Tribute Thread to Messi: the GOAT (and tax cheat) - Page 9 - Sporting Events and Fantasy Sports

With all the Anti barca bias on this forum I'm pleasantly surprised at how many can put that aside and see things clearly. I thought this thread would be filled with even more clowns like bigtk or w.e. And I would be one of the few arguing for him. I'm glad that did not end up being the case and most ppl are doing the arguing for me.

Ftr I agree with raz/I think the majority. Not currently goat at 24 obv, put clearly on pace for goat status by the end of hs career.

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01-10-2012 , 03:51 PM

#202

Ambush

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Quote:

Originally Posted by clowntable

For his entire career I think it's Beckenbauer. Revolutionised the game, three "CL" wins in a row, bunch of other titles, World Cup win as player and coach, fundamental in building a dominant team as a president.

Just as a player it's Messi already for me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by clowntable

I'm aware there are some homer issues but I'm not a huge Bayern fan and wasn't born during his goat time (obviously makes it hard to get a good read on his play etc). Only thing I remember is the WC win 1990.

I'm open to other suggestions, I explicitly pointed out over the entire career not just as a player.

Spoiler:

Maybe Messi will win two world cups, and become a great manager too to kill off this entire boring debate for all eternity.

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01-10-2012 , 03:53 PM

#203

ThaSaltCracka

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Originally Posted by clowntable

I think the WC has more name recognition and is more entertaining to watch (obviously more games, shorter time span, people are overinvested in their country, fun underdogs etc.) but the CL has higher quality teams.

Yeah agree with this.

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01-10-2012 , 04:18 PM

#204

clowntable

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Ambush that's pretty much the one other guy I had in mind. I think Beckenbauer has the slight edge though.

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01-10-2012 , 04:31 PM

#205

Ambush

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I guess that depends somewhat on how much credits for Barcelona's playing style and youth academy (and transfer policy?) should actually go to Cruijff.

But seeing as I'm Dutch and you're German, I'm guessing this won't go anywhere without some help : P

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01-10-2012 , 04:43 PM

#206

Bigindiemen

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Cruijff is clearly the GOAT football person (not necessarily player).

He can be held responsible for >90% of the success Ajax has had since 1970 and for a decent % to Barca's current successes. Also really the creator of the 4-3-3 system which most teams play now a days.

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01-10-2012 , 05:03 PM

#207

daca

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Originally Posted by kevin21

Where would you guys say Ronaldo reached his peak?

96/97 season.

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01-10-2012 , 05:09 PM

#208

BRpokah

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Some of you dont realise that the medium euro teams(denmark,ireland,greece,norway etc) are horrible. I d take a Bolivia, Japan,SK,Australia,Cameroon over them every time

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01-10-2012 , 05:10 PM

#209

Bigindiemen

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Denmark is actually pretty good right now. Other than that, true yes

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01-10-2012 , 05:45 PM

#210

Fonkey123

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Originally Posted by illini43

If Messi is replaced by Bojan Krkic or Eidur Gudjohnsen on those Barca teams, do they still win the CL?

Xavi is a top 5 player in the world (imo). I know stats aren't everything, they play different positions and roles, and Xavi is older than Messi but:

Over all competitions

Xavi:

08/09 - 16 G, 34 A
09/10 - 6 G, 19 A
10/11 - 5 G, 14 A
11/12 - 10 G, 9 A

Messi:

08/09 - 42 G, 18 A
09/10 - 49 G, 11 A
10/11 - 51 G, 22 A
11/12 - 33 G, 17 A

Messi > Xavi, but Barca probably does not win all those titles without both of them

Comparing goals and assists between an inside forward and a deep lying playmaker is SOOO lol. (yes I understand this season their shape has been so fluid xavi has ended up being really far forward occasionally)

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01-10-2012 , 05:48 PM

#211

JWright777

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Quote:

Originally Posted by BRpokah

Some of you dont realise that the medium euro teams(denmark,ireland,greece,norway etc) are horrible. I d take a Bolivia, Japan,SK,Australia,Cameroon over them every time

Nope.jpg

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01-10-2012 , 05:50 PM

#212

Amru

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One good thing about Messi that no one has mentioned is his attitude. He (generally) doesn't dive, complain, feign injury etc.

I think that Barcelona's tactics could be countered much more easily without Messi. The way he helps the team convert possession to goals is vital.

For anyone with 11 minutes to spare:

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01-10-2012 , 05:55 PM

#213

aoFrantic

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Quote:

Originally Posted by BRpokah

Some of you dont realise that the medium euro teams(denmark,ireland,greece,norway etc) are horrible. I d take a Bolivia, Japan,SK,Australia,Cameroon over them every time

Denmark won their group in Euros, Cameroon failed to qualify for the ACN.

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01-10-2012 , 05:57 PM

#214

BRpokah

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Nevermind

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01-10-2012 , 05:57 PM

#215

kevin21

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Quote:

Originally Posted by BRpokah

Some of you dont realise that the medium euro teams(denmark,ireland,greece,norway etc) are horrible. I d take a Bolivia, Japan,SK,Australia,Cameroon over them every time

Japan - SK - Australia really do get tested against those Asian sides in qualifying, SK and Aust have both peaked in previous years and are now on the decline. Cameroon can't even qualify for the ACOF for God's sake. Bolivia, don't they rely on altitude to be competitive?

Im taking the European teams.

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01-10-2012 , 07:09 PM

#216

clowntable

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Euros are tougher than World Cup imo. Mostly because Argentina, USA and Mexico are always overrated. Then there's the meh-Asian teams.
Brazil hasn't been legit either recently, the other SA teams (Uruguay, Chile) have been a bit stronger.

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01-10-2012 , 07:15 PM

#217

Ambush

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Brazil was legit in 2010 imo, just very unbrazilian. They played a very, very good 1st half against us... and then they imploded ^^

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01-10-2012 , 07:21 PM

#218

Bloop

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For what it's worth: Denmark won the EC in 1992, Greece did it in 2004.

Back in 1992 the final stage was only 8 teams in two groups.

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01-10-2012 , 08:02 PM

#219

BRpokah

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Lol clowntable Brazil dominated the WC from 94-02 and from 03-10 won everything except for wc's(both CA,both confed cup, both SA qualifiers).

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01-10-2012 , 08:03 PM

#220

kevin21

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2010 was the first time I'd ever went into a World Cup where I didn't give Brazil a chance of winning it. Laying them and England was just free money.

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01-10-2012 , 08:04 PM

#221

DiegoArmando

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Messi does not and will never have a religion devoted to him.

He doesn't do enough for Argentina. It remains to be seen if he will singlehandedly win a world cup for them. The chances of that, imo, are somewhere around 0.5.

The problem with Messi hype is that it fails to take into account the fact he plays in a team where every player is dangerous. When you look at his achievements with Argentina, though, you soon see that he has a long way to go before being considered alongside Maradona.