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Science, Math, and Philosophy Discussions regarding science, math, and/or philosophy.

View Poll Results: How would you want to go if the world had to end?
Zombie apocalypse 20 18.02%
Meteor collides into the earth 30 27.03%
Alien invasion 58 52.25%
Nuclear disaster, either from war or accident 3 2.70%
Voters: 111. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 03-30-2010, 02:22 PM   #51
donniccolo
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

^^^^^ 11,111
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Old 03-30-2010, 05:44 PM   #52
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

in Narnia they believed that the moon landing had been faked.
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Old 03-30-2010, 06:40 PM   #53
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by donniccolo View Post
^^^^^ 11,111
I think it's something to do with getting Nelsoned.
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Old 03-30-2010, 07:02 PM   #54
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

I agree that discussion of cold fusion and discussion of whether the moon landing was a hoax seem qualitatively different. The latter belongs in a thread about zombies and crop circles, but the former can at least be discussed, more than trivially, in a scientific way.
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Old 03-30-2010, 08:35 PM   #55
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by vhawk01 View Post
True story:

I really like zombies. I like books about zombies, zombie movies, you name it. For some reason, they are just the most interesting and badass of all the classic horror villains, imo. I dont want to hear your vampire nonsense, vampires are just basically emo zombies. I particularly enjoy the recent trend in the zombie genre of playing up the viral, medical possibilities of zombies, based in some part probably on Haitian "zombies" and other medical oddities. With this in mind, while on my neurology rotation last year, me and a like-minded classmate spent probably a good 4 hours each day, for 2 weeks, discussing the medical intricacies and minutae of zombies. We would pimp our residents on zombie questions, we would present patients in the morning as "Not presently showing signs of zombification" and we would discuss the steps the hospital was prepared to take in the event of (inevitable in our opinion) zombie uprising and epidemic.

This was probably more amusing to the two of us than to those around us, but as we were not officially disciplined, we continued to build up steam. Now, a quick aside is in order: the logistics of medical services are essentially this. At the bottom you have between 1 and 3 third year medical students (M3s). Above them you have an optional M4. Above that is the residents, from intern (PGY1) to the chief of the service (PGY3 to PGY5). Above that you will have an attending who is ultimately responsible for the decisions the team makes, but who in general plays more of an advisory role. He is somewhat responsible for educating the M3, but as you can see in the hierarchy, we are enough steps below him that interaction is generally minimal. In rare instances you are able to build a rapport though, and this was just such an attending. After a week or so of this zombie discussion, we finally decided to broach the subject with him. But we, perhaps unwisely, didnt exactly build up to it. He made the mistake of asking us if we had any questions or anything we wanted to learn about, so I asked him, absolutely deadpan, "Dr. XXXXXX....do you think that zombism crosses the placental barrier? I mean, some viruses are capable, but I wasnt able to find any reliable literature on the subject, so I was just wondering." To his credit (as an educator, if not as an expert on zombies) he paused, considered, and responded "Female zombies are sterile, they cannot get pregnant." Well, the first and really only rule of med student rounds is that you do not, under any circumstances, correct the attending, no matter how obviously wrong he is. So, my classmate and I accepted this answer and continued on with rounds.

Moral of the story: Can you believe they grant medical licenses to people who dont even realize that you get pregnant FIRST, and are then BITTEN by a zombie, and thus it is ABSOLUTELY potentially a concern whether zombism crosses the placental barrier?
This reminds me of an npr halloween story on some psychiatrist's theory of the zombie brain. Docs with keys to the medicine cabinet imo.
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Old 03-31-2010, 02:22 AM   #56
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

Smithsonian article on crop circle hoax:

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/arts-c...-the-Hoax.html


Wikipedia article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crop_circle


But then there is a conference for those with an open mind:

http://www.earthspiritconferences.co...hopsApr10.html

From the conference link:




Michael Glickman & Karen Alexander
CROP CIRCLES: NUMBER, GEOMETRY & PHILOSOPHY

Geometry, number and proportion are the language with which the crop circles have chosen to open their conversation with us. To understand basic geometrical form is to begin to speak the language of the circles and to commence the work of unraveling their meaning. This hands-on workshop will show you how to set about drawing the crop circles and how to begin to understand the implications of their number, form and proportion.

Drawing a simple circle and other basic geometric shapes can itself be a point of entry into mystical and transcendental experience. For many, this is the first step towards an understanding of the nature and origin of the material world and its implicit structure.

Michael Glickman & Karen Alexander will lead you through a series of geometric forms and discuss their appearance in crop circle designs over many years. They will set you on a path, that should you continue, promises many revelations about not just the crop circles but about the entirety of creation. They will discuss number, philosophy and fundamental questions such as the nature of form. This amazing opportunity to work firsthand with two veteran researchers should not be missed.



Dr. Jude Currivan
In-To-Great!


