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Old 01-13-2012, 11:07 PM   #6826
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

I read an article on the sweetscience.com that suggested that team Mayweather somehow leak negoatiations of the Guerrero fight to the press to test the reaction. I have no idea of whether they did this or not, they may well have done it with M. Hatton and Spadafora, but it's a clever thing to do.
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Old 01-13-2012, 11:13 PM   #6827
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

I mean, if he were it wasn't rocket science.

Schaefer just casually mentioned Guerrero as a name. Just like he has with Erik Morales and Matthew Hatton before. It's basically getting his fighters some good rep in media.

Floyd vs. Guerrero would sell like 600-700k. It's highly unlikely it ever was seriously considered in my opinion.
I wouldn't put it past Floyd to fight such an opponent if it made economical sense, but it doesn't.
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Old 01-13-2012, 11:16 PM   #6828
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

I mean there was a report that the guerrero fight was basically a done deal, which could have come from a team mayweather guy. Mayweather's options for a 5th may fight look very slim remember.
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Old 01-13-2012, 11:25 PM   #6829
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

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I'd imagine but that has nothing to do with anything.
It has everything to do with it when you use the "and all of a sudden..." argument.

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That's great, show my why he should've suspected otherwise from Manny? There was no hint prior that Manny was juicing other than the fact he was really good.
Being dominant is a pretty good indicator. Refusing additional tests is another indicator.

I don't care if Pac is juicing. If i was in charge it would already be legal. I just don't think it's an outrageous demand within context.

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A fair compromise to an unfair/unreasonable/unnecessary request is immaterial
And this is where our opinion differ. I see no problem in asking for additional tests if you have some grounds to do so. Floyd has the pull to make demands, so he did.
I'm equally fine with Manny demanding million dollar penalties.

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Oh for sure. I have no idea what Manny wants, but I'm damn sure Arum doesn't want any part of ending his cash cow.
I'm over blaming Arum. Hes just doing his job, and hes making more money by inhouse fights than he is co-promoting with Floyd.

If Manny wants the fight it's up to him. Hes the employer in this situation.

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Personally, I think Manny wants to be President. He'd just gone a shocking 12 rounds in a fight many thought he didn't win and what are his first comments about? Returning to his homeland to work on congressional issues. Wait...wat
I think this plays a large part in all of this and is the main reason hes avoiding the fight. (ducking really, but I'll be polite)
If he were to lose, could he ever become president? What if hes outclassed?

I don't think Manny is a pussy by any means. Hes about as much of a fighter as anyone Ive seen. Hes from the same cloth as Frazier and the likes when it comes to that quality. Hes not "afraid" of Floyd, hes afraid of losing.

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...and then giving up. He didn't do the things he's doing now then. He just went on with his career. That's all well and good but his behavior then and now doesn't pass the smell test.
He said he wanted Manny to take the tests and they could get it on. He played the card on 24/7, postfight Mosley, on ESPN etc.

I think hes been quite consistent about fighting Manny. He always said it's all about taking the tests he demanded.
Is he more aggressively pursuing the fight now? Yeah absolutely. But he were doing so before the jmm fight as well.

Now don't get me wrong. I put blame on Floyd as well (and up until the recent fiasco by Manny, and his blatant duck, i put slightly more blame on floyd overall). I especially feel that his "I'm not even thinking about boxing" was especially embarrassing.

As it currently stands though, hes the one seemingly wanting the fight and Pacquiao is the one seemingly not wanting the fight.

I want the fight.

So therefore I'm pissed at Pacquiao, just like you guys were at Floyd.

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I'm not sure why that matters. I only said that everyone, even novices, wanted the fight. That pressure was the driving force.
I misunderstood.

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Does anyone here not load up on Floyd at -200?
I don't have much to load, but i think Floyd is a greater favorite than -200.
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Old 01-13-2012, 11:27 PM   #6830
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

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I mean there was a report that the guerrero fight was basically a done deal, which could have come from a team mayweather guy. Mayweather's options for a 5th may fight look very slim remember.
Yea i guess, but he can always get Canelo which would probably do 1.3 or something. Even with Canelo getting a bigger cut it's a lot more money for Floyd.

I feel it's basically a way to spin this negatively on Floyd. Maybe he did consider Guerrero, but I'm not taking anonymous sources for it just like i didn't with Spadafora, Hatton, Morales etc.

The important part is hes not fighting that joke of a fight.
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Old 01-13-2012, 11:34 PM   #6831
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

It's funny, without Pacquiao and Mayweather this thread would be pretty much dead.
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Old 01-13-2012, 11:37 PM   #6832
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

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It's funny, without Pacquiao and Mayweather this thread would be pretty much dead.
Uhhh, it wouldn't even exist
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Old 01-13-2012, 11:46 PM   #6833
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

Thats not true. There's always gonna be a place to mock Amir Khan.
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Old 01-13-2012, 11:48 PM   #6834
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

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Thats not true. There's always gonna be a place to mock Amir Khan.
Not that I don't agree but https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...59&postcount=1 tho
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Old 01-13-2012, 11:51 PM   #6835
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

Obviously the thread title would've been 'lol khan'.
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Old 01-14-2012, 03:48 AM   #6836
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

Wp King of Cool. Holding your own against these know nothing boxing fans. So annoying...

When Fanny Faguiao fought Oscar, you'd have to have been a complete Faguiao nuthugger not to see how weight drained Oscar was. FF fights Floyd's leftovers.
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Old 01-14-2012, 06:03 AM   #6837
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

I hope Peterson destroys Khan in the rematch. And I'm British. But just so disgusted by the way Khan reacted to the loss. Peterson exposed Khan's lack of punching power and I'm sick of Khan's showboating.
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Old 01-14-2012, 03:34 PM   #6838
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

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Wp King of Cool. Holding your own against these know nothing boxing fans. So annoying...

