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Old 09-27-2010, 02:55 PM   #3626
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re: SE FAQ, Liveblog, Foodblog, and Forum Discussion

mjw,
I think that is an awful way to view forums and ties in with the earlier discussion with Bobbo about intellectual surety. The baseball and basketball analysis is correct much more often than football/hockey/soccer discussions that does not make the discussion better.
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Old 09-27-2010, 02:57 PM   #3627
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Originally Posted by mjw0586 View Post
I realize TUt went off the deep end a little with his posts, but you (and Pudge) are woefully wrong here. There's a huge difference between the baseball/basketball analysis and the football analysis on SE. It's largely due to limitations in football metrics and film not being available to us, but a lot of what TUt said is true.

The best analysis in TZ and the MLB threads comes not from regurgitating analysis but researching stats/metrics/whatever and applying them to what you see and the stats that a player accumulates. The application part is key. Iggy will tell you that if you just come into TZ and sort by PER, TS, whatever, that you're going to get laughed at. The problem isn't the metric/statistic, it's the application. Context and the process of applying statistics matter, and it's something that is present in NBA and MLB threads and totally lacking in NFL and CF threads.

There's a reason that the knowledgeable people in NBA and MLB threads have jobs in those leagues and the high profile posters in football consist of vixt, goldenbears, riverman, and mt2r.
I agree 100% with you.
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Old 09-27-2010, 02:57 PM   #3628
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Originally Posted by Pudge714 View Post
mjw,
I think that is an awful way to view forums and ties in with the earlier discussion with Bobbo about intellectual surety. The baseball and basketball analysis is correct much more often than football/hockey/soccer discussions that does not make the discussion better.
Well then according to this you should have no problem with me saying, Eli is underrated, Rivers is overrated, and the two are closer than most SE regs think.

I very rarely make definitive statements in NBA threads let alone in football threads.
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Old 09-27-2010, 02:58 PM   #3629
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Originally Posted by mjw0586 View Post

There's a reason that the knowledgeable people in NBA and MLB threads have jobs in those leagues and the high profile posters in football consist of vixt, goldenbears, riverman, and mt2r.
what baseball posters have jobs in MLB? Are there other NBA posters that do besides IH and kbfc?

just curious
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Old 09-27-2010, 02:58 PM   #3630
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Isn't one of the more prominent NBA affiliated posters, IrishHand, on record as saying that TZ posters usually fail to see the big picture constraints and limitations that real world front offices have to deal with? It seems like NBA posters have exactly the same problems as football posters in applying their knowledge of statistics, it's just that the nature of the game allows their statistics to be better
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Old 09-27-2010, 02:59 PM   #3631
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Originally Posted by Dudd View Post
Isn't one of the more prominent NBA affiliated posters, IrishHand, on record as saying that TZ posters usually fail to see the big picture constraints and limitations that real world front offices have to deal with?
This is true.
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Old 09-27-2010, 02:59 PM   #3632
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tut,
I disagree with it, but I have no problem with you saying it. If you want to post a more substantial argument that doesn't include obvious trolling by citing WIM go for it.
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Old 09-27-2010, 03:00 PM   #3633
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Originally Posted by MEbenhoe View Post
what baseball posters have jobs in MLB? Are there other NBA posters that do besides IH and kbfc?

just curious
iamawes.omer works for the rays, but he doesn't post very often anymore. given the state of the MLB thread, who could blame him?
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Old 09-27-2010, 03:01 PM   #3634
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Also, just in case a series of PM to everyone make it seem a certain way,

I have no problem with what Triumph, Pudge, F60, or Clark have said about me today. I take tons of little shots at Trudge all the time and I never say **** about F60 but if you make fun of his team he puts you on his Danny McGrath people to kill list.

