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07-23-2019 , 12:23 AM
#1
mongidig
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mid 20's ish guy opens in HJ. He is new to the table. Has the looks of someone that knows what he is doing. I 3 bet 55's on the button and all fold to him who calls.

AdAs6d...He checks, I bet, he raises, I call.

AdAs6d8c...He checks....Should I bet?
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07-23-2019 , 04:16 AM
#2
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I’d bet fold


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07-23-2019 , 04:19 AM
#3
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Fold pre flop
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07-23-2019 , 05:49 AM
#4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rodeo
Fold pre flop


Too nitty.


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07-23-2019 , 12:01 PM
#5
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+1 to fold pre-flop.
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07-23-2019 , 01:56 PM
#6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by checkraisdraw
+1 to fold pre-flop.


Fives is a standard 3bet here and most people who fit this description open too wide so I think folding is a mistake.


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07-23-2019 , 02:17 PM
#7
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Agree with OTR, 3 bet pre. 4's go in the muck though.

My first inclination was to check back the flop with the small pair, but I think the board should favor our 3 bet range so I like the bet/call. Bet/fold turn seems reasonable or check it back and call rivers.
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07-23-2019 , 02:46 PM
#8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JLot
Agree with OTR, 3 bet pre. 4's go in the muck though.

My first inclination was to check back the flop with the small pair, but I think the board should favor our 3 bet range so I like the bet/call. Bet/fold turn seems reasonable or check it back and call rivers.
I agree 44's go into the muck.

I think bet/fold is best especially since we are only gonna put in one more bet. Who knows what he is doing here but he could easily have a bunch of outs against us so I don't mind him folding a hand with overs to the 6 and 8. We want to charge the flush draws. We loose the opportunity to look him up if a 6 or 8 hits the river unless we decide to bluff/raise.
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07-23-2019 , 04:36 PM
#9
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Bet. Fold to a raise. Bet again on a non-diamond river. Hope he can fold a 6 if he's got that.
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07-23-2019 , 06:04 PM
#10
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Call me a nit, but 55 is not a standard 3 bet for me vs. a HJ open. However, it is close as I would 3 bet 66 and would 3 bet 55 vs. a passive whale and a nit that is fit or fold. Villain does not meet either description, so I would fold.

As played, xb turn
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07-23-2019 , 09:26 PM
#11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rodeo
Call me a nit, but 55 is not a standard 3 bet for me vs. a HJ open. However, it is close as I would 3 bet 66 and would 3 bet 55 vs. a passive whale and a nit that is fit or fold. Villain does not meet either description, so I would fold.

As played, xb turn
A HJ open from a passive player does not sound like a range I want to put 55 up against.
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07-23-2019 , 09:36 PM
#12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reaper6788
A HJ open from a passive player does not sound like a range I want to put 55 up against.


I’m thinking passive post flop, but you could make the same argument for folding vs. nit.
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07-23-2019 , 09:51 PM
#13
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Also, it should be obvious that 55 should be folded here and 66 should be 3 bet. If mongidig had folded the 55 and 3 bet the 66, this wouldn’t be a thread since 66 flopped a full house. Everybody knows 66 make more full houses than 55 anyway.
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07-23-2019 , 09:54 PM
#14
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I would 3bet 55's against certain players but not against an unknown who seems solid. Solid can be unpredictable and thus makes it difficult to play a small pair even in position.
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07-24-2019 , 08:25 AM
#15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rodeo
Also, it should be obvious that 55 should be folded here and 66 should be 3 bet. If mongidig had folded the 55 and 3 bet the 66, this wouldn’t be a thread since 66 flopped a full house. Everybody knows 66 make more full houses than 55 anyway.
Haha, Tight is right!!
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07-24-2019 , 02:35 PM
#16
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What is your standard line with an Ace on this flop?
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07-24-2019 , 03:08 PM
#17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasPokerCards
What is your standard line with an Ace on this flop?
Bet
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07-24-2019 , 04:35 PM
#18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ninefingershuffle
Bet
After the cr. Sorry for the confusion.
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07-24-2019 , 05:24 PM
#19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasPokerCards
After the cr. Sorry for the confusion.


Call


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07-24-2019 , 06:22 PM
#20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OnTheRail15
Call


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I probably should have reread the OP, bc my initial thinking is that bf is pretty standard, but this guy is an unknown and I can’t really construct a reasonable range that a decent villain should check this turn with. As such, I am so interested in seeing a showdown that I might be willing to forgo some value to get there.
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07-24-2019 , 10:45 PM
#21
mongidig
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasPokerCards
I probably should have reread the OP, bc my initial thinking is that bf is pretty standard, but this guy is an unknown and I can’t really construct a reasonable range that a decent villain should check this turn with. As such, I am so interested in seeing a showdown that I might be willing to forgo some value to get there.
I still think bet/fold on the turn is the play. It would be very rare for someone to double CR bluff on this board against a 3 bet range. Even if he is bluffing he probably has a ton of outs. The pot is a decent size now so I think protection is more important than gaining information. I feel like if we check back the turn we are taking the worst of it too often when we call the river if bet.
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07-24-2019 , 10:51 PM
#22
mongidig
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasPokerCards
After the cr. Sorry for the confusion.
I'd call all continuing hands on this board. I think waiting to the river to raise my better Aces could be a good play. If I raise the turn he may get away from a non Ace hand. If he is bluffing I want to let him continue. I'd just call down my worse Aces.
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07-25-2019 , 12:45 PM
#23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mongidig
I still think bet/fold on the turn is the play. It would be very rare for someone to double CR bluff on this board against a 3 bet range. Even if he is bluffing he probably has a ton of outs. The pot is a decent size now so I think protection is more important than gaining information. I feel like if we check back the turn we are taking the worst of it too often when we call the river if bet.
That’s kind of the point. If we are taking the worst of it by calling a river bet then I don’t see what a turn bet accomplishes. Obviously, we can plan to fold diamond rivers, but I don’t really think we have enough equity on the turn to justify any protection. I don’t have access to equilab atm. I think this spot comes up a lot and is worthy of a deeper dive. It’s funny that several of the posts itt were debating pf which is incredibly trivial.
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07-25-2019 , 02:17 PM
#24
checkraisdraw
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If PF is so incredibly trivial, then surely 44’s are also an easy 3bet. And there’s really not much different between 44’s and 33’s.

Except that’s not how it works so it’s incredibly asinine to call preflop trivial. Preflop is marginal, not trivial. If there’s an edge, it’s tiny.
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07-25-2019 , 03:02 PM
#25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by checkraisdraw
If PF is so incredibly trivial, then surely 44’s are also an easy 3bet. And there’s really not much different between 44’s and 33’s.



Except that’s not how it works so it’s incredibly asinine to call preflop trivial. Preflop is marginal, not trivial. If there’s an edge, it’s tiny.


It’s close but clear that 3betting is right. As in this is the edge and there’s no doubt that you should 3bet. Is that trivial? I’m not sure. I’m 100% sure 3betting is correct though.


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