Open Side Menu Go to the Top
Register
Inside Underground NY Poker Inside Underground NY Poker

05-11-2019 , 02:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CupOfSalt
Nope, I really need to give his thread a read, apparently.
Very much so

Sent from my LM-Q710(FGN) using Tapatalk
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote
05-11-2019 , 03:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CupOfSalt
Nope, I really need to give his thread a read, apparently.
My comment was regarding the request for funding. However that thread is a solid "how-to" on not ****ing up an epic thread in the end.
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote
05-11-2019 , 03:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlwaysFolding
My comment was regarding the request for funding. However that thread is a solid "how-to" on not ****ing up an epic thread in the end.
I don't see how you can see it as it getting ****ed up... it may very well result in a modernized version of published and produced poker books or tv series.

That's a pretty good outcome IMO.
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote
05-11-2019 , 03:26 PM
Two different sentences, two different subjects. To clarify what I was saying, Warmdeck ****ed up his thread in the end and it was unrelated to his seeking funding as that was a very brief part of the thread that wasn't taken very seriously.
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote
05-11-2019 , 03:28 PM
My advice would be to advertise it on reddit, not here, especially considering you've received hundreds and hundreds of DMs regarding your content and I would hate to see this thread get nuked/locked.
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote
05-11-2019 , 07:33 PM
Have a feeling this is one of those deals like at the Mall they tell you have the potential to make it as a model if you pay $99 for photos. Someone has this dudes credit card info looking to bang him out. It’s 2019 poker is dead does anyone believe they are greenlighting his book/ movie. There is some type of scam going on either he’s scamming us or he’s the one being scammed
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote
05-11-2019 , 07:35 PM
He's not only posting here. He's posting to an allegedly much larger audience elsewhere if you paid attention to any of those posts. People have creative ideas and confidence that their idea could be monetized, that doesn't mean someone is getting scammed, especially when content is being produced.

Unless its Warmdeck. Then it's a scam for sure.
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote
05-11-2019 , 07:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlwaysFolding
He's not only posting here. He's posting to an allegedly much larger audience elsewhere if you paid attention to any of those posts. People have creative ideas and confidence that their idea could be monetized, that doesn't mean someone is getting scammed, especially when content is being produced.

Unless its Warmdeck. Then it's a scam for sure.
At least warmdeck had good stories . So far the most exciting thing to happen was him taking adderall and flopping quad aces and checking all 3 streets
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote
05-11-2019 , 07:54 PM
You could have just said you came here to talk **** from the beginning without inventing all of that rationale .
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote
05-11-2019 , 10:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BklynGrinder
At least warmdeck had good stories . So far the most exciting thing to happen was him taking adderall and flopping quad aces and checking all 3 streets
The trip to turning stone is the LEAST interesting part of the story so far. The rest is gold.
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote
05-11-2019 , 11:04 PM
Yeah, 2+2 can't be used for fundraising, but all sorts of other outlets (like reddit) are fine.

This has been a great ride, and I'll miss the stories (until published, of course). Follow your dream, and I really hope it works out.

As for title, I think "Inside Underground NY Poker" is perfect for a non-fiction, or slightly fictionalized book. Same for a movie, I think.

A work of fiction could go by one of your other suggestions. If you can write a made up story and have it sound like this one, you will never have to deal again.

Good luck.
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote
05-12-2019 , 09:08 PM
Great teaser and I’ll snap buy the book. Andy Weir of “Martian” fame originally released chapters for free as online fiction and he had no sales troubles. “Kid of Clubs” continues to grow on me, it’s a triple pun!
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote
05-13-2019 , 06:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by zoogenhiem
Great teaser and I’ll snap buy the book. Andy Weir of “Martian” fame originally released chapters for free as online fiction and he had no sales troubles. “Kid of Clubs” continues to grow on me, it’s a triple pun!
I'm glad to hear that, I didn't know that he did that.

The name is growing on me too, still not sure what to go with, but it's a relatively small detail at the moment, anyway. Thanks for the support
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote
05-13-2019 , 06:53 PM
Hugh Howey self published everything on amazon and now he’s just sailing around the world for a living. That would be another way to go.
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote
05-19-2019 , 08:10 PM
Spades — 1.9

What is the difference between responsible gambling and degenerate gambling? Simply put, the responsible gambler will only gamble money that they can afford to lose, in addition to adhering to responsible bankroll management principles. The degenerate gambler will essentially do the complete opposite, and most notably, will chase their losses far beyond the point of no return.

As you can probably suspect, this will often put the degenerate gambler in a position of either winning substantial amounts of money, or conversely, losing everything.

With $1,000 on black, slightly less than half of my entire bankroll for the Turning Stone trip, I anxiously await for the dealer to announce the winning number. This was my first time ever in the pits, and I couldn’t watch. I had to close my eyes. My heart was racing from the anticipation, I was beginning to sweat, and my throat was parched as I took a reflexive, dry gulp.

“19 — Black”, the dealer exclaims!

I open my eyes to confirm my reality. Indeed, the number to hit was 19 black! I had just won $1,000 in less than 30 seconds! This was my first taste of the pits, and I could instantly see why people got hooked. What took me almost half a day to earn from playing poker, took less than a minute to win in table games. Victory, at least for the time being, was mine.

Chris and I start to cheer loudly, giving each other high fives and fist bumps. We’re both in a state of euphoria.

“Dealer, take out $200 for yourself and let it ride!” — I was confused, I didn’t know what Chris was saying.

“Wait, what does ‘let it ride’ mean?”

“It means we keep all of the money on the same bet and we spin again.”