As we approach 2012, our greatest opportunity is to integrate all aspects of ourselves into an empowered wholeness that enables us to embody our highest purpose. In this experiential, inspirational workshop with cosmologist and planetary healer Dr Jude Currivan you will energetically connect with your Higher Self through the universal heart of the 8th chakra to experience accessible, practical and above all achievable ways to attune to your highest guidance for insight and healing at the deepest level. And in so doing to In-To-Great your heart, mind and purpose and awaken and embody the divine awareness that is your heritage and destiny.




Zacciah Blackburn
The Grand Star Tetrahedron of New England: Sacred Lakes, Sacred Mountains; Activating the Personal and Planetary MerKaBa


Geometric templates of the Divine Union of Heaven and Earth compose all life forms, as all life arises in harmony to Divine Proportions. New England has a unique landscape composed of 3 major mountains and lakes forming a nearly perfect Star Tetrahedron, the geometric representation of the Divine Union within All Life This same relationship is perceived within the human form, and critical to activation of one's personal MerKaBa, an aspect of our light body of consciousness. We will learn about and activate our personal MerKaBa, enter relationship with creative forces working with esoteric understandings of its principals, and seek to establish right relationship with these elements of the Earth where we live. Entering Right Relationship with the Earth is seen as paramount to our coming into our power as Co-creators.

************************************************** ***************

-Zeno, Into the Mystic
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Old 04-01-2010, 10:48 AM   #57
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

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Old 04-03-2010, 02:36 PM   #58
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by vhawk01 View Post
Moral of the story: Can you believe they grant medical licenses to people who dont even realize that you get pregnant FIRST, and are then BITTEN by a zombie, and thus it is ABSOLUTELY potentially a concern whether zombism crosses the placental barrier?
But doesn't zombification occur in all the dead tissue simultaneously, including the fetus? I ain't no doc and I don't know nuthin bout no zombies, but I'm just sayin.
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Old 04-03-2010, 02:40 PM   #59
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by bluesbassman View Post
But doesn't zombification occur in all the dead tissue simultaneously, including the fetus? I ain't no doc and I don't know nuthin bout no zombies, but I'm just sayin.
Makes sense to me.
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Old 04-03-2010, 06:10 PM   #60
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by bluesbassman View Post
But doesn't zombification occur in all the dead tissue simultaneously, including the fetus? I ain't no doc and I don't know nuthin bout no zombies, but I'm just sayin.
But the fetus isn't dead the instant the mother is necessarily right?
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Old 04-03-2010, 10:31 PM   #61
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by bluesbassman View Post
But doesn't zombification occur in all the dead tissue simultaneously, including the fetus? I ain't no doc and I don't know nuthin bout no zombies, but I'm just sayin.
lol, no, how would that work, magic? GTFO, this is the fringe topics thread, not the absolutely ridiculous crap you just made up thread. Various tissues have differing rates at which the zombie virus penetrates, fatty tissue being relatively hydrophobic is the last to be saturated with virus. Now, CLEARLY the virus is capable of crossing the blood brain barrier, which would be good circumstantial evidence that it would indeed cross the placental barrier, but the two barriers are not identical and it is conceivable that it could cross the former and not the latter.

But no, zombie virus most certainly does not just magically occur in all tissues simultaneously.
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Old 04-03-2010, 10:37 PM   #62
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by vhawk01 View Post
lol, no, how would that work, magic? GTFO, this is the fringe topics thread, not the absolutely ridiculous crap you just made up thread. Various tissues have differing rates at which the zombie virus penetrates, fatty tissue being relatively hydrophobic is the last to be saturated with virus. Now, CLEARLY the virus is capable of crossing the blood brain barrier, which would be good circumstantial evidence that it would indeed cross the placental barrier, but the two barriers are not identical and it is conceivable that it could cross the former and not the latter.

But no, zombie virus most certainly does not just magically occur in all tissues simultaneously.
Only a few viruses do this; you may have hit on a key for categorizing and maybe even isolating the zombification virus.
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Old 04-03-2010, 11:36 PM   #63
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by vhawk01 View Post
Various tissues have differing rates at which the zombie virus penetrates, fatty tissue being relatively hydrophobic is the last to be saturated with virus. Now, CLEARLY the virus is capable of crossing the blood brain barrier, which would be good circumstantial evidence that it would indeed cross the placental barrier, but the two barriers are not identical and it is conceivable that it could cross the former and not the latter.
This study: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...80c2bdb2f465a0

suggests that lipid-solubility is positively correlated with both crossing the BBB and the placental barrier. So I would say that your theory is consistent with current (well, 1989) literature (at least the first link that google gave me).

EDIT: No, wait, I confuse myself sometimes. Hydrophobic and lipid-soluble are not opposites. Therefore, if the virus easily penetrates the BBB, then it would be expected to quickly infect adipose tissue, which is not what you claimed. However, what you did correctly guess is that a substance's ability to cross the BBB is positively correlated with its ability to cross the placental barrier.

