Again its just culture stuff that will never change but it just makes sense to me to do everything possible to show you can do the job and they don't at all. Not going to keep ranting on this though.

As far as the resume thing though - India resumes are literally just their name, education, list of supposed skills (bullet points) and then where they worked and what the company did, not what the applicant's did there or what they worked on or even the product, just the general what field the company was in basically. I guess its some prestige thing? I have no idea what these companies are or care. I've gotten 4 page resumes of page after page of stints that is 100% meaningless to me. Weird.

And disagree re: look at code I've had several interviews in the last few months that literally was an hour of talking about my current side project (full stack JS react redux websocket app).

What's so bad about using underscore? I get not wanting unnecessary dependencies, but if it's already part of the codebase, what's the issue?

I could list a bunch of reasons why this is certainly not the case. You like typing Object.hasOwnProperty a lot? fan of the typeof operator? etc

That's interesting. I never once discussed my code or projects with an interviewer. The times it was even mentioned by the interviewer unsolicited is so rare that I can recite each time, starting and ending with "I looked at the source and didn't understand any of it." <- Clojure.

Not that I've never brought up my own stuff or used it as examples of applied concepts, but always move on quickly. They never knew what project I was talking about. idk.

see my earlier comment, sure it's defensible in some cases.

it's just that it's probably symptomatic of either 1) coding without thinking ("this is a case for map, hence i use underscore" rather than "there's no need for underscore, built in map works fine and looks better") or 2) not knowing your language well ("normal arrays have a map method!?!)

also, since i discovered ramda, i like to hate on underscore with smug superiority -- it's one of the best features of the library!

nothings wrong with underscore but _.map _.filter _.reduce is pointless/slow for anything not supporting IE8.

On devs from India, I just have to state that I mostly see code I would consider high quality when I think about it. Being of Indian descent isn't something I even consider really. Seems wrong to make broad generalizations based on ethnicity.

A quick scan of our node code shows we're using lodash mostly for cloneDeep, isEmpty and each (which should be replaced by forEach). A few scattered includes, omit, sortBy, merge.

Not sure what everyone else is talking about but I'm talking about offshore/onshore devs through our "offshore partner". I'm not remotely making any broad generalizations about devs of Indian descent. I work with quite a few regular employees of Indian descent who are very good devs.

Don't get me started on the Hawaiians though.

i've had poor experiences. but i don't infer anything about ethnicity based on that. instead, you have a ton people in a poor country where remote software engineering represents a good economic opportunity. so you have a lot of people getting jobs in that field who otherwise wouldn't, and who don't necessarily like it, and don't put much effort into it. it's not dissimilar to the "become a software developer and get rich" promise offered by code bootcamps in this country -- and i have the same stereotypes about those. ofc in both cases i'm always open minded to be proven wrong by a particular person.

Which one, feature of no underscore or smugness?

My comments apply to offshore, H1B, green card, and US citizens. Perhaps your company was just looking to get by on the cheap. We have some contractors on H1Bs that do absolutely excellent work. I never thought about it that much until the topic was brought up here. I started thinking about it and I just haven't had the same experience. Maybe ut is just the problem domains that I am involved in. Language/communication can be a problem for sure. I am sure there are plenty of poor developers too.

Ok but a lot of people are actually quite talented too with similar backgrounds. This seems more about trying to get by on the cheap more than anything else but maybe it is the different problem domains, embedded vs. web development. Web development seems more abstract, more varied, more ways to actually develop a solution. Not sure.

Our offshore partner can produce competent Java devs pretty easily, but struggles with good JS devs and really struggles with good CSS devs. We basically have to train the latter 2 from the ground up.

it's truly amazing how hard it is to get good at CSS/html, given that it's just a formatting / layout language. it's a testament to how poorly designed it is.

i remember one of the inventors of CSS did an AMA on hackernews, some professor from some Scandinavian university. everyone is just going along, thanking him, complimenting him. and i'm thinking, "wtf? you should be getting tried for a crime." everyone rages about how the wallstreet bankers got off scott free after the mortgage crises. the amount of developer hours wasted because of the bad design of CSS has to be at least in the hundreds of millions, and much more likely billions. even after adjusting a big portion of the blame onto the browser vendors for the inconsistent implementations.

It's amazing how many blank looks I get from frontenders when I say that.

What's the first thing every competent web programmer does when he encounters CSS? Writes a super-css language that compiles to CSS. CSS sucks so hard.

reminds me of

are you thinking of casey muratori's blog? awesome and hilarious

Yeah so much of CSS is just ground-up awful. Back when I started web programming like a decade ago there were these "omg look what you can do with pure CSS!" sites and everyone was talking up CSS. The reality back then was that CSS was so bad that tables-based design was the correct business choice. All the talking up of CSS was developers with Stockholm Syndrome trying to convince themselves that the hours they spent learning awful hacks and arcane tricks to do basic things with CSS wasn't wasted time.

DHTML FTW!

http://ramdajs.com/0.21.0/index.html

maybe a bit of both?

I stopped reading here: we're not porting over all of the Clojure functions

j/k

Well the startup I negotiated at $85/hour just offered me full time at about 80% of my current salary (which is at the top of the market) + 2% of the company. They beauty is I don't have to quit the day job and they know day job meetings might have to come first.

Lol - 2 "full time" jobs here we come.

Amazing. Hard to imagine but I'm sure there's some PCs in Africa or south America still running Netscape in Windows 95

I feel like I could write a daily WTF article about the project I've taken over at my new job. People like to bitch about mongo, but I like it fine. However, the way it's being used here is just crazy.

The site is in django. They use some django modules to manage users, such as allauthor, django-avatar, the lastseen module, etc.

But they also have a user object in mongo that has all the custom-to-our-site stuff. Among other things this has atrocities such as... if you "subscribe" to another user, then it opens the mongo document, appends his user id to a list in the doc, and saves it.

Then if you create an object, let's call it a comment, it puts your user id and your *username* in the comment - because looking up the usernames individually for each comment would be expensive. This means if you change your username, you have to update every mongo object you've touched, because it'll have your old user name in it.

Add on to this a broken post-save hook that had this
if instance.username is not user.username:
... do a big long ****ing thing that updates username in all those objects

Except "is not" is not like !=, it wants them to be the same *object* not the same value. So it ran this every time.

Therefore, every time you log into the site, it updates your last-logged-in field, which triggers it to update everything you've ever created, to replace your username.

I found out about this because a user complained it took 60 seconds to *log in* to the site. I looked in newrelic and yeah, holy ****, it was doing hundreds of database writes and what not.

lol thats pretty funny. I like Mongo but the relational model seems to keep ppl slightly more on the correct design path. Were using Mongo but in a lot more relational manner. Although the nested docs are nice, updating them can be annoying

A startup I talked to a few years ago which was MEAN stack, ripped out all their mongo and replaced it with postgres. The lack of schemas and a way to enforce referential integrity was the deal-breaker. He said it was just getting too hard to manage. He said he could use mongoose with node, but there were/could be non-node clients accessing mongo as well.

Transactions and unique constraints would solve a lot of random bugs weve had. Its supposed to be easy to just mock stuff up quickly without a schema but the library were using for scala pretty much enforces a hard coded schema anyways so its not really all that flexible