“Hell no, dude. I’m good. I don’t know if I can handle another spin like that. That was both terrifying and exciting. I’m good, cash me out.”

I tell the dealer to take my bet off. There was no way I was going to risk another $1k. I didn’t even know what I was thinking, in fact, I wasn’t thinking anything at all. I was so excited and enamored from all of the lights, energy, and chaos that was happening on the casino floor — I was almost in a hypnotic state.

The dealer pays me out in two, $1,000 chips, and I ask her to break down one of them. I toss her a black chip — 10 percent — as promised.

“Thank you! Nice hit boys, do you have player’s cards?”

“Yeah, thanks!” — as we both toss our cards onto the felt. I had signed up for one in the poker room, Chris already had his own. Being persistent and impatient, he wants to bet big on another spin.

“Let it ride, baby! Dealer, make sure you take out $100 for yourself. $1,900 on black!”

The dealer quickly does her work, and with another flick of her forefinger, launches the roulette ball into motion. Sure enough, black hits again.

“That’s what I’m talking about, mother****er! Here we ****ing go!” — The floor approaches, and politely asks Chris to watch his language. I don’t blame them, he was roaring like a lion.

Should I have let it ride? After all, I was here to gamble, but certainly not for that much, right? A memory of Andy runs through my mind — a lesson about knowing when to get up from the table. Sure, this wasn’t poker, but the same principle had to apply.

“Chris, let’s go man. You’re up almost $3k, that’s huge! Let’s go play blackjack.”

To my surprise, I didn’t receive any resistance. Chris asks the dealer to color him up, and he tosses her another black chip for her time. The floor that had asked Chris to watch his language was still present, and immediately interjects.

“Excellent win, sir. Would you two gentlemen like a food comp to one of our restaurants?”

“Absolutely, can you get us a comp for 9 people to Wildflowers?”

“Nine people is a lot at the moment, but if you stay and play for a bit longer, I’ll see what I can do.”

“Make it for two then, thanks.”

“Certainly, sir. I’ll be right back.”

Chris gives me a nudge on my shoulder and gives me a distinct look. The floor walks off to get us the comp, and Chris teaches me a valuable lesson.

“I’m sure you noticed, but you saw what he was trying to do, right dude?”

“Yeah, he was trying to get you to keep playing so you would lose it back.”

“Right on. You know that it’s time to leave when the floor is trying to get you to stay.”

A moment passes and the floor returns with our food comp. We thank him and the dealer, then leave the roulette table. We weren’t hungry yet, so we decide to go meet up with the rest of the group.

We make our way down the casino floor and spot a mix of our friends playing blackjack. As we begin to approach, I spot Theo further up on another table, playing a game heads up with the dealer. Being the curious and inquisitive type, I continue walking to go see what he’s playing. I see the sign for the game, it’s “War”.

“What’s up Theo, how are you doing?”

“I’m on a heater! I’m up about $500!”

I didn’t know that War was a casino game, I was only aware of the most popular ones — Blackjack, Roulette, and Craps, even though I had no clue as to what Craps actually was.

I didn’t know that War was also a casino game. The same card game that we all learned as kids. You know, where you just draw a card and the highest one wins, but if they match, you go to “War”. Sure enough, you could bet on it.

I congratulate Theo on his win, while resisting to tell him about mine, not wanting to undermine his enthusiasm.

“Awesome man, what did you start with?”

“I bought in for $100. I’m up to $650. Matter of fact, I think it’s time to cash out. Let’s go back up to the room and take a few shots. One last bet though.”

Theo puts out a $50 bet and binks it — score! The dealer asks if he can color him up.

“May I color you up, sir?”

“Definitely, thank you.” — I decide to chime in on the situation.

“Dealers don’t pay their bills with ‘thank you’s’. Did you tip him?”

“Uh, no actually, I didn’t.”

“No better time than the present, man. You know I deal too, come on, you had a good session.” — Theo asks the dealer to break down one of his greenbirds for 5 red chips.

“You serious man? Just give him the green chip. Don’t be a cheap ****.”

It had never really occurred to me yet at this point in my life, but not all people would agree with me in terms of how much to tip your dealer. I was already pretty intoxicated, and at the time didn’t think twice about embarrassing Theo. He gives me a sharp, penetrating look, and tosses the dealer the $25 green chip. He gets his color up and we make our way over to the blackjack table, letting everyone know that we’re heading up to the room for some shots.

On the elevator ride up, Theo rips into me.

“What the hell, bro, why did you blow up my spot like that?”

“Huh? What are you talking about?”

“Back at the War table, you made me look bad when I was going to tip the dealer $5.”

“Make you look bad? Man, you were gonna only give him a nickel.”

“Yeah, so? What I tip is my business, not yours.”

“Come on man, you know I’m a dealer, too. We make our money on tips. You really think that $5 was enough?”

“Yeah, why not? It’s a ****ing tip after all, it’s not required.”

I could sense a huge argument was going to come next, had I proceeded to press the issue. I decide to concede my position, wanting to avoid a fight and bask in the success of the trip.

“You’re right, man. I’m sorry. My bad. Let’s go get drunk.”

“It’s fine. Anyway, did you even play? What are you in for?”

“Yeah, I played a little roulette with Chris. I won $1k.”

“Holy ****! Nice, bro… and what did you happen to tip the dealer?” — I could see that Theo was trying to needle me and determine if whether or not I was a hypocrite.

“I gave her a black chip.”

“A black chip… You mean you gave her $100?”

“Yeah, I put a $1,000 on a single spin and won. She told me to put it on black, and I was gonna put it on red, so I felt like she saved me.”

“Well, nice bro. Good for you. You’re a ****ing idiot, though. $1k on a single spin? Pfft… How do you get so lucky?”

