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08-01-2021 , 06:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PairTheBoard
The question was whether the advantage is so large for placing the two far slower swimmers (females) in the shorter (time-wise) races as to make it silly to even consider individual data or gender psychology. Suppose the females were half as fast as males for all events - give or take a little for individual data. Suppose males swim the first 3 legs in about 100 seconds each and the last leg in about 50 seconds - give or take a little for individual data. Would you even consider placing a male in the last leg based on individual data? Of course not.


PairTheBoard
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianTheMick2
I'm apparently missing something. What benefit is gained over the far simpler and far more accurate method of using the individual data?
Evidently your method can be improved upon in the mixed 4x400 freestyle relay. According to your method it shouldn't matter which order you swim the males/females as long as they are the fastest two male and female swimmers. But statistics show that swimming the females last is better due to psychological factors.

In the extreme example I gave above I'm not saying there's a better solution than the one you'd get using your method. I am saying it's worth knowing that in this extreme case the solution is automatic and obvious, requiring no such calculations. And if someone swam a male in the last leg claiming to have used your method it would be clear they had made some kind of mistake.

Similarly, I'm saying it would be worth knowing if the actual mixed 4x400 medley has such an overpowering automatic best order. It looks like that's not the case. The built in advantage looks on the order of about 1 second. If that can be overcome then your method would show it. However, even then the statistical psychological advantage to swimming females last as mentioned above might overrule the solution using your method. Note the fact that only the U.S. swam a male in the last leg.



PairTheBoard
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08-01-2021 , 07:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PairTheBoard
Evidently your method can be improved upon in the mixed 4x400 freestyle relay. According to your method it shouldn't matter which order you swim the males/females as long as they are the fastest two male and female swimmers. But statistics show that swimming the females last is better due to psychological factors.
My method had nothing to do with a non-medley event.


Quote:

In the extreme example I gave above I'm not saying there's a better solution than the one you'd get using your method. I am saying it's worth knowing that in this extreme case the solution is automatic and obvious, requiring no such calculations. And if someone swam a male in the last leg claiming to have used your method it would be clear they had made some kind of mistake.
You are cheating. To know what you are saying is "worth knowing" you have to have all the data to calculate and do the calculations.

I'm presuming that in medley events that you don't get to pick the order of strokes. If you do, and there are indeed some factors that matter for that, you still pick the smallest sum of times that satisfy the constraints of the competition


Quote:

Similarly, I'm saying it would be worth knowing if the actual mixed 4x400 medley has such an overpowering automatic best order. It looks like that's not the case. The built in advantage looks on the order of about 1 second. If that can be overcome then your method would show it. However, even then the statistical psychological advantage to swimming females last as mentioned above might overrule the solution using your method. Note the fact that only the U.S. swam a male in the last leg.
My method would clearly not show such a thing, as it ignores it completely.

I have a feeling that you would mostly come up with the same answer for most teams that I would*, but my method would have fewer errors. For instance, Iceland (if they had two more swimmers) would be correct (have no choice but to) put a man in for the breaststroke and a woman for freestyle regardless of your method's results.

Also, I doubt it (if it is indeed an effect that isn't simply due to differences in the size of male/female time disparities for each stroke) is psychological factors. To show that, you'd need quite a bit of data to rule out other factors. Swimming in calm water, riding the wake of another swimmer, passing the wake of another swimmer, and a bunch of other swim-related stuff that I know even less about. You'd also need a robust method for removal of data for instances of lost-cause, etc.

*For the same reason as both methods would come up with the same answer if you were considering a mixed medley for pissing for aim, pissing for distance, chugging a beer and doing push-ups.
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08-01-2021 , 08:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PairTheBoard
I just watched the Olympics swimming event, Mixed 4x100m Medley Relay. They swim back stroke, breast stroke, butterfly, and free style 100m legs. Each team swims 2 women and 2 men and can put them in any legs they want. Amazingly, not every team mixed the women and men the same way. There should be no question which man-woman mix is optimum. My guess is to swim the women in the fastest styles, certainly the free style and I'm guessing the back stroke. Intuitively, the women should tend to swim each style about the same percent slower than the men. So they lose the least absolute time in the fastest styles. When I learned the U.S.A. was swimming their biggest star, a man, as the anchor in the free style I predicted they wouldn't have a chance. Every other team swam a woman in the free style leg. Pretty dumb imo. The U.S. didn't medal.