Last edited by ganstaman; 04-03-2010 at 11:39 PM. Reason: reading :(
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Old 04-03-2010, 11:39 PM   #64
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

They dont call me "the leading expert on zombie pathophysiology on the East Coast that is currently in medical school" for nothing, folks.
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Old 04-04-2010, 12:47 AM   #65
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by ganstaman View Post
This study: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...80c2bdb2f465a0

suggests that lipid-solubility is positively correlated with both crossing the BBB and the placental barrier. So I would say that your theory is consistent with current (well, 1989) literature (at least the first link that google gave me).

EDIT: No, wait, I confuse myself sometimes. Hydrophobic and lipid-soluble are not opposites. Therefore, if the virus easily penetrates the BBB, then it would be expected to quickly infect adipose tissue, which is not what you claimed. However, what you did correctly guess is that a substance's ability to cross the BBB is positively correlated with its ability to cross the placental barrier.
The study is about drugs' ability to cross the blood/brain and placental barrier there, it is to be expected the lipid solubility would be positively correlated with ability to cross, as at least some of the crossing is via diffusion though the membrane. But in the case of viruses that's not how it usually works. Facilitated transport can be very tissue specific. Accordingly, there need be no particular similarity between infection of the fetus and of adipose tissue.
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Old 04-04-2010, 01:14 AM   #66
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by donniccolo View Post
ps: a Neutron walks into a bar, ask how much for a drink, bartender says, "for you, no charge" ooh

(sorry saw on a tv show and had to laugh)
Why did the chicken cross the mobius strip?

Spoiler:
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Old 04-04-2010, 01:24 AM   #67
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

VHawk, have you read this groundbreaking paper on zombie outbreaks

http://www.mathstat.uottawa.ca/~rsmith/Zombies.pdf
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Old 04-05-2010, 03:47 AM   #68
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

A quick review of the SMP front page threads suggests that the goal of confining the forum's crap to this thread is not being realized.
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Old 04-05-2010, 04:06 AM   #69
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

Yeah, but you can't put things like
"which came first, the chicken or the egg"
or
"if a tree falls in a forest and no one's around..."
or
"where is my flying car already?"
or
"when will technological singularity come?"
in a fringe topics thread since some of them are as old as dirt (literally, I think, depending on the soil).
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Old 04-05-2010, 05:44 AM   #70
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

Maybe calling it fringe topics is the problem. You're right, chicken and egg isn't fringe, it's mainstream, but it still belongs somewhere, preferably somewhere easy to ignore.
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Old 04-05-2010, 01:49 PM   #71
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

preferably under the rug
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Old 04-05-2010, 08:02 PM   #72
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Douper View Post
Why did the chicken cross the mobius strip?

Spoiler:
touche!

i'm going to quit my job as a Geologist because...

Spoiler:
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Old 04-06-2010, 07:28 PM   #73
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

Had this response to a post by atakdog in another thread, but figured this would be a better venue because we've touched on the topic here already.

Basically, his post was, "this thread is retarded, why are you all posting in it," a completely reasonable response to the thread. My response:

The lack of genuinely good threads to participate in. Feel free to add better content, atakdog. Until someone does, the troll/dumb threads are going to continue to pop to the top as posters have nothing better to respond to. If you want the forum to shift back to being SMP and not "BBV/uNL asks dumb questions", we will need actually good threads started that ask difficult questions and foster complex discussion that "dumb questioners" will not involve themselves in (or perhaps risk exclusion from the forum for dicking up good threads).

Maybe the forum could used planned threads to avoid this conundrum. Every week a hand-picked (by Zeno?) reg could come up with a topic and post a good OP on it. For instance, a 500 word OP setting up a critical discussion on, say, the flaws/stengths in XYZ philosopher's position would create such a fertile setting, and could last longer than just a week. Other topics might just revolve around the latest TED offerings, general theories in softer sciences like sociology (God forbid), or recent breakthroughs in hard science theory, or whatever you like. Subjects that experts and serious laypersons could both involve themselves in, and which will be suitable for many interesting tangents of thought that might lead into completely new thread ideas.

Or, we continue to be barraged by nothing but garbage, and the forum steadily goes downhill. Personally, I try to make the best of what I'm given, but I suppose that might be contributing to this trend since many of these threads deserve nothing but general dismissal and non-involvement.
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Old 04-06-2010, 07:43 PM   #74
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

A good point. Not completely sure it's worth the effort — in a perfect world this would all happen spontaneously, and forced discussions have a way of feeling... forced — but it's worth keeping in mind both that posting good content, particularly good thread starts, improves things by giving the thoughtful people something to occupy themselves, and that treating silly questions seriously probably has the opposite effect. And if anyone wants to take a more structured approach it would probably help.
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Old 04-07-2010, 12:52 AM   #75
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Re: Official Fringe Topics Thread

Yeh, hard to get that properly organized, but the forum needs to be seeded with better OPs.

Do my best to stop responding to idiotic OPs.
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