“Karma, I guess.” — I give Theo a self-righteous smirk.

The elevator makes its “ding” sound, and we get off onto our floor, only to make our way back to the room for some more liquor.

I wish I remembered more details about what happened during the rest of the trip after this point. Unfortunately, I don’t. Theo and I got pretty hammered, smoked some pot, and all of this combined with pulling an all-nighter and more evenings of binge drinking to follow, led to a foggy haze.

The last thing I can vividly remember, besides passing out for the entire drive home, was that a bunch of us decided to try and make one final run at blackjack, immediately after we had checked out.

With our bags in hand, we walk towards the casino floor and find a dealer on a dead spread — an empty table. We occupy every seat, some of us splitting the action because there weren’t enough spots.

At this point, my bankroll for the trip had grown to over $5k, and that was after all of my expenses. Some of us were incredibly hungover, some still drunk, some in the black, and some in the red. I’m pretty sure that Theo was a little bit over even. After all, it was his suggestion that we play for one final time before leaving.

I buy in for $1k and lose everything in a little less than 2 shoes. That was it for me, I was done. I was pissed, but I was trying to remind myself that I came up here with $2k and was leaving with over $4k, after expenses.

How could I be upset? Of course, this is the fundamental pitfall of losing. When you feel upstuck — meaning, you feel like you’re stuck because you were up more money earlier on — you tend to chase and often wind up losing everything. Thankfully, this wouldn’t be one of those times.

I clear my head and notice that Theo is on a hell of a run. He’s got over $2.5k in front of him and he’s ecstatic — winning so much, so quickly. The shoe ends, and the dealer begins to shuffle all of the cards for the next one. At this point, we were all done playing except for Theo. A few of us try and persuade him into leaving with a huge win, but he’s not interested in what we have to say.

The shoe plays out and Theo wins another thousand, now sitting on over $3.5k. We all give him the look — the “come on dude, let’s get the **** out of here” look. He recognizes it, but announces that if he drops to $3k he’ll cash out.

Halfway through the shoe, and without a doubt, he loses $500 and is down to $3k. He sticks to his word, however, and asks the dealer for a color up. I glance over at his chips, and then give him a look to remind him to tip the dealer, just before stopping myself. I realize that it really isn’t any of my business at all — a valuable lesson that I was lucky to learn very early on in my gaming career. I keep watch anyway, and I notice that he stiffs the dealer. No tip. I doubt it was intentional, he was probably just in a trance from booking a huge, final win just before leaving the casino.

We make our way out of the casino floor and towards the lobby. We head towards our cars, but I make sure to ask Chris what his final outcome was for the entirety of the trip. He had been up quite a bit during the last night we had spent gambling.

“So, you in the black or in the red?”

“Let’s just say that I’ll be putting in some overtime at the club this week.”

“Enough said, sorry man.”

“It’s alright. You think I could borrow $500 and I’ll give it back to you Sunday?”

“Sure, man, no problem.” — I count out $500 in crisp, $100 bills, and fold them into Chris’ hand. I didn’t ask any questions, I just felt bad and gave it to him.

He did not look pleased with the situation. I later found out that on our last night, he was up almost $9k from a deep run in Baccarat — a game I was not familiar with, nor even knew existed. However, he unfortunately gave it all back before he got up from the table.

“I’ll see you Sunday man, get home safe.”

My buddies and I load up our bags into my hatchback, and then pile into my silver, Mazda 6. I was about to get into the driver’s seat when I remembered that I had made a deal to pay for all of the gas and tolls in exchange for not having to drive. I toss Theo the keys, reminding him of the huge win he just had. There was no way he was going to get out of driving.

We begin the drive home, and I almost immediately pass out from exhaustion.

I wake up a while later, and we’re back in Long Island, almost home. My phone buzzes from receiving a text — it’s Andy.

“Gotta talk to you buddy, I won’t be playing at Spades anymore. Call me when you get a chance.”

To be continued…
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote
05-19-2019 , 10:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CupOfSalt
I can't release the whole story at this point, if it's going to be made into a publication they straight up told me I need to stop releasing chapters and giving away the whole book.
Hi OP, I've enjoyed the stories, thanks for posting these here.

i missed the "asking for money" post before it was removed. I presume there was more in the post than asking for money, perhaps about what you're planning to do with the money i.e. writing a book or whatever? Did it tease out that there are some big interesting stories so far untold?

Got to say I was a bit surprised at the idea the stories so far could be expanded into a book or something. As I said I've enjoyed them, but the audience here on 2+2 is pretty small and niche. I have my doubts a wide audience would be interested in a procedural about dealing and playing in poker rooms even if they are underground.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric
The trip to turning stone is the LEAST interesting part of the story so far. The rest is gold.
I agree with the first sentence above, less so the second. Its a LOT more fun to go on a run-of-the-mill casino trip than to read about someone else doing it. NY part is interesting for some of us poker players but there haven't been any really out there attention grabbing stories that would appeal to a wide audience imho. The writing style is good, def better than mine or the average poster on here. Not sure it is at the level people expect in paid publications though?

Anyway, I would never have said anything unappreciative about the posts on here as it is great when people post stories for us all to read for free. perhaps I have missed something about the untold stories or reasons for asking for money.

All the best OP, hope you keep posting here as I will continue to read
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote
05-20-2019 , 01:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stupor
Hi OP, I've enjoyed the stories, thanks for posting these here.

i missed the "asking for money" post before it was removed. I presume there was more in the post than asking for money, perhaps about what you're planning to do with the money i.e. writing a book or whatever? Did it tease out that there are some big interesting stories so far untold?

