Those are just plugs. I would assume both Clintons are personally acquainted with at least a few network execs.

They know they have a weak political hand and are not the best player at the table; they're playing pot control.

I guess you could argue Dems should start shoving every hand preflop, and embrace the variance.

Sources for important work Obama did in key areas that Hillary ignored?

Haven't read the book but I agree with the 538 take that the reasons she gave in the book are pretty accurate.

Really though imo all this talk about the reasons she lost (both from Hillary herself and stuff like above) beats around the bush and ignores what we all know but don't explicitly say. The #1 reason she lost is because the American voter does not possess sufficient critical thinking skills, morality, and character.

You say she "couldn't convince people to vote for [her]." They shouldn't have needed convincing. Trump should have been laughed off the stage the day after he announced his candidacy and the fact that he wasn't is an indictment on the American people.

You can say "not all his voters are racist" and yes that is true but all his voters decided that racism was not a dealbreaker. And that is appalling morality! All his voters either did not possess the knowledge to know that he did not know what he was talking about on nearly every topic (and still doesn't) or they knew that he is uniformed and simply didn't care that the person they are voting for president is uniformed. And that is appalling decision making!

So all the reasons given as to why she lost (Comey, Russia, sexism, poor tactical campaigning decisions, etc.) are literally correct with a margin as close as it was but ignores that it never should have been that close in the first place. And the fact that it was that close teaches us more about the American people than it does about anything else.

Conceded, Americans, especially old white Americans, ****ing suck. But you can't excuse Hillarys loss on account of bigots when the country just elected a black dude twice.

She's a crappy, lying, arrogant, smug politician who ran a terrible campaign. It's on her, and she needs to disappear.

Her campaign was mechanically and technically awful regardless of the ideas she represented. One of the worst ever. Almost unbelievably bad.

She also basically ran on inevitability. It helped her capture all the money and endorsements, yet she doesn't own all the cons of running on such a premise. Like everyone thinks you're 99% to win and therefore they don't feel the need to come out and vote for you since you're such a stone cold lock. Go away.

I lold then felt a twinge of depression because it's not outside the realm of possibility

I mean, Obama legitimately inspired ME. I am borderline uninspirable about anything, and I got off my ass and volunteered for him.

I of course voted Hillary, but never had anything approaching good feelings about it. That's entirely her fault.

Do you guys think there's any misogynism behind the knee-jerk, "She should just disappear and/or keep her mouth shut."?

I mean, I'm starting to feel like she's the only dem out there speaking truth right now; what with Chuck and Nancy setting themselves up to be patsies and all.

Chuck and Nancy are, for once, WINNING

Yes. No.

LOL at automatically going to the sexism excuse. I can't recall any losing male candidates writing books explaining why they lost. The whole thing reeks of sour grapes and looks like a gratuitous cash grab which feeds into all of the public's worst perceptions about her.

Taken from this map of the last 10 weeks of the campaign. Cross-referenced with their source at the bottom.

Then looking at this map of campaign visits for 2008.


While it's a slightly different time period so the raw number of visits don't matter, it still shows a pretty big difference between the frequency of visits in relation to total visits between the two. For instance, Obama traveled to Pennsylvania 8 times, NC 8 times, Florida 8 times, Michigan 7 times, and Wisconsin 5 times. Compared to Hillary who went to Penn 4 times, NC 7 times, Florida 10 times, Michigan 1 time, and Wisconsin 0 times.

My argument was that Hillary took for granted votes that Obama worked hard to get, ignored them while Trump didn't, and then was surprised that those people voted for the person pretending to care about them. I think the Michigan and Wisconsin numbers support that argument - especially given all the talk of them being part of the firewall that she had locked up or whatever.


ETA: That's like, just how I'm interpreting things. If I'm interpreting things incorrectly, I'm willing to listen to why and stuff. I'm new to this and am trying my best to be informed and on top of things, but mistakes will happen.

I can't really do anything about the Holliday post. I'm assuming it's directed at me since it's right after my "I wish she'd just retire" post. I personally don't think people disliking her book tour are doing it because they hate women. I think they are disliking her book tour because they hate specifically her and the position she put us in. But like, there's just not much way to have a conversation on that other that "nuh uh!" "uh huh!" so shrug. Idk.

I don't really understand* why a candidate physically visiting matters so much to voters (and by extension the media). Like who knows so little about the candidates and is so undecided where someone making a speech to thousands of people in their geographic area can influence their opinion. I guess people think it signals that the candidate cares about them.

* Note that I might be biased since I live in a non-competitive state where candidates rarely come

Automatically as if I'm some sort of feminist reactionary, lol. Must not be familiar with my work...

Hasn't Al Gore written like a dozen of these? Granted no one's read them. There's not a major party candidate who's "disappeared" since Dukakis. McCain's brain is literally being eaten right now and he's not going anywhere. Gratuitous cash grab? Bob Dole just ripped off Taiwan for a day of accidental comfort and Trump's son-in-law is hawking visas for half a milly each. All actual, "I read it" reviews I've seen indicate it's a well-thought-out analysis rather than the hit-piece cited in headlines.

Sour grapes? WTF? In order for that to be applicable she'd have to be asserting she didn't really *want* the presidency anyway--and we all sure as **** know that isn't true and in no way what she's saying.

Yeah, I think it just signals to a lot of people that "they care about people like me! they understand our issues and will make it better!"

I agree with you that it seems kind of silly that it's the case. Yet the public is the same people that cares about PIZZAGATE or whatever nonsense their aunt's friend's coworker's nephew's teacher said she heard on facebook or something so I'm also not surprised.

Oh, I thought by "important work" you meant legislation/issue advancing type stuff, not campaign related shoe leather.

Honestly, optimal strategy for her might have been to be seen as little as possible.

telling hillary to shut up is like 98% misogyny

the fivethirtyeight thing on the book was pretty good

clare talks about that a bit

i'm not at all convinced that it does, but yeah the media really loves to play it up
(especiall wrt this election obv)

like oh hey i was gonna vote for Drumpf / not vote, but then Shrillary showed up in Madison and gave her lame stump speech and wowowowow!!! ... right

not quite the same thing as Drumpf's rallies where you can get all MAD @ coloured folks for your ****ty life etc

i've never gone to a political rally, probably never will
they seem like a remnant of the past from when they were necessary, really

much of the response to hilary has always been about misogyny.

but she also sucked in a lot of the ways that obama sucked and that clinton sucked but without any of the ability to appear not to suck.

so theres that.

yeah, I guess I got no idea wtf I'm talking about on this. Like I said, new to it and hey nobody starts off well informed. Will try to do better

I mean lots of responses to Hilary doing anything are misogynist. But, like, progressives that voted for Hillary telling her to go away because she **** then bed....is definitely not because they are misogynists.

all clinton needed to do to win was give a single ****ing speech at some point saying something like

"hey if you're a good honest american and you're thinking about voting for trump, i understand. the democrats havent been looking out for you, and i intend to change that. youre not a racist, so please dont vote for one"

That seems like terrible advice. Hey, the current president who is way more popular than I am? He's not looking out for you. My husband? He wasn't looking out for you either. My former colleagues in the Senate? Lol no. But yeah, I'm totally going to start looking out for you now, trust me

She shouldn't keep her mouth shut and go away, she should be out there promoting progressive causes and organizing for progressive candidates.

Shutting up and going away is better than going on a book tour to whine about Bernie 10 months after the election, though.