not sure if you are aware but I am NOT Kyle Kulinski. hope that helps.

Best case? Bunch of liberal justices. Federal min. wage raised and a public health care option that lowers the number of uninsured from ~35M to ~10M.

If that happens, hopefully the ideas of public healthcare continue to solidify similar to how protections to pre-existing conditions went from "huh?" to "untouchable for both republicans and democracts" in the 10 years since the ACA passed.

Thata about the elevator pitch I'd think.

America!

Who is the 2nd most popular lefty after Bernie and do you think they do a good job of speaking to POC+Women

You're right, we aren't on the same level. I'm on the one that understands what it takes for a bill to actually make it to the executive branch. M4all will NEVER fly until we not only flip the Senate by a decent margin, but gain more control of the house and stop SCOTUS from turning into a conservative circle-jerk.

Your guy and your movement has done absolutely jack squat to fufill any of the goals needed to pass such a divisive, yet as most of us agree here, necessary bill. Hell even an endorsement of a candidate on their side has been the kiss of death.

And keep thinking that progressives won't start leaning more right as they get older. You are absolutely right that there are some hardcore Talibern that will always be there, but there are A LOT of Bernie supporters that are more moderate than you think. It's always been that way, and it will continue to be in the future. Especially when this new leftist movement has the organizational skills of the Sacramento Kings. Hell they make Mondale's movement look light years ahead.

I'm sorry if I'd rather have 30 million people get healthcare instead of nothing, which is what Bernie or any progressive has been able to deliver despite endless good job, good effort cracks at it.

I'd argue that it's even more simple than that. For me it's about not having a malignant narcissist in power that is on the verge of causing irreparable damage to our country. Hell if it were just replacing RBJ, the T1 most left-leaning SC justice, with someone who's not a conservative that alone would be enough of a plan for me to get off my ass and vote for Biden.

People actually think Trump is no different than Biden, which is an absolutely idiotic point of view given what we've seen.

this is less than 1/2 of bernie's supporters. the rest are some combo of young people who are trying to be cool or contrarian or people who are down on their luck and are gravitating to the candidate who yells the most (fwiw, this group is why the #bluemaga that very online victor stole from Kyle Kulinski is so absurd - Bernie and Trump are the candidates that leverage the maga anger the most)

Imagine this being your perception of what’s going on here and passing it off like it’s a divine insight. You’re a smug happy goldfish bouncing your face off the glass while the world happens in a series of loud noises outside.

my perception on what's going on here is that a bunch of bros are trying to get trump re-elected because they're sore losers. however, i think they are in the half of the bernie (ex bernie?) supporters that are focused on the issues, so at least there's that

your perception seems mentally ******ed


no offense

i consider toxic bros coming at me as a badge of honor. no offense taken

I don't agree with vin's perception, except for ridicule from the bros being a compliment.

I think the far left, maybe 30-40% of Bernie voters, are very similar to Trumpers in that they consume media that has completely warped their perception of people in general, especially wrt politics. They have become so brainwashed that they have the same foils as 45ers (MSM, OBAMA!, Hillarat, CreepyJoe). They tend to think anyone who doesn't think as they do are dumb, and that every politician not representing their side is inherently evil. Like Trumpers, there is a level of toxicity there born of insecurity because imo they are tired of defending things about their side that are indefensible.

The other 60-70% are typical democratic pragmatists that want the same things as other centrists, only they feel more strongly about Bernie being able to get it done. Those are the ones that tend to swing to the right as they grow older and amass a family/retirement/property. Not all of them will become centrists or republicans, but a decent portion will. The 30/40% will call me an idiot for thinking this, but if anything it's happening more quickly than even I suspect, we only have to look at the 2016 to 2020 numbers and the ground lost to see that it could be occurring right now.

.

thats why the bros like trump. to them having strong conviction in your beliefs, ignoring all naunce, and never taking an L is better than being a beta cuck who has some inhibitions about m4a.

So like is it reservations about M4A or do we all secretly agree? I thought we all wanted the same things but the centrists are just 4d chessmating their way there by pretending to oppose it

some are for it, some are against it, some aren't sure. in the aggregate, they're way more amenable to the concept than the **** your feelings crowd

Think you’re way off base here re:Bernie voters. Biden has quite literally supported horrible policies responsible for many deaths in the past. The only reason he has moved “to the left” on certain issues is because of people like Bernie...if everyone was such a massive defeatist like you (or “pragmatist”) as you call it, we’d have never gotten that. So you can thank the “Bros” for that and shifting the lolDems to the left on certain issues.

Think you’re wrong on the last topic as well but that’s not really worth debating since it’s mainly an opinion on what other people will do.


I don’t even know what #bluemaga is but if it’s using that hashtag to point out that most Biden voters are basically Republicans/right wing it’s correct. There’s a reason why the status quo will settle for Biden, he’ll mostly keep things exactly as they are (bad for the majority of people). I’ll of course acknowledge there’s some loony Bernie supporters but that goes for any candidate. Perhaps the fringe Bros are some of the loudest and most annoying but you shouldn’t let that influence your opinion of Bernie himself after decades of being an awesome human being.