Got to say I was a bit surprised at the idea the stories so far could be expanded into a book or something. As I said I've enjoyed them, but the audience here on 2+2 is pretty small and niche. I have my doubts a wide audience would be interested in a procedural about dealing and playing in poker rooms even if they are underground.



I agree with the first sentence above, less so the second. Its a LOT more fun to go on a run-of-the-mill casino trip than to read about someone else doing it. NY part is interesting for some of us poker players but there haven't been any really out there attention grabbing stories that would appeal to a wide audience imho. The writing style is good, def better than mine or the average poster on here. Not sure it is at the level people expect in paid publications though?

Anyway, I would never have said anything unappreciative about the posts on here as it is great when people post stories for us all to read for free. perhaps I have missed something about the untold stories or reasons for asking for money.

All the best OP, hope you keep posting here as I will continue to read
Thanks man.

Just to clarify, I wasn’t asking for money directly — I posted a link to the patreon. Since PokerNews interviewed me and the article stayed on the top spot for a while, it was great exposure which reasulted in some of the right people contacting me.

Long story short, lawyer fees, NDA’s, and copyright fees.
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote
05-20-2019 , 11:43 AM
If your TS trip was between 07-11 there was a strong chance I was there also lol. I feel like your trip was my trip basically. Solid stories so far thanks for sharing.
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote
05-20-2019 , 01:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by iTzLifestyle
If your TS trip was between 07-11 there was a strong chance I was there also lol. I feel like your trip was my trip basically. Solid stories so far thanks for sharing.
Summer of '07. Thanks, man.

Yeah, like some other guys have said, chapters about a casino trip aren't that interesting or unique, but that's where I'm at in the timeline. And for me, it was significant being that it was my first time in a casino.

If you were to skip ahead in the book and open it at around 80%, you'd probably open it to a page where I'm dealing a different private game each night, 5 nights a week, getting paid to be a shill on my days off, and falling asleep at my desk with my eyes open, everyday, at my job, while trying to write code.

My point being, I haven't even gotten to the times that made me go "WTF" in real life -- opening a club, having my partner run out on me after losing a $10k sports bet with a legitimate thug telling me "it's your responsibility now", while both holding a pistol but trying to be nice about it because he genuinely likes me, but also one of the tables in my room basically hosts his homegame for him and his homies every friday night. Quite the predicament.

First SWAT raid (coming up very soon actually) and leaving the scene with police evidence.

Checking out literally every game/club/room that I came across on Craigslist and the shenanigans that came paired with that (CL was a primary method of advertising back then). Met some characters, one experience in particular I wind up in the basement of a Verizon Wireless store in Brooklyn, couple of guys looking to run a game three nights a week. Everything all set up in their store's basement -- couple tables, chairs, chips, etc all the right stuff. They were looking for a dealer who could deal and also fill a few seats. I meet up with them, funny guys, but brand new to poker and it's clear. They say I'm bull****, way too young to know anything about poker. I tell them they're wrong, start listing my "resume" and say that I can do the job and also get a few players down, but they won't have any of it. Finally one of the guys challenges me to a heads up match "for $500" to try and end the conversation, thinking that there is no way that I could say yes. Without hesitation, I pull out about $3k in 100's and ask him, "How much you wanna play for, $500 or $1k? 1,000 chip starting stack, blinds start at 25/50, levels go up every 20 minutes. best of 3 matches wins." The guy tries to back out of it, but now I start to complain to him that "first you insult me, then I try to show you exactly how I'll do the job you want done, and you challenge me to heads up only to back out? Is this acceptable to you? To waste people's time? What's the problem, here's my buy-in. Where's yours?" I go on a little rant. Long story short, I end up leaving the cell phone store with more than just prize money.


Getting cheated (I'm 99% certain) out of every buy-in I made into a private game where I'm the only non-Chinese guy playing with 8 other guys who are all Chinese (and saying things constantly in Chinese to each other, what an idiot I was) in the backroom of a (had to be Chinese organized crime related) bar in Chinatown. If not organized crime, then the people who ran this game have definitely never paid taxes, earn a cash-only living, and can get acquire any item for you, or find someone who can carry out any service for you that you happen to be looking for. I lost that game before I even unracked my chips. Valuable lesson learned, though.

Working in NYC, guy borrows $5k from the club, loses immediately, leaves abruptly before anyone notices he's gone, all we have is his phone number and I'm tasked with tracking down the guy and collecting that same night, the incentive being I'll get a percentage of the debt. The tracking part wasn't that hard given my comp science background, the internet was kind that night. The collecting part, well, that's why 2 of us went. I didn't know one of us had a gun on their person.

Same place, different night, one partner of the game says he'll pay me what I usually make in a shift, plus extra, if I want to go pick up a debt that is owed to him instead of dealing. I get there, I receive the payment, and get handed 750 Oxycodone pills instead of cash. Are you ****ing kidding me? FOR REAL? WHAT COULD POSSIBLY GO WRONG?

Working for a guy in Long Island, pretty sure he is on drugs. Super paranoid. From a single conversation I have with a new player who walks in, who I happen to know from high school, deduces that I'm trying to steal this player (when I already know him for years) for my own personal gains, and covertly calls me into the back office, only to throw a hot coffee in my face and deck me right on the chin. Fast forward to shortly before I leave the place, I'm being handed $1,000 by the same guy who decked me, while he asks for my forgiveness and nondisclosure. An interesting position of power was bestowed upon me that night.

Dealing poker for Montel Williams at a poker-related company fundraiser, total failure went down in flames. Nice guy though, bit dramatic when he gave his speech but heartfelt.

