** UnhandledExceptionEventHandler :: OFFICIAL LC / CHATTER THREAD ** - Page 514 - Computer Technical Help

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03-15-2014 , 10:22 PM

#12826

kerowo

lolcat

Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 37,183

lol

Quote

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03-16-2014 , 12:11 PM

#12827

adios

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 22,558

Quote:

Originally Posted by iosys

That is a person's carelessness or lack of organization and nothing to do with the language.

Not a Java expert. With that said I disagree with your conclusion because this happens for many other reasons in C/C++ source code repositories. The question I believe that is relevant is what programming language/environment alleviates these kinds of complications?

Quote

03-16-2014 , 02:29 PM

#12828

iosys

old hand

Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 1,753

Quote:

Originally Posted by adios

Friend which uses C++ a lot, told me to avoid using namespace for that reason when I was learning it.

I'm not being completely serious in my posts that it's probably the people's fault but I don't really see any thing that would suggest it's not. The open source libs that my team uses get pulled from git and packaged into our project. We would not want to use some jar just downloaded off the web and put into a folder. Which I can very much see a person doing that I consider not organized or just doesn't care.

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03-16-2014 , 06:04 PM

#12829

daveT

S.A.G.E. Master

Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 23,955

iosys: You realize you are having this debate with people that have many more years of experience than you do, right?

irt to unfounded language criticism, weren't you the one who dismissed Python as training wheels and a language not used in the real world?

And how is having open-source libraries unique to Java?

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03-16-2014 , 06:15 PM

#12830

Scary_Tiger

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 21,487

Anyone get approval for work hours to spend on books or online courses as professional development? Planning on floating that in the near future, like four hours/one afternoon a week or such. My work is generally happy to buy books or send people away for days of vendor training, recent examples within my team: four days of AWS training, going to Vegas for a week for a Splunk conference, or going to Georgia for a week for iOS training. My reason being is management always wants us to learn a million different things, like in the past few weeks Node.js, Ruby, and digital analytics, but I couldn't see myself prioritizing work time for learning any of these things over the projects I'm working on.

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03-16-2014 , 06:30 PM

#12831

clowntable

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 45,557

It's pretty much assumed that you read that stuff in your free time at most places I think (and actually enjoy it) but it can't hurt to ask. Good places are always interested in their employees learning new things and as long as it's reasonable I think you should ask. Turning one workday into a halfday with the other half dedicated to learning something useful sounds like a good opening bid.

I'd suggest Monday since most people assume less productivity on Mondays anyways so you can use the first half of the day to do the urgent stuff that piled up over the weekend (if that's usually a lot suggest Friday instead) and the other half for learning.

Make sure that you point out that learning makes you a better/faster/more efficient programmer and it's a good midterm +EV move for the company.

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03-16-2014 , 07:02 PM

#12832

jjshabado

Carpal Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 22,732

Lol, I honestly don't know what everyone's point is right now. So let me be completely clear: Dependency management is an inherently hard problem. It's hard regardless of the language you're using.

Different languages have different tools/features/whatevers for dealing with this problem. Things like rvm, gems, virtualenv, pip, maven, ivy, classpaths, whatever.

In general, these tools help but there can still be problems. That's not surprising since, like we've covered, its an inherently hard problem.

iosys, I'm glad that just packaging jars in source control works for you. Keep on keeping on. But there are a lot of tools built that make life easier after your project gets past a certain complexity. Using these tools has nothing to do with being lazy, careless or whatever. Nor does not using those tools if you don't need them.

There's no one right way.

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03-16-2014 , 11:01 PM

#12833

iosys

old hand

Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 1,753

Quote:

Originally Posted by daveT

I don't really see a debate going here...

I wrote that I don't believe that a person should run into an issue with dependency conflicts if they structure the project correctly and understand what is actually happening within the library.

Maybe it's just a case of you had to have been there to understand, which I can get but I don't think that is worth mentioning when it happens rarely and can happen with whatever language you use.

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03-16-2014 , 11:48 PM

#12834

daveT

S.A.G.E. Master

Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 23,955

Are you saying that your team does not use any dependency tool like Maven and you are only doing git clones from open source libs then drag-and-dropping .jar files to your file system?

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03-16-2014 , 11:54 PM

#12835

jtollison78

grinder

Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 502

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scary_Tiger

Anyone get approval for work hours to spend on books or online courses as professional development?

"20% time" is trendy. Some companies give you friday to work on... whatever. I don't know if it's totally open, but the congnicasts I've listened to make me think they were pretty loose about what they allowed at Relevance/Cognitect.

Quote

03-17-2014 , 12:25 AM

#12836

iosys

old hand

Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 1,753

Quote:

Originally Posted by daveT

Are you saying that your team does not use any dependency tool like Maven and you are only doing git clones from open source libs then drag-and-dropping .jar files to your file system?

How did you read my posts and come anywhere near thinking that?

Team uses github and we don't drag and drop jar files rofl.