You’re acting as if it’s some insane feat to know how bills get passed and only seasoned veterans of politics can figure this out. We all have google and understand how these things work. You also make it sound like it’s a lock that Biden can get even these compromises done and will make lots of positive moves when it isn’t.

Bernie isn’t even “my guy”, he wasn’t even my first choice when the election cycle started (Warren was). However, Warren exposed herself as a massive fraud (it was actually her kiss of death to try and frame her campaign as less progressive) and Bernie was by far the best candidate remaining due to having the best policy and being the best all-around person. Therefore, I supported Bernie. When the next election cycle comes around I’ll again support the best candidate based on their policies. Again, just because you don’t have very strong principles and are OK voting for him then insta-flipping to Biden supporting and Bernie bashing doesn’t mean everyone is like that.

The reason why Bernie’s supporters feel so strongly about him is his refusal to be defeatist and compromise on life and death issues like you and others like you want him to. And that’s why some of them feel betrayed by him now supporting Biden and starting this task force, which is completely understandable (hilariously Bernie is still getting bashed itt despite him being “pragmatic”).


Thinking Trump = Biden is closer to the truth than Trump Supporters = Bernie Bros which is what you and other Biden stans are doing.

As for your first paragraph, that is a totally viable point of view and I would argue the correct one. If push comes to shove, you have to vote Biden over Trump - judges are a primary reason there but there are some others as well. I’ve said this before ITT, but there is an absolutely MASSIVE difference between sighing and doing that and the garbage that you are outputting. “Talibern”, memes about socialism body counts probably lifted from DJT Jr’s Instagram, and the relentless bashing of people for not wanting to compromise on very serious issues with personal meaning to them. Again, it’s very different from a Trump supporter despite your analogies. Bernie supporters at least are supporting policies that you agree with (I assume so since you voted for him), so identifying with them should be pretty easy. Instead you want to appeal to centrists and Republicans? Just truly bizarre stuff and honestly very confusing.

????
PROFIT

Thanks vini for being another data point in my no caps = ******ed theorem.

https://twitter.com/freedlander/stat...82921488867329

this tweet, which is a perfect demonstration of just how hilariously insane our president is, gets even more hilarious when you find out that huge swaths of young democrats are probably not going to vote for biden because he's "just the same" as trump

oh, and they love bragging about it! for internet cred!

keep scolding those strawmen ... i think it's really gonna work this time!

Thanks for doing the heavy lifting. Being "pragmatic" is 100% bullshit. This is only said by people who, as you said, don't have true caring for their principles and aren't really impacted by whether or not these changes happen. A lot of these issues are life and death for tons of people which is why it's such a heated topic.

It's just hilarious that someone can vote for every shitty war, play a huge part in allowing credit card companies to absolutely gouge desperate people and sign off on a ton of other horrible bills and it's just glossed over. However, we get to M4A and all of a sudden we're being skeptical and doing a deep dive? Get the **** out of here with that crap.

“if they’re not our principles, they’re not principles” - bros

Yes Biden has supported horrible policies, but so has Bernie. That's why I think arguing on past policy-voting is pointless. Should I admonish Bernie for his chummyness with the NRA throughout the course of his career? What about him backing a policy to bring F35's war machines to Vermont? I don't care, because I know there is a rational explanation for all this that isn't "he wants people to die". I think he made the deal with the NRA to get elected so he can make a difference, and supported the Military Industrial Complex to bring financial security to his constituents. There's a logical explanation to almost everything, and once we step back from our own bubbles, we start to see the forest from the trees. It's the same thing with Biden and the Patriot Act/Crime Bills, even the war. Hindsight is 20/20, but at the time the majority of Americans were in favor of the second Gulf War, and if anything Biden peeled back on that stance before most.

What's not debatable is Biden's co-chaired Violence Against Women act, which had a massive, massive affect on how we treat sex crimes today. I don't see the progressives even sniffing how revolutionary this bill was, only that it "wasn't enough" in the same way Obamacare wasn't, which while true is completely missing the point.

Bernie has great ideas, but when it comes to actually making a difference he has accomplished nothing in his career. Based on that alone some would say that Biden's "policy" is better, because he actually did something that made a difference.

There's nuance here that we just don't know. Hell it could have been as little as "it was going to pass either way and I didn't want XXXX to think I was against it for future leverage". (Bernie smartly did this early in his career).

Agreed. I do really like Bernie and think he would have made a good president. I can also understand why many did not, however.

I agree, but I wish his supporters would as well. Trump vs Biden is the very definition of a "life and death issue". And I think even you understand we aren't really bashing Bernie, we're making fun of the hypocrisy coming from the far left.

We really aren't doing that though. Nobody is saying Biden doesn't share similarities to Trump, hell most of us here could point them out. We are saying Berniebros share similarities to Trumpers, and giving examples as to why. This is actually a VERY common stance among the never-trumpers on both ends of the political spectrum. .

Turunabout is fair play. What you're seeing from us is ftmp reactionary. Bernibros never existed prior to the far left abusing people on the internet.

I'd like to do a comparison between my actions in life vs any of the Bros here to see who actually cares more.