted by preflop_stones View Post
do you not understand that the possibility of getting rolled on factors into whether an investment is +EV, just like Alobar said? i just don't have much sympathy for OP because there were warning signs of him being a degen and he didn't build that into the staking agreement well enough, just like Alobar said.
it obviously factors in. OP clearly trusted the stakee enough to think that the EV of the guy stealing from him would still leave the stake as a +EV business decision.

it's pretty low to say "why would you ever trust this guy with $25k" when OP is obviously not a complete moron when it comes to business/staking. obviously hindsight is 20/20 but i think OP deserves enough credit/sympathy for people not to say "LOL u should never have trusted the guy" when OP has more information wrt how trustworthy the guy is and has made his own mental calculations about the likelihood of getting bailed on etc.

its kinda like if someone made a beat thread about how their alcoholic spouse stole $xxxx from them and people come in saying "shoulda never trusted that woman/man, you know he/she has a history of having a drinking problem"

its a pretty heartbreaking situation and i think that OP doesn't need people coming in and calling him out for making a decision that is pretty variable in EV (re: some people saying never trust a guy with such and such history and thinking that decision was -EV and others disagreeing, saying that the he just happened to be subject to a life 1-outer or w/e and the stake was a +EV decision ) but is rather just seeking community help on how to move on from here






i dunno if thats making sense to only me tho im pretty hung over atm


cliffs: let's get thread on the track of helping OP now and not dwell on previous decisions/kick OP while he's down
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Old 07-24-2010, 03:48 PM   #87
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

**** i got so owned by typing out a really long drawn out hung over response and someone snaps in with soemthing more concise than what i said
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Old 07-24-2010, 03:55 PM   #88
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

OP you have a problem, you trust people too much.

I have a similar problem, i dont trust anyone.

Between your problem and mine, i choose mine.

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Old 07-24-2010, 04:06 PM   #89
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

ugly situation, I wouldn't stake someone I couldn't personally visit and know a little better.

I'm done staking, but the last one I staked just recently ended and was beneficial to both. He simply didn't have roll for swings, I backed for 6 months, he let me know after the 4th that if he accumulated "x" amount he'd like to go it on his own and it wasn't a problem at all. We both won. I've lost one some as well, but never (knock on wood) had anyone really step so far out of line.

I suggest meeting him irl, and letting him know that you are serious about recouping money. Enjoy the sites, and make it a mini vacation even.
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Old 07-24-2010, 04:19 PM   #90
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

GL to zep and big
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Old 07-24-2010, 04:48 PM   #91
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

1. hire timstone as bountyhunter
2. create reality show of tim's escapades
3. profit?
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Old 07-24-2010, 05:30 PM   #92
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

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GL to zep and big
+1
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Old 07-24-2010, 06:59 PM   #93
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

damn this sucks

hopefully after putting his name out here and the heat he'll have to endure, he'll come to his senses and and get in touch with you to make right on it.

gl guys
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Old 07-24-2010, 07:36 PM   #94
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

OP: contact someone you know or someone trustworthy who's from germany or even better lives in Germany. This person will most likely be able to locate and perhaps contact Timo for you, maybe even contact in person. I mean within the poker community, if he is well known then you will in time stumble upon someone living nearby or someone with more information than you at this present time.

If he is as good as you state then yes he will prob make more money, and if he knows you can contact him irl, etc and have contacts in germany he will be way more cooperative as in ways to pay you back.

gl.
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Old 07-24-2010, 08:03 PM   #95
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

This thread would really tilt the crap out of me with all the idiots who don't understand the concept of EV and don't understand how to think in a non-results oriented way, until I remember that those idiots all play poker too.

Mark
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Old 07-24-2010, 08:45 PM   #96
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Codecci View Post
$25,000 is relative concept, for you it might be alot, for others it might be few buy-ins. Rossa85 was far from "random people" imo, one of the best midstakes heads-up regulars probably, known and active 2+2 user, has played & earned alot.

Yeah sh*t happened, but don't be results-oriented, he was pretty solid candidate for a stake.
+ ∞
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Old 07-24-2010, 08:59 PM   #97
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

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Originally Posted by NOSUP4U View Post
This thread would really tilt the crap out of me with all the idiots who don't understand the concept of EV and don't understand how to think in a non-results oriented way, until I remember that those idiots all play poker too.

Mark
YA BUT D00D THE GUY LOST THE MONEYZ
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Old 07-25-2010, 04:36 AM   #98
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

i find it hard to believe that rossa made even close to 300k.

also i guess its impossible to get the money from him given he has to be busto and for a busted human 25k is A LOT of money. like if he thinks that he can run away and will never be hurt for what he has done he will have a hard time finding a way to pay you all that money back unless he wins a lot in the near future.
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Old 07-25-2010, 05:57 AM   #99
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

He was online and played two days ago.
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Old 07-25-2010, 06:04 AM   #100
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re: Rossa85 degens off 25k stake roll and disappears / [Resolved]

Jimmy, is there any indication that he chip dumped the money away?
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