Quote

03-17-2014 , 12:36 AM

#12837

daveT

S.A.G.E. Master

Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 23,955

Quote:

Originally Posted by iosys

How did you read my posts and come anywhere near thinking that?

Team uses github and we don't drag and drop jar files rofl.

Quote:

Originally Posted by iosys

Simple as dragging the jar into your project's library folder and adding the imports which are done automatically with any IDE.

Quote:

Originally Posted by iosys

We would not want to use some jar just downloaded off the web and put into a folder.

What did you want me to think?

Why would you even say this stuff if you know it is wrong?

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03-17-2014 , 12:49 AM

#12838

PJo336

THRILLHOUSE!

Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 22,158

Why wouldnt you just explain what you do like an adult?

Quote

03-17-2014 , 01:06 AM

#12839

iosys

old hand

Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 1,753

Quote:

Originally Posted by daveT

What did you want me to think?

Why would you even say this stuff if you know it is wrong?

The post above is what I thought you were referring to...

The post you quoted is what I do for small self projects but if it's an android project I typically like to create a separate package in my src folder that contains the class files of the libs(team projects are more along those lines).

IDK I apologize for doing what others have done in this discussion.

Edit: I have seen a horror show of someone that had imported libs into eclipse as projects(Android).
The developer used them as libraries and relied on the same library imported into eclipse for multiple libraries creating a spider web of builds being broken/fixed on startup.

Last edited by iosys; 03-17-2014 at 01:14 AM.

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03-17-2014 , 02:22 AM

#12840

daveT

S.A.G.E. Master

Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 23,955

I'm astonished that people -- especially professional teams -- program without a dependency and package manager.

Is your team is two-layered, where one team checks that nothing breaks then pushes the ensured code to a private repo and the next team doesn't have to worry about it?

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03-17-2014 , 03:02 AM

#12841

iosys

old hand

Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 1,753

Quote:

Originally Posted by daveT

Is your team is two-layered, where one team checks that nothing breaks then pushes the ensured code to a private repo and the next team doesn't have to worry about it?

Yah it's sort of like that but it depends on what the goal is if that makes any sense. We sort of do experimental stuff with using things developed in house with a mixture of open source libs.

No way do I consider it the best work environment since there are many hoops that have to be jumped because of the company rules.

My team is very small which makes a big difference about keeping things organized. Such as around five people and never all working on the same project but cross-platform solutions that involve the project. Each person has their own platform that they enjoy the most, mine is android but I go back and forth between C# (Windows project) and javascript (Browser project).

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03-17-2014 , 06:48 AM

#12842

jjshabado

Carpal Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 22,732

Quote:

Originally Posted by iosys

I wrote that I don't believe that a person should run into an issue with dependency conflicts if they structure the project correctly and understand what is actually happening within the library.

Lol.

What would you say is the average number of libraries that you're using? How often do you add a new library or update an existing one?

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03-17-2014 , 07:21 AM

#12843

jjshabado

Carpal Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 22,732

Here's a list of libraries used by an Open Source Project I work on.

Code:

