Tribute Thread to Messi: the GOAT (and tax cheat) - Page 8 - Sporting Events and Fantasy Sports

Messi is an incredible talent, but overated because of the team he is on. Iniesta, Fabregas and Xavi constantly setting him with perfect balls, Villa and others on the team so the defence can't focus on Messi too heavily. He also plays in a system that is perfectly suited toward his talents. He is not the greatest of all time, and it is doubtful that he is currently the best player in the world, maybe even on his own team (Iniesta). Top 5 player in the world playing with a bunch of superstars in a system perfectly suited toward their talents can make them look like the GOAT, but appearances can be deceiving.

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01-10-2012 , 11:54 AM

#177

clowntable

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For his entire career I think it's Beckenbauer. Revolutionised the game, three "CL" wins in a row, bunch of other titles, World Cup win as player and coach, fundamental in building a dominant team as a president.

Just as a player it's Messi already for me.

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01-10-2012 , 11:54 AM

#178

72off

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Originally Posted by ClarkNasty

Brilliant analogy.

thanks!

but holding the no WC thing against Messi is almost as stupid. maybe not all the way there, but pretty close. it's probably a lot closer than you think, actually. (ok Dirk is def going too far, but the others aren't that bad really)

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01-10-2012 , 12:34 PM

#179

BlackStar9

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I've not actually heard a credible argument as to why Messi is better than R9. Other than fickle fanboys with short memories.

You could even argue Marco Van Basten deserves a place up there. Don't get me wrong Messi is majestic, but id rather have R9

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01-10-2012 , 12:40 PM

#180

Zaid_Ahmed

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Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackStar9

Ronaldo is the greatest because he never reached his peak

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01-10-2012 , 12:42 PM

#181

sethypooh21

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Ra_Z_Boy

Comparisons across eras should always be relative to their era not absolute.

Only if you want the discussion to be in any way interesting.

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01-10-2012 , 12:49 PM

#182

Ra_Z_Boy

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Originally Posted by clowntable

Are you the one on the right or the left?

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01-10-2012 , 12:52 PM

#183

Victor

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http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/st...-messi?cc=5901

cliffs: NEYMAR GOAT

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01-10-2012 , 01:02 PM

#184

Ra_Z_Boy

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You mean potential GOAT

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01-10-2012 , 01:12 PM

#185

DeadCellKid

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Zaid_Ahmed

Ronaldo is the greatest because he never reached his peak

Huh?

And LOL system post that's been quoted thus far.. Every GREAT player was in a system that was built around them for them to succeed and they were showcased because of it.

Kobe - Triangle Offense
MJ - GOAT - But Pippen/Rodman/Kukoch/Armstrong etc etc

Brady - Moss/Welker/GOAT TE

---

Messi's individual talent is far superior than 99.999% of soccer players ever to step foot on the pitch.. ever.

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01-10-2012 , 01:13 PM

#186

BASaint

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wc >> cl

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01-10-2012 , 01:16 PM

#187

kevin21

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In terms of what?

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01-10-2012 , 01:27 PM

#188

BASaint

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popularity, prestige, legacy, importance, everything

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01-10-2012 , 01:28 PM

#189

kevin21

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quality?

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01-10-2012 , 01:36 PM

#190

Fallen Hero

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that post got too much hate, Messi could be the best player in the world or even the GOAT and still be overrated (as an example: Jordan). And it's true that he's in a perfect system for his style and that he could potentially struggle in the Premier League. He already, relatively, struggles playing for Argentina.

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01-10-2012 , 01:36 PM

#191

BASaint

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probably not in most cases these days thanks to greater concentration of talent at club level, but doesnt matter wrt GOAT status. a WC win looks better on a footballers CV than a CL win.

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01-10-2012 , 01:50 PM

#192

kevin21

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Of course

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01-10-2012 , 01:55 PM

#193

TrifeForLife

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Messi playing in club filled with currently wc/ec holders. (maybe sounds like poor argument, but you should still consider it)

Then think about Maradona and Napoli f.e.

El fenomeno had tremendous career despite everything.

Zizou.

Etc.

imo

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01-10-2012 , 02:02 PM

#194

ThaSaltCracka

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Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackStar9

Well his peak will be longer, that is for sure, but yeah ronaldo's peak is insane, albeit somewhat short.

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01-10-2012 , 02:03 PM

#195

ThaSaltCracka

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Well barca would beat Spain.....

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01-10-2012 , 02:04 PM

#196

kevin21

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Where would you guys say Ronaldo reached his peak?

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01-10-2012 , 02:50 PM

#197

TrifeForLife

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If you mean fenomeno, 02/03.

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01-10-2012 , 03:10 PM

#198

clowntable

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Ra_Z_Boy

Are you the one on the right or the left?

I'm aware there are some homer issues but I'm not a huge Bayern fan and wasn't born during his goat time (obviously makes it hard to get a good read on his play etc). Only thing I remember is the WC win 1990.

I'm open to other suggestions, I explicitly pointed out over the entire career not just as a player.

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01-10-2012 , 03:12 PM

#199

Zaid_Ahmed

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Originally Posted by kevin21

Where would you guys say Ronaldo reached his peak?

Should have been 1998-2002

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01-10-2012 , 03:24 PM

#200

clowntable

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I think the WC has more name recognition and is more entertaining to watch (obviously more games, shorter time span, people are overinvested in their country, fun underdogs etc.) but the CL has higher quality teams.

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