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"Rabbit Cam" online "Rabbit Cam" online

09-24-2007 , 10:26 AM
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The Rabbit Cam is a horrible idea.

Some major online poker sites ensure that systems cannot be compromised by ensuring that cards ARE NOT predetermined until all action has finished; if there is no action to finish off that hand the card will not be selected.

For an online site to advertise that it pre-determines cards regardless of any finalizing action, is a testament to the lack of programming and security features that they have on the site.

wtf would it matter just use any RNG even if it's crackable and show it on the rabbit cam.
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09-24-2007 , 10:33 AM
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errr.. why couldn't they just pull out a random card post-fold?
Egggg-zactly!
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09-24-2007 , 11:14 AM
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errr.. why couldn't they just pull out a random card post-fold?
Egggg-zactly!
actually no the server should show the $ card for the fish's draw instead of a random one. that'd be sick.
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09-24-2007 , 11:59 AM
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For an online site to advertise that it pre-determines cards regardless of any finalizing action, is a testament to the lack of programming and security features that they have on the site.
Even though you only have 1 post, i still feel the need to address this.

This is ******ed. If you know anything about true randomization in computing, you'd realise that its not a testament to it at all. It is still possible to get a truly random shuffle without needing input from users or w/e else some sites use.
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09-24-2007 , 02:00 PM
Sorry, I guess I am a ****** then.

True randomizing variables, such as the ones utilized in some major online poker software, take into consideration user action and time in generating the, let's say for arguments sake, river card.

If a player checks, folds, or raises it will manifest a different card on the river. So showing this "it would have been this river card" is arbitrary -- as it is VERY likely that the card would have been different if the user called, folded, or raised. The best RNG security uses this type of RNG to ensure that if someone does sniff packets or whatever the medium of compromising the system, that STILL, they will not be able truly know what the river card is.
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09-24-2007 , 02:05 PM
Quote:
Quote:
The Rabbit Cam is a horrible idea.

Some major online poker sites ensure that systems cannot be compromised by ensuring that cards ARE NOT predetermined until all action has finished; if there is no action to finish off that hand the card will not be selected.

For an online site to advertise that it pre-determines cards regardless of any finalizing action, is a testament to the lack of programming and security features that they have on the site.
errr.. why couldn't they just pull out a random card post-fold?

As mentioned, pulling out a random card post flop would not be representative of what the card would have really been. In essence, if a player delays one second, two second, the deck is always shuffling -- it is only at that instantaneous time that he picks his action, does the card become selected -- moreover, the ACTION he opts will also affect what the card would have been. If he raises, say with a bluff - the river card would be different than say if he folds.

I do apologize if this does not seem clear to you, however I just woke up and have sexual objects still floating in my head.
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09-24-2007 , 02:15 PM
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Sorry, I guess I am a ****** then.

True randomizing variables, such as the ones utilized in some major online poker software, take into consideration user action and time in generating the, let's say for arguments sake, river card.

If a player checks, folds, or raises it will manifest a different card on the river. So showing this "it would have been this river card" is arbitrary -- as it is VERY likely that the card would have been different if the user called, folded, or raised. The best RNG security uses this type of RNG to ensure that if someone does sniff packets or whatever the medium of compromising the system, that STILL, they will not be able truly know what the river card is.
As i already wrote, taking user input is only one of a huge number of ways to create a truly random number generator. You could use anything random, like the oscilloscope set up on an outdoor mic. With your method, the information still has to travel over a network, so your point about packet sniffing is moot.
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09-24-2007 , 02:18 PM
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Sorry, I guess I am a ****** then.

True randomizing variables, such as the ones utilized in some major online poker software, take into consideration user action and time in generating the, let's say for arguments sake, river card.