Dealing a cash game with 3 or 4 NY Rangers (hockey team, which I know nothing about or who these guys are, don't know their names, nothing, I'm not a sports fan at all) at the table. One dude named Gaborik I remember, because the clip that aired on TV had the guy's name who they were interviewing.

Second SWAT raid, this time the outcome was not favorable.

Dealing an annual $100/$200 NL game every summer in The Hamptons for some very rich dudes. Money like you wouldn't believe. Oh man, they were great to work for. One of the guys in that game had some ownership or something to do with the finance company that backed Venmo (the app) in 2010. All of them had jobs that dealt with finance.

Walking into Janny's game for the first time, as a favor for someone to play in the game on their dime. The game was hosted at a local motel, 2 tables and it ran 3x a week. Within literal minutes of me entering the room, Nassau County PD floods into the place, arrests everyone involved. This did not look good for me, people asking lots of questions. The ****ing timing in life, are you serious? The odds. SERIOUSLY?

Oh man, it goes on. Again, I'm only in 2007 at this point in posted chapters. I get more and more exponentially involved in this world as time passes. Needless to say, I've been incredibly lucky over the years.
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote
05-22-2019 , 04:45 PM
Spades — 1.10

I had just woken up minutes ago, still not yet home from my first trip to Turning Stone. I had just received an unexpected text from Andy — he said that he wouldn’t be playing at Spades any longer, and to call him as soon as possible. I immediately texted him back.

“What happened? Is everything okay?”

“Are you alone?”

“No, I’m still on my way back from Turning Stone. I’m in the car with my friends.”

“Call me when you’re done.”

An hour or so later, all of my friends have been returned home, except for Theo. We drive to his house and he puts the car into park. I say goodbye, and he makes his way towards his front door, while I hop into my driver’s seat. I take off and instantly give Andy a call.

“Andy, what’s up. I just dropped everyone off. What’s going on?”

“Well, I won’t be playing at Spades anymore. Gonna start playing in Queens again. What I’m about to tell you *has to* stay between us, alright?”

“Of course. What happened? You okay?”

“Yeah, I’m fine, but again, this must stay between us. You’re a good kid and I don’t want to see anything bad happen to you, so I hope you take this piece of advice. You should find a new place to deal. It’s not safe at Spades.”

“What do you mean? Why?”

“How well do you know Matt? Do you guys work together at all?”

“I don’t know him that well. Sometimes he’s working when I deal the tournaments, but for the most part I don’t really know him.”

“Buddy, I’ve known Matt for a long time — you know that. I bailed him out of jail earlier today.”

Andy proceeds to tell me the entire story.

The night before, Matt had been driving home shortly after the game broke at Spades. Unfortunately, he got pulled over while he was riding dirty. Normally, this wouldn’t be a problem in suburban Long Island, however, Andy informed me that Matt also had a drug habit.

When the officer who stopped him approached his window, it was crystal clear that Matt wasn’t sober. The officer, doing his due diligence, was no longer interested in simply issuing a ticket. He gave Matt a breathalyzer test — no alcohol was present. The subsequent sobriety test resulted in a failure, giving the officer probable cause to search Matt’s car.

The cop found a bag of prescription pills, which contained enough to reasonably suspect that they were being sold. In addition to the amount of cash found in Matt’s pocket, something to the tune of a few thousand bucks, the officer reasonably came to the conclusion that Matt was a drug dealer. For all intents and purposes, that’s exactly what Matt appeared to be in this situation. He was about to be arrested for some serious charges — felonies — that could ruin his life.

However, Matt vehemently denied the cop’s allegations of any drugs being sold, and said that he could explain the situation. However, he couldn’t provide a reason as to why he had so much cash on him. He was then arrested and brought down to the precinct for questioning.

During Matt’s interrogation, it became quite obvious to him that he was going to get booked for drug distribution charges. In Suffolk County, Long Island, this is no joke. In most cases, it’ll end with you saying goodbye to your freedom.

At first, and this is from Andy’s account of things, Matt tried lying and said that he was simply playing poker at a home game, which was why he had so much cash on him. He confessed that he had a drug problem, but that he wasn’t a drug dealer. The questioning detective didn’t buy his story.

Matt didn’t have a real job that issued W2’s, so there was no sense in trying to lie about it, and he couldn’t provide a phone number for the host of the alleged home game that he was supposedly coming from — an easy and immediate way to prove his claims to be true. The detective wished Matt good luck in court.

In a final and desperate attempt to try and walk away from his predicament as cleanly as possible, Matt played the only card up his sleeve, and offered the truth about the whole situation.

He told the questioning detective that he wasn’t a drug dealer — he just had a drug problem — again, the only consistent part of his story. He revealed that he was driving around so late and had so much cash on him because he worked for an illegal poker club. The detective regained interest in what Matt had to say.

He ultimately wound up coming clean and answering all of the detective’s questions, some of which had certain stipulations attached to them.

In exchange for providing more information about Spades, Matt was ultimately booked for only a measly DUI — a misdemeanor which often resulted in nothing more than an inconsequential fine and rarely probation, if you had a halfway decent lawyer.

In case you don’t know, there is a massive difference between a DWI and a DUI in the county of Suffolk. Judges are incredibly harsh on people who drink and drive, even first time offenders. DUI’s on the hand, which explicitly define a difference between alcohol versus drugs, are not looked upon the same way in the eyes of the judicial system.

In Matt’s case, the detective made sure not to book him with any illegal drug allegations. This meant that a lawyer could easily provide a story of innocence to a judge, that Matt had simply taken a drive to the convenience store, after taking some sleeping medication. The result of this situation would undoubtedly be a measly fine and an ACOD — adjournment in contemplation of dismissal.

In other words, stay out of trouble for a year and all of your charges will be dismissed. Needless to say, a good lawyer is always worth the cost.