./accumulo-core-1.5.0.jar
./accumulo-fate-1.5.0.jar
./accumulo-minicluster-1.5.0.jar
./accumulo-server-1.5.0.jar
./accumulo-start-1.5.0.jar
./accumulo-trace-1.5.0.jar
./ant-1.6.5.jar
./antlr-2.7.7.jar
./antlr-3.4.jar
./antlr-runtime-3.4.jar
./asm-3.3.1.jar
./automaton-1.11-8.jar
./avro-1.7.5.jar
./avro-ipc-1.7.5-tests.jar
./avro-mapred-1.7.5.jar
./avro-tools-1.7.5-nodeps.jar
./commons-beanutils-1.7.0.jar
./commons-beanutils-core-1.8.0.jar
./commons-cli-1.2.jar
./commons-codec-1.4.jar
./commons-collections-3.2.1.jar
./commons-compress-1.4.1.jar
./commons-configuration-1.6.jar
./commons-digester-1.8.jar
./commons-el-1.0.jar
./commons-httpclient-3.0.1.jar
./commons-io-2.3.jar
./commons-lang-2.4.jar
./commons-logging-1.1.1.jar
./commons-math-2.1.jar
./commons-net-1.4.1.jar
./commons-vfs2-2.0.jar
./core-3.1.1.jar
./ftplet-api-1.0.0.jar
./ftpserver-core-1.0.0.jar
./ftpserver-deprecated-1.0.0-M2.jar
./groovy-all-1.8.6.jar
./gson-2.2.2.jar
./guava-11.0.jar
./hadoop-core-1.0.4.jar
./hadoop-test-1.0.4.jar
./hamcrest-core-1.3.jar
./hbase-0.94.1-tests.jar
./hbase-0.94.1.jar
./high-scale-lib-1.1.1.jar
./hive-exec-0.8.0.jar
./hsqldb-1.8.0.10.jar
./httpclient-4.1.3.jar
./httpcore-4.1.3.jar
./jackson-core-asl-1.8.8.jar
./jackson-mapper-asl-1.8.8.jar
./jansi-1.9.jar
./jasper-compiler-5.5.12.jar
./jasper-runtime-5.5.12.jar
./javacc-4.2.jar
./javacc.jar
./jcommander-1.30.jar
./jdeb-0.8.jar
./jersey-core-1.8.jar
./jets3t-0.7.1.jar
./jetty-6.1.26.jar
./jetty-util-6.1.26.jar
./jline-1.0.jar
./joda-time-2.1.jar
./jopt-simple-4.1.jar
./jruby-complete-1.6.7.jar
./js-1.7R2.jar
./json-simple-1.1.jar
./jsp-2.1-6.1.14.jar
./jsp-api-2.1-6.1.14.jar
./junit-3.8.1.jar
./junit-4.11.jar
./jython-standalone-2.5.3.jar
./kfs-0.3.jar
./libthrift-0.9.0.jar
./log4j-1.2.16.jar
./maven-scm-api-1.4.jar
./maven-scm-provider-svn-commons-1.4.jar
./maven-scm-provider-svnexe-1.4.jar
./metrics-core-2.1.2.jar
./mina-core-2.0.0-M5.jar
./mockito-all-1.8.4.jar
./netty-3.2.2.Final.jar
./netty-3.4.0.Final.jar
./oro-2.0.8.jar
./paranamer-2.3.jar
./parquet-pig-bundle-1.2.3.jar
./plexus-utils-1.5.6.jar
./protobuf-java-2.4.0a.jar
./regexp-1.3.jar
./serializer-2.7.1.jar
./servlet-api-2.5-20081211.jar
./servlet-api-2.5-6.1.14.jar
./slf4j-api-1.6.4.jar
./slf4j-log4j12-1.6.1.jar
./snappy-java-1.0.5.jar
./ST4-4.0.4.jar
./stringtemplate-3.2.1.jar
./trevni-avro-1.7.5-tests.jar
./trevni-avro-1.7.5.jar
./trevni-core-1.7.5-tests.jar
./trevni-core-1.7.5.jar
./velocity-1.7.jar
./xalan-2.7.1.jar
./xercesImpl-2.10.0.jar
./xml-apis-1.4.01.jar
./xmlenc-0.52.jar
./xz-1.0.jar
./zookeeper-3.4.5.jar

Let me know when you understand what is actually happening with all of the libraries.

Edit: I should also point out that a bunch of libraries (guava, commons-*, log4j, ...) are also being used by a bunch of the libraries in that list.

Oh, and the grand total is 91M in size.

Last edited by jjshabado; 03-17-2014 at 07:35 AM.

Quote

03-17-2014 , 09:21 AM

#12844

gaming_mouse

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 13,786

I've only been sort of half paying attention to this argument, but it made me reflect on something I've always noticed about programming disagreements and which I'd like to dub The Purity of Soul Fallacy: the person arguing that the problems with X aren't really problems when the programmer is careful/skilled/experienced/pure enough... is always wrong.

Quote

03-17-2014 , 09:32 AM

#12845

jjshabado

Carpal Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 22,732

Quote:

Originally Posted by gaming_mouse

I like it!

Quote

03-17-2014 , 10:16 AM

#12846

Nchabazam

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 4,938

Anyone have any experience with testing angularjs? I'm using jasmine, and angular-mocks and for some reason my second ajax call on the page load keeps throwing this error. Basic structure: load external data from an API, then load local edited data from a rails server. Probably something simple, but I can't seem to find any blog posts/SO posts about having multiple ajax mocks. Maybe I'm doing this totally wrong since it's a unit test.

"Error: Unexpected request: GET /dashboard/edits?timePeriod=%222014-03-17T14:13:30.516Z%22
No more request expected"

Gist

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03-17-2014 , 10:23 AM

#12847

jjshabado

Carpal Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 22,732

I once had a problem with something like this where the problem was that I was mocking a call with a specific detailed date. So the date expected by the mock is off by a couple of ms from the date actually called in the test.

Quote

03-17-2014 , 10:32 AM

#12848

Nchabazam

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 4,938

Quote:

Originally Posted by jjshabado

Ya, I was thinking that might be a problem. I'm currently parsing that date on the server, but there's no harm in doing it on the client.

I'll give it a shot, thanks.

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03-17-2014 , 10:37 AM

#12849

jjshabado

Carpal Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 22,732

There should be a way to write the mock so you don't need to specify the exact date coming in.

Quote

03-17-2014 , 10:45 AM

#12850

Nchabazam

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 4,938

ya, that was definitely the problem. If I just stub out the date to be $scope.dt = new Date('3/3/2012') in my controller, and copy and paste @http.whenGET('/dashboard/edits?timePeriod=%222012-03-03T07:00:00.000Z%22').respond(200, @savedEdits) the tests run.

So I need a way to replicate it so the date is a consistent parameter. There probably is a way to make it so you can ignore the parameters, but I'm struggling to find it.