If a player checks, folds, or raises it will manifest a different card on the river. So showing this "it would have been this river card" is arbitrary -- as it is VERY likely that the card would have been different if the user called, folded, or raised. The best RNG security uses this type of RNG to ensure that if someone does sniff packets or whatever the medium of compromising the system, that STILL, they will not be able truly know what the river card is.
As i already wrote, taking user input is only one of a huge number of ways to create a truly random number generator. You could use anything random, like the oscilloscope set up on an outdoor mic. With your method, the information still has to travel over a network, so your point about packet sniffing is moot.
The real question is here how is the Rabbit river card, that is not actioned by a user, representative of what the river card ought to have been if the player decided to play in it?
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09-24-2007 , 02:25 PM
Are you even reading what i'm writing?
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09-24-2007 , 02:30 PM
Are you even reading what I am writing? Your point of multiple input data to form a randomizing output is obv taken for granted. That is ridiculous to think that the player's action solely determines the river card.

Please explain how a rabbit river card that is unactioned, can deliver the veritable river card. True, they can simply randomly pick a river card for all to view, but this card would not be representative of what it really would have been at that time.

It's like this, you are playing in a home game, where the card is constantly shuffling. You fold and the dealer randomly pulls out a river card and says "thats what it would have been." Truly that would not have been the case, and as such, the river card that is picked by the RNG has no real value except for entertaining possibilities. Then again, one can just play imaginary river themselves and just dream up what the river card would have been.
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09-24-2007 , 02:35 PM
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Are you even reading what I am writing? Your point of multiple input data to form a randomizing output is obv taken for granted. That is ridiculous to think that the player's action solely determines the river card.

No, it's not. My point since the start has been that while user input is a great and valid way to generate a truly random number, it is not obligatory and many other sources are just as valid.
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09-24-2007 , 03:06 PM
NO STRAT IN BBV GTFO AND GOGOGO RABBIT CAM
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09-24-2007 , 03:24 PM
the coolest RNG i ever heard of took the temperature of the outside to the 5th decimal place, so like

58.55692 and the random number is 2. I thought that was defintely the coolest. also, zeugma,

ahahahahaha you don't understand the point at all ahahahaha.
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09-24-2007 , 03:27 PM
every thousandth time the rabbit button is pressed it should show a "Wild" card from uno.
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09-24-2007 , 03:29 PM
sometimes if a player goes to press the rabbit button the button should move so as to not let the player press it until that player times out and it goes onto the next hand
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10-19-2007 , 08:23 AM
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Are you even reading what I am writing? Your point of multiple input data to form a randomizing output is obv taken for granted. That is ridiculous to think that the player's action solely determines the river card.

Please explain how a rabbit river card that is unactioned, can deliver the veritable river card. True, they can simply randomly pick a river card for all to view, but this card would not be representative of what it really would have been at that time.

It's like this, you are playing in a home game, where the card is constantly shuffling. You fold and the dealer randomly pulls out a river card and says "thats what it would have been." Truly that would not have been the case, and as such, the river card that is picked by the RNG has no real value except for entertaining possibilities. Then again, one can just play imaginary river themselves and just dream up what the river card would have been.
I agree with you and don't think this question has been answered properly.

Either:
1. The river card had been determined by the server before the turn betting was complete. This is a security risk.

or

2. The river card shown on the rabbit cam will not (except by lucky coincidence) be the one that would have been dealt had turn betting continued and a river card been necessary. In this case, a player using the rabbit cam is being lied to.

Anyone care to enlighten me?
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10-19-2007 , 08:33 AM
who cares if people are being lied at about a card. People using a rabbit card are just plain stupid anyway.
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10-19-2007 , 09:31 AM
(Assuming it's not one of the cards already dealt), does it really matter what the rabbit cam shows? The hand is over already, get over it, move on. (But if it gets the fish to call more often, then i LOVE it!)
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10-19-2007 , 10:06 AM
Some sites shuffle the deck before the hand begins. Its not a security risk.

If you could find out the turn and river cards in this instance, you could also find players hole cards in the other instance. If the deck is not finalised perhaps insiders can change the river card? All these are ideas are negligible risks and immaterial to the (dis)continuos shuffle? discussion.

And yes, it doesn't matter one bit if the rabbit card shown would have been the actual card. Because their is no actual card. It didn't happen. It could never happen.
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