Matt spent the rest of the night in the precinct’s holding cell, and was brought to court later on in the morning. Not yet having hired a lawyer, the judge presiding over Matt’s case surprisingly did not grant him OR, short for “Own Recognizance”, which means you get to walk out of the courthouse by simply legally promising to appear in court at a later date.

Judges grant OR depending on a number of factors. Matt didn’t have an existing criminal record, however, he also didn’t have any ties to the community, a history of meaningful employment, or a lawyer to essentially vouch for him, and as a result, the judge set bail on Matt to the amount of $5,000.

This meant that he would be held in the county jail until his designated court date, unless he could pay his own bail with only the cash that he had on him at the time of his arrest.

Matt didn’t actually live in Long Island, he resided in Queens, which meant that he didn’t know anybody in the area who could post his bail for him. At the time your bail is set by the judge, you can usually walk out of there the same day, as long as you are able to have someone post your bail before the court’s end of day time — usually 5PM.

If you can’t get someone to post your bail in time, your situation will become much more complicated. You will be sent to the county jail where you will be searched, stripped of all your clothes, issued a prisoner’s uniform, and assigned either a cell or pod. You’ll stay there until either your court date arrives, or someone posts your bail for you. Nothing about this is process is expedient, whatsoever.

Not wanting to spend any length of time in jail, Matt decided to call the only person he knew who would be in Long Island and also have access to at least $5,000 in cash — that would be Andy.

“So, I bailed him out, which funny enough, left him in debt to me, yet again, for $2k. Although, I made it clear I wasn’t bailing his ass out if he couldn’t immediately pay me back.”

“Holy ****, man. What happened to his car, did the cops impound it?”

“No, actually. They left it on the grass, on the side of the state parkway.”

“How’d you find all of this out? Why would Matt tell you any of this, I don’t get it. Couldn’t he just have told you that he got arrested for a DUI?”

“Absolutely, but then I would wonder why he had to suddenly quit working at Spades, immediately after bailing him out of jail. He couldn’t take the risk of me asking questions.”

“Why would he have to do that? What’s that got to do with anything?”

“It’s too big of a liability for him, now. Buddy, don’t you get it? It’s a 100% chance at this point. An investigation on the club will be conducted, if one wasn’t already being done, which would surprise me if that were the case. It’s only a matter of time now before the cops come in and shut the place down. If that happens when Matt is there, he’ll be arrested.”

“I already know that dealing is illegal. The cops let dealers go, you even said so yourself. You don’t remember? The first time I ever met you, after I told you how old I was — you asked me if I knew that it was illegal to run a game. When I answered “no”, you literally gave me a checklist of things to do, in case I ever found myself in a raid.”

“I remember, and yes, cops *usually* let the dealers go. However, if anything should happen at Spades, it’ll probably be after Matt gets a sentence on his court case. I’ll bet you 10-to-1 for any amount, that he gets at the absolute worst, sentenced to probation. If he gets arrested, it will absolutely end with him getting a jail sentence.”

“Oh.”

“Yeah, buddy. There are a ton of other clubs, all over, where he can find another job. And it would be in his best interest to not stick around, especially after narc’ing to the cops. That’s why I’m telling you all of this — find another job, I don’t wanna see you get arrested. You never know, some cop might want to teach you a lesson to stay out of trouble, because you’re so young and caught up in all of this. It wouldn’t surprise me, at all.”

“Can you help me get a dealing job at another club?”

“Yeah, no problem, but it’ll be in Queens. I’ll see what I can do and get back to you. There’s no way I could get you into Fox’s — not yet, anyway. You’ve gotten great at dealing tournaments, but you don’t have enough experience dealing cash.”

“I know. Well, **** man. My mind is blown. I was expecting you to tell me something like you had a disagreement with Vinny, or you wanted to renegotiate your agreement with Gary, or… something like that. Nothing like this.”

“Yeah, well, I wouldn’t have told you at all, but… well, you know how I am. There aren’t too many people in the poker community who I actually respect. You’re a smart kid, don’t **** up your future.”

“Well, thanks man. I appreciate you looking out. Please let me know, and get back to me as soon as you can, if you find another place where I can deal.”

“I will. And buddy, one last thing. If you tell anyone about this conversation, I’ll never speak to you again. I trust you. Don’t let me down.” — he says jokingly, yet with authority, in a rather stern tone of voice.

“What conversation?”

“Perfect. Later, buddy.”

I end the phone call, closing my Nokia 6126 flip phone. I begin to think, weighing out my options and trying to come to a decision, in order to formulate some type of plan.

If you were to ask people who know me well, to describe me in one word, the obvious answer would be — cunning. I’ve always considered that to be one of my strengths, to be frank, it has allowed me to capitalize on many of the opportunities that have come my way. I’m an honest person, generally forthcoming when it’s paramount, and take comfort in believing that people are generally good-natured.

Sometimes, the smartest thing to do is to tell people what they want to hear. As Canada Bill Jones once said, “It’s immoral to let a sucker keep his money.” In my paradigm of the world, deceiving someone isn’t even remotely the same as intentionally withholding information or being purposefully vague. Come to think of it, that might be what makes me a decent poker player.

Taking everything Andy had just told me into consideration, I came to a final decision. I was going to continue dealing at Spades, regardless of if he could get me another dealing job somewhere else. If he were to ask me if I had quit, I would respond by saying something like, “Do I look that dumb?”

Dealing at Spades was consistent, lucrative, and simply just too close to where I lived to give up. I did, however, decide to put an end to my ignorance about what I did to make money — cold, hard cash to be exact, that I could earn pretty much anywhere I could find a poker game. A realization that led to my deep appreciation for unmistakably skilled dealers, and floors who possessed vast, intricate knowledge about the rules and procedures of the game.