PairTheBoard

I retract the bolded. I was wrong to jump to that conclusion. And the team had bad luck with the butterfly swimmer losing her goggles.


PairTheBoard
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08-01-2021 , 11:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianTheMick2
Swimming in calm water, riding the wake of another swimmer, passing the wake of another swimmer, and a bunch of other swim-related stuff
I believe the article NextCard linked to mentioned those things as factors. It also mentioned a gender difference in performance between racing from behind or with a lead.


PairTheBoard
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08-02-2021 , 10:59 AM
I won £107 on the Lotto! Rolldown prize!

https://www.national-lottery.co.uk/r...breakdown/2668
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08-02-2021 , 01:31 PM



PairTheBoard
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08-02-2021 , 01:54 PM
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08-02-2021 , 11:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by lastcardcharlie
I won £107 on the Lotto! Rolldown prize!

https://www.national-lottery.co.uk/r...breakdown/2668
Don’t misinterpret this; God still hates you.
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08-02-2021 , 11:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PairTheBoard



PairTheBoard
I know this Whore to be a vivacious lying Bit*h.
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08-03-2021 , 01:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrianTheMick2
Is the economy that bad there? Being stranded is usually free, or at least quite inexpensive. Ample bridges to sleep under and dumpsters offer free food, even in Eurolandia, from what I've heard.
I am in Dublin airport bar now. My flight leaves in an hour.
I went through security. Netherlands doesn't require proof of negative test or vaccine for the Irish.

Don't be fooled by the display put on by Denmark and, actually by the Netherlands for the Euros. But yes. I will be quarantining by the canals if i test positive in an attempt to get home.
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08-03-2021 , 01:27 PM
I get it, Netherlands = Amsterdam.

Bon voyage, Mac.
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08-03-2021 , 04:13 PM
Amsterdam is a fun city, been there done that! Enjoy and don’t hold back. Life is short!
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08-03-2021 , 04:22 PM
I just touched down in Schipol. There's a good vibe in the air. Breezed through security. I take my negativity back. The public transport system is to die for. I ain't getting fleeced by a taxi. This time I know a little more. I'm getting that 4e train. You don't have to pay, but you do it to be good. This place takes away your cynicism. It restores some faith.
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08-04-2021 , 05:04 PM
Safe route.

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08-04-2021 , 08:39 PM
My God. I cannot put into words how beautiful this place is. I even tried a 360 video and it didn't capture the awe. You can imagine any imperialist nation and I would say none got left with a better deal than these guys.

It's intetesting then what went into designing NYC and the parallels there. But whatever, enjoy. Don't get high on your supply of fortune cookies.
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08-11-2021 , 05:58 PM
Life in the fast lane.
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08-14-2021 , 11:53 AM
A co-main event implies there is another co-main event. But only one event gets announced as the co-main event. The main event gets announced as the main event.


PairTheBoard
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08-14-2021 , 05:42 PM
I have just realised now that we are moving onto kids, that the vaccine rollout is rather like Nick Bostrom's paperclip maximizer thought experiment. So far it's leaving me alone, and behaving ammoral. However, does it come back for me when people stop presenting themselves.

Clearly its only goal is to vaccinate humans, but it appears to be becoming more powerful.
I think i may have to fight it, even if i wanted the vaccine.
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08-14-2021 , 05:53 PM
This is also the first time I feel like my govt can't be trusted exactly.
I feel like how Americans feel like, but without the guns.
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08-14-2021 , 06:01 PM
This above all: to thine own self be true.
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08-14-2021 , 06:13 PM
Whenever there is any doubt, there is no doubt.
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08-14-2021 , 06:16 PM
Speaking of kids. Lolita is a good movie. I saw it for the first time yesterday. I wouldn't recommended if it was merely taboo.
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08-15-2021 , 01:16 PM
Greg Holden - I Need An Energy (Chasing Mavericks Soundtrack)



PairTheBoard
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08-17-2021 , 06:03 PM
Know_thyself

From above link:

The Ancient Greek aphorism "know thyself" is one of the Delphic maxims and was the first of three maxims inscribed in the pronaos (forecourt) of the Temple of Apollo at Delphi according to the Greek writer Pausanias. The two maxims that followed "know thyself" were "nothing to excess" and "surety brings ruin".
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08-20-2021 , 04:14 PM
It is Friday- head out to your nearest drinking establishment and imbibe till all your cash is gone. Enjoy!
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