Clark ,

I wish you would have told me sooner as I'd be interested in a PM of your esteemed armchair psychology that I've heard so much about.
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Old 09-27-2010, 03:01 PM   #3635
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what baseball posters have jobs in MLB? Are there other NBA posters that do besides IH and kbfc?

just curious
iamawesomer
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Old 09-27-2010, 03:02 PM   #3636
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There's a reason that the knowledgeable people in NBA and MLB threads have jobs in those leagues and the high profile posters in football consist of vixt, goldenbears, riverman, and mt2r.
oohhh sick burns
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Old 09-27-2010, 03:02 PM   #3637
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tut you are on the clock in the megadraft

Last edited by Pudge714; 09-27-2010 at 03:03 PM. Reason: also lol @ riverman being a knowledgeable football poster
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Old 09-27-2010, 03:03 PM   #3638
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Originally Posted by Dudd View Post
Isn't one of the more prominent NBA affiliated posters, IrishHand, on record as saying that TZ posters usually fail to see the big picture constraints and limitations that real world front offices have to deal with?
Yeah, but this only seems relevant when the discussion shifts to contracts and personnel moves. When it comes down to evaluating players and team performance this is less relevant. Its a good point though and it is applicable to every sport tbh.
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Old 09-27-2010, 03:03 PM   #3639
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tut,
I disagree with it, but I have no problem with you saying it. If you want to post a more substantial argument that doesn't include obvious trolling by citing WIM go for it.
My problem is, when I've done some research to back it up, I find a bunch of stats/blogs that I find relatively meaningless, so instead of arguing dumb stats with others who are ready to throw them back at me, it's easier/more self-entertaining to post a picture of Eli holding up the Lombardy trophy.
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Old 09-27-2010, 03:05 PM   #3640
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Originally Posted by Dudd View Post
Isn't one of the more prominent NBA affiliated posters, IrishHand, on record as saying that TZ posters usually fail to see the big picture constraints and limitations that real world front offices have to deal with? It seems like NBA posters have exactly the same problems as football posters in applying their knowledge of statistics, it's just that the nature of the game allows their statistics to be better
well, ih has also said that actual basketball ability and economic value is often eschewed bc of interpersonal relationships. theres really no way any of us are gonna be aware that a guy who has great per minute stats is sent packing bc his mates hate him.

thats about the only interesting thing hes posted afair tho.
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Old 09-27-2010, 03:11 PM   #3641
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deleting posts is really the worst
I mean, I try to avoid bans/infractions/deleting as often as humanly possibly. But in some cases its necessary, its just part of it. I'm sorry that its not to your liking but it has to be done sometimes.
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Old 09-27-2010, 03:12 PM   #3642
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this thread needs less bitching and more real talk imo.
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Old 09-27-2010, 03:12 PM   #3643
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you guys are all awesome, dont stop doin you
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Old 09-27-2010, 03:13 PM   #3644
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mjw, I wasn't taking a dig at tz experts, I was taking a dig at TuT. All of your comments are defending tz/MLB analysis on 2p2 when it wasn't what I getting at at all.

TuT,

Any dislike of your recent posting is 100% directed at your performance in the NFL threads. Any other theories are woefully wrong.
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Old 09-27-2010, 03:13 PM   #3645
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this thread needs less bitching and more real talk imo.
+1
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Old 09-27-2010, 03:14 PM   #3646
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mjw, I wasn't taking a dig at tz experts, I was taking a dig at TuT. All of your comments are defending tz/MLB analysis on 2p2 when it wasn't what I getting at at all.
Well then you were wrong about TuT's TZ posting imo.
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Old 09-27-2010, 03:17 PM   #3647
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Originally Posted by Triumph36 View Post
nope. bob.bo doesn't wander into any threads i read regularly. ka.r.ak doesn't really post outside the yankees thread, and he fell into harmless self-parody years ago.
:-(
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Old 09-27-2010, 03:21 PM   #3648
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:-(
but i you anyway
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Old 09-27-2010, 03:24 PM   #3649
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Well then you were wrong about TuT's TZ posting imo.
i don't care about his TZ posting because i don't read the TZ. it's a problem when non-TZ posters feel like they can dump on threads that aren't the TZ because they're not as 'advanced'.
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Old 09-27-2010, 03:25 PM   #3650
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Originally Posted by Needle77 View Post
I mean, I try to avoid bans/infractions/deleting as often as humanly possibly. But in some cases its necessary, its just part of it. I'm sorry that its not to your liking but it has to be done sometimes.
keep being awesome brother.
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