I did some research on the legality of poker in New York — I wanted to be certain of any and all legal consequences that were attached to running a game. I scoured the internet for everything I could find in order to educate myself. I even had a serious conversation with Jennifer’s father, a successful lawyer, who made a few personal calls and got me in touch with a colleague of his. That was how I met Rich.

Rich was a young, yet successful criminal attorney who practiced law in New York City. He was in his late 30’s and always wore an expensive suit — a bit of a hefty guy, prominently intelligent, articulate, and was way better at poker than I was. He was on Andy’s level, without question. When I first met him, one of the first things he told me about himself was that he was able to pay his bills, shortly after graduating law school, by playing in underground clubs.

I know, it’s incredibly cliche. However, back in 2007, if a reg in a Manhattan-based club was a lawyer in their mid to late 30’s, it would actually be surprising to find out that they *didn’t* pay their law school tuition, student loans, or bills by playing poker. In other words, back then, any winning reg that practiced law and was of the right age, most likely adhered to the stereotype. You’d be surprised to know how many young law students were inspired by the movie Rounders.

Rich and I would later on become poker buddies, and play in a ton of different games together. More relevantly, he was someone who would always show up and play in a new game to help me out — something that facilitated the acquisition of many of my dealing jobs.

No pun intended, Rich had money and played stakes as high as $25/$50 NL regularly. He played in bigger games actually, but, was only comfortable playing up to $25/$50 in private or underground games. For him, anything bigger required playing in a casino.

My first conversation with Rich would take place over the phone. Jennifer’s father set everything up and made it *very* clear to call him on a specific date, at a very specific time. I would be getting free legal advice, as a favor, and I was not to waste this man’s time.

“Hello, this is Rich. Is this Julius?”

“Yes, Hi. Thank you for taking my call, I really appreciate your time. I won’t take up too much of it.”

“Not a problem, whatsoever. I’ve been informed that you are looking for legal advisement in the scope of poker games. Is that correct?”

“Yeah. To be clear, these poker games are not friendly home games. They are ran as businesses and located in commercial areas.”

“I see. Are you a player?”

“Well, yeah. But, I’m also a dealer. I make money in the form of tips, from dealing the game. The players who win a hand will usually give me a few dollars after every hand. And — ”

“Julius, let me stop you right there. Are you familiar with the Mayfair Club?”

“Of course.”

“I used to play there regularly. You’re preaching to the choir. I’m well aware of how these games operate, and fortunately for you, also experienced in the legal affairs that can manifest from them.”

“Wow, a real life one-outer. What are the odds? So then, can you tell me what kind of consequences I could face from dealing?”

“Do you have a criminal record?”

“No, I’ve never been in trouble with the law before. I’ll be 18 very soon, if that means anything.”

“Pardon me, you’re 17 years old?”

“Yes, sir.” — I tell him about my family, my grandmother, hosting tournaments at my house, essentially rationalizing why my age is not a big deal.

“Interesting. How long have you been dealing?”

“Not too long. Less than a year, but I don’t see myself slowing down anytime soon.”

“I see. Where do you deal?”

“At a club called Spades in Long Island. I deal the tournaments, three times per week.”

“Spades? No kidding. I know all about Spades. I play there whenever I visit my parents on the island. As you put it, what are the odds?”

“Yeah, well, a friend of mine who plays for a living is trying to get me another dealing job in Queens. I feel like I might be putting myself at more of a risk, that’s why I needed to talk to you.”

“I understand. Well, let me educate you about the law. In the state of New York, it is completely legal to play poker. You and I could set up a table in the middle of Times Square and play heads up. Inherently, playing poker isn’t the issue. The concern arises when someone starts profiting off of the game by taking rake. That individual is the one who is breaking the law, and can be charged with the promotion of gambling to various degrees, all of which can result in different consequences. It’s important that I point out that keeping a credit book is also illegal, in which you can be charged with the possession of gambling records. You don’t run the floor at all, do you?”

“No, not yet.”

“Not yet. I admire your ambition. Well, that’s a good thing. That means your legal risk is minimal.”

“So then, I’m not breaking the law because I don’t get any of the rake, right?”

“No, not exactly. The legal verbiage used, in the New York State Penal Code, to describe what actually constitutes the promotion of gambling is incredibly vague. However, legal precedents have been established that demonstrate that the court is more than willing to charge you with a crime, even if you never see the literal “profits” of the game. It’s uncommon, but it can certainly happen. For example, if the landlord of a rental property that houses a game was aware that it was being used for illegal gambling activity, they would certainly be in violation of the law. Even if the landlord only collected rent from their tenant, it would still be considered as profiting from the game. It’s very difficult to prove, but nevertheless still illegal.”

“I gotcha. So, receiving tips from the players is illegal and puts me at risk.”

“Correct. To be exact, it puts you at risk of being charged with the promotion of gambling in the second degree, a misdemeanor that carries a maximum sentence of up to one year in jail. It’s worth mentioning that the law doesn’t care if you’re a first time offender, or if you have no existing criminal record — anyone who gets charged can receive that sentence. In reality, it’s *extremely* rare to receive a jail sentence for that charge, but it’s still possible. I’m not trying to scare you, however, I wouldn’t be doing my job if I were to leave anything unclear.”

“Wow. How often do people go to jail for this?”

“Almost never. As I said, it’s extremely rare. The police will usually let the dealers go free, if that is, in fact, the complete extent of their involvement. What usually happens, if you even make it to this stage of the judicial system, is that you’ll receive a fine and be on your way. Even repeat offenders usually just get another fine. If you receive a cut of the rake, but are caught dealing at the time of your arrest, then it’s a different story. I’m not going to go over that scenario, because you told me that you don’t get any of the rake, correct?”

