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Mid-High Stakes Limit Discussions of mid-high stakes limit Texas Hold'em

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Old 06-14-2021, 02:49 PM   #1
mongidig
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J high is the nuts (sort of).

I open in the CO with JsTs and only the BB calls.

BB..He will 3 bet pre flop here with about a 25% range. He's not mixing it up so his call is weak. His flop donks appear to be weak. I've seen him donk draws, middle and bottom pair. I've seen him donk a pair and then defensive check turn. I's seen him donk and barrel 52s missed flush draw.

Ah6d8d...He insta donks....I sense weakness. I don't know that he has any Aces in his range. I think he would CR an Ace or big hand if he had it. I think he 3 bets pre with a lot of his K suited and Q suited hands.

Does planning on calling down non J or T diamonds, 5's, 7's and 9's make sense? Is J high too weak? That's a pretty decent amount of cards I have to fade so it's not like I would always be calling down here. Obviously a J or T should be outs
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Old 06-14-2021, 06:15 PM   #2
ninefingershuffle
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Re: J high is the nuts (sort of).

Sometimes you just gotta fold. Even if he just has a flush draw it’s too weak. King high s different story
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Old 06-14-2021, 07:51 PM   #3
checkraisdraw
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Re: J high is the nuts (sort of).

Just fold, you have nothing and no showdown
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Old 06-14-2021, 10:36 PM   #4
Unguarded
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Re: J high is the nuts (sort of).

Calling down is pretty absurd. If you are going to make a play here, it needs to involve 1) barreling at him if he checks and/or 2) bluff raising the river after floating him on 3 streets. But I worry that he will just call down with small pairs after he checks a big street. And floating 3 streets to bluff raise the river is extremely expensive. In my experience, players like this defend extremely well against bluffs.

I would definitely want a backdoor flush draw to float the flop. And I am never calling down with J hi. I don't even think calling down with K hi is very good since his range of small-mid pairs + draws crushes us anyway. Plus I feel like these players usually will do this with ace no kicker as well sometimes.

The counter to a player like this isn't sophisticated at all. Just calling down to give him rope and betting when checked to with good hands is quite adequate. An exception would be if you are pretty sure he is making "information donks" to see where he is and then letting go of his hand on the turn or river. Then you can start floating him and stealing pots with stabs and raises. But I would still want some equity on the flop to do this instead of this JT that is pretty much and airball.
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Old 06-15-2021, 02:22 PM   #5
DeathDonkey
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Re: J high is the nuts (sort of).

Btw you really think villain is 3 betting 25% of the time preflop against a cutoff open? Most players struggle to find 25% 3 bets huhu. I would guess you are overestimating this.
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Old 06-16-2021, 01:18 PM   #6
Aleatoryage
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Re: J high is the nuts (sort of).

Would it be completely insane to raise the flop then barrel non diamond turns and rivers? I'm guessing yes, but I would be inclined to try that from time to time. I'd also play weak aces like that so...
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Old 06-16-2021, 07:10 PM   #7
checkraisdraw
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Re: J high is the nuts (sort of).

The parlay for that is crazy, and we donít know what cards we need to fade.
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Old 06-18-2021, 06:18 PM   #8
ninefingershuffle
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Re: J high is the nuts (sort of).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aleatoryage View Post
Would it be completely insane to raise the flop then barrel non diamond turns and rivers? I'm guessing yes, but I would be inclined to try that from time to time. I'd also play weak aces like that so...
If you wanna pure bluff then sure, but Iím
Not sure limit holdem is the game for this.
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