“Right. Okay, then. So, to be clear — at the absolute worst, I could go to jail for a year.”

“Yes, at the absolute worst. However, I can’t imagine a situation that ends with someone like you going to jail for this. You’re a minor, you have a clean record, and I suspect that the police would just let you go and call your parents, rather than arresting you. I’m just speculating about that, to be clear. Even if you were to get arrested, I’m all but certain that the police would still let you go. Any decent attorney could demonstrate that you’re a minor being used as a tool, by a conniving adult who is taking advantage of you.”

“Are you trying to say that I’m a victim?”

“I’m saying that that’s the way you would be seen in the eyes of the court, which is why you’ll most likely be let go, should you even get arrested.”

“Ah, okay. I see. Well, Rich, I can’t thank you enough for taking the time to help me. You’ve given me some peace of mind. I really appreciate it.”

“Not a problem, Julius. I would have told you all of this at the table, had you been my dealer.”

“Oh, you still play?”

“Absolutely. Currently, twice a week in Midtown. Why don’t you take down my personal cell number? If you actually find yourself in need of a lawyer for anything poker related, please don’t hesitate to call me.”

“Awesome. Thanks, Rich. Before I let you go, do you play online?”

“To be completely candid, I actually have Full Tilt running on my laptop, as we speak. I’ll usually sit at a couple of tables while I eat my lunch. Nothing serious.”

“You’re joking, right?”

“Not in the slightest.”

The conversation went on for a while longer. We talked more about poker, the underground community, and exchanged Full Tilt usernames. The conversation ended with Rich asking me if I could bring him to Spades, the next time he was on the island. The club was in a different location when he had last come around to play.

Rich actually did have Full Tilt opened in the background during our conversation. He had arranged for me to call him during his lunch break, which was when he would keep a few tables open, and play only if he happened to pick up Aces or Kings.

Now that I was well informed about the legal risks I was taking, I felt very confident about sticking to my decision. I was sure now, I wasn’t going to give up my job at Spades.

Almost a month later at the club, on a warm, weekday evening, I was sitting in a cash game during the break of the tournament. It was remarkably busy that night, and there were a lot of new faces playing. Every week was busier than the last.

When I had arrived at the club to setup, Vinny had asked me if I would be okay with getting bought into the cash game instead of working. He explained that he needed someone to deal in order to work off a debt that they owed. I told him it was fine — I’d get to take a night off while freerolling in a cash game.

Shortly after the break ended, I hear Vinny yelling at the entire room.

“HEY! YO! WHO IS THAT GUY HOLDING THE DOOR OPEN ON THE SECURITY MONITORS? LOOK! DOES ANYBODY HERE KNOW WHO THAT IS?” — pointing to the flatscreen that displayed the security camera feeds.

All of the players were looking around at each other, but nobody answered.

“****!”

Vinny makes a bolt for the steel door, closes it behind him, and begins running down the stairs to stop this unknown guy from holding the door open any longer.

The entire room is watching this happen in live action, on the security monitor. Each of the four sections on the screen displayed a feed from a different camera.

Just as Vinny reached the bottom of the stairs, a line of a dozen or so SWAT officers appears on the bottom left section of the monitor. The officer at the front of the line is carrying a bulletproof shield, they all have helmets on, and it’s clear that they are well-prepared for action.

We all watch as Vinny collides into the SWAT team, face first, only to get MOWED down by the entire line. He got pummeled — it looked painful.

SWAT makes its way up the stairs and over to the steel door.

*BOOM* — A loud bang is coming from the steel door, as a huge dent appears simultaneously.

*BOOM* — The door becomes bent in half now.

*BOOM* — The steel door violently swings open, and pieces of the wall fly off into the air.

About 12 or so SWAT officers flow into the club. As the sound of their boots hitting the wood floor fills the silence of the room, they begin to draw their rifles on each table, making sure that everybody is surrounded.

“NOBODY ****ING MOVE! PUT YOUR HANDS IN THE AIR! DO IT NOW!”

To be continued…
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote
05-23-2019 , 09:00 PM
Holy crap!

What did they use to break down the steel door?
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote
05-23-2019 , 09:54 PM
Battering ram. They work well.

Sent from my LM-Q710(FGN) using Tapatalk
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote
05-24-2019 , 04:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lordkjun
Battering ram. They work well.
I'm surprised that it takes down a steel door like that. Now I'm intrigued, what sort of weight is the ram and how many officers swing it vs. what kind of steel door?

The door isn't like an inch of rolled steel, more like a steel skin over a wood core, right? OP please confirm
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote
05-24-2019 , 05:34 AM
Usually 2-4 cops swing it. It's got some decent weight to it. It'll often break the frame before the door. Google "tactical battering ram." I'm sure you can find some stats and probably a YouTube video.

Sent from my LM-Q710(FGN) using Tapatalk
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote
05-24-2019 , 11:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by WereBeer
I'm surprised that it takes down a steel door like that. Now I'm intrigued, what sort of weight is the ram and how many officers swing it vs. what kind of steel door?

The door isn't like an inch of rolled steel, more like a steel skin over a wood core, right? OP please confirm
Two or three officers usually swing it. It's incredibly heavy. It was a fully solid steel door, noticeably thicker than your average house door.

The ram had dented the door, in a concave manner from being smashed into by the ram, but a ram is not nearly powerful enough to put a hole through it. That's why the door came flying off from where it was connected to the wall, and why the wood from the wall exploded into the air.
Inside Underground NY Poker Quote

      
m