When Fanny Faguiao fought Oscar, you'd have to have been a complete Faguiao nuthugger not to see how weight drained Oscar was. FF fights Floyd's leftovers.
kingofcool spam incorporated is in no way affiliated with this poster and as such does not take responsibility of his actions.



There's a news story from the Philippines saying Pacquiao has decided to fight Cotto next.
Could be a rumor, as these things often are, but I'd put it out there.
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Old 01-14-2012, 03:35 PM   #6839
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

Arum confirmed that Pac picked his next opponent, IF a deal with Mayweather cannot be reached. He didn't say who it was. I am thinking it's JMM, but Cotto would be my second guess.
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Old 01-14-2012, 03:41 PM   #6840
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

I wouldn't mind seeing Pac JMM IV IF Pac still wants to fight.
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Old 01-14-2012, 03:42 PM   #6841
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

I hope it's bradley. At least that's fresh and somewhat interesting.

Cotto is a joke fight. We've seen it already. Since when do you rematch people you crushed the first time around only a couple of years later? ****ing ******ed.
I liked Pac vs Cotto the first time, but not a rematch when we already know the outcome.

It's hard to argue JMM 4 wouldn't be competitive. But is anyone really interested? It's the 4th fight, and the last one wasn't as good as the first two.

Peterson would be almost Guerrero level. It won't be him.
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Old 01-14-2012, 03:44 PM   #6842
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

Which fight makes more money - Cotto or Marquez? Apparently PPV numbers for Pac-JMM 3 went far beyond expectations and they sold out the MGM. Cotto on the other hand is probably the third biggest star in the sport. I say the Cotto fight is bigger, I would rather he fought JMM though.

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Old 01-14-2012, 03:49 PM   #6843
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

i think they make an equal amount. Maybe 1.2 million? Maybe marquez fight even more if they can spin the "i beat him" angle to the mexican crowd. (not much to spin, but you get what im saying)
Marquez would usually take a smaller cut than Cotto, but i don't think so for this fight the way hes been talking.

Bradley fight with 24/7 could do what? 900k? maybe even a million. It would definitely not do the same money as the other two, but Pac would take a much larger % of the cake.
I hope it's bradley. I have little doubt Pac beats him handily, but i dislike Bradley and wouldn't mind seeing it + it's something NEW.


But honestly, the JMM fight is legit (but boring to me, but it's legit) while the Cotto fight is not legit. It's like Floyd fighting Mosley again if he beats Cintron or someone.
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Old 01-14-2012, 03:52 PM   #6844
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

Manny's next fight will tell us everything we need to know about where his head's at/What Arum wants.

Cotto: Give me the paycheck and let me to run for President
JMM4: Cares about his legacy, wants to prove he's better than JMM
Floyd: Best result, wants to be the best in the world/loves the sound of $50mm+
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Old 01-14-2012, 04:12 PM   #6845
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)



8:20~

I think we can safely drop the "Manny does what Bob Arum wants".
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Old 01-14-2012, 04:32 PM   #6846
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

Bob Arum gives him the options, Bob Arum gives his opinions of those options, and Manny eventually chooses whichever one Arum tells him is the best. Basically, I feel Manny is highly swayed by whatever Arum says. Sure, Manny could go against Bob's wishes, but I think that happens very rarely.

Of course Freddie is going to say Manny calls the shots. What is he going to say? Manny is a little b**** and does what Arum wants? Freddie also says Manny wants the fight with Mayweather... But I don't think you would safely drop the whole "Manny is ducking Floyd", would you?

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Old 01-14-2012, 04:45 PM   #6847
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

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Of course Freddie is going to say Manny calls the shots. What is he going to say? Manny is a little b**** and does what Arum wants? Freddie also says Manny wants the fight with Mayweather... But I don't think you would safely drop the whole "Manny is ducking Floyd", would you?
lol this.

Freddy is never going to say Arum is using Manny like every promoter in boxing's long history has used fighters.
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Old 01-14-2012, 04:59 PM   #6848
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

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Bob Arum gives him the options, Bob Arum gives his opinions of those options, and Manny eventually chooses whichever one Arum tells him is the best. Basically, I feel Manny is highly swayed by whatever Arum says. Sure, Manny could go against Bob's wishes, but I think that happens very rarely.
Everyone. Roach, Konzc, Arum says Manny makes the decision. Hes the boss.
Is he influenced by Arum? Yep, just like Floyd is influenced by Al Haymon.

But to think he wouldn't get the Floyd fight if he wanted to, or that he just says "pick my fight arum" is beyond naive.

Quote:
Of course Freddie is going to say Manny calls the shots. What is he going to say? Manny is a little b**** and does what Arum wants? Freddie also says Manny wants the fight with Mayweather... But I don't think you would safely drop the whole "Manny is ducking Floyd", would you?
I don't see what one has to do with the other?

One is explaining how the chain of command goes, the other is an opinion.

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lol this.

Freddy is never going to say Arum is using Manny like every promoter in boxing's long history has used fighters.
And if Floyd is being used by Haymon we should not say hes ducked Margarito?

To be honest, the logical thing for Roach to do would be to say Arum is responsible. That would make Arum the bad guy instead of Manny.
Roach has NO ties to Arum. He only cares about Manny. Why would he "lie" if that hurts Mannys image more than the truth?

Why do we blame some fighters for who they fight, and with others we blame their promoter?
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Old 01-14-2012, 05:04 PM   #6849
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

I think It's obvious i can't change anyones mind on this, so I'll try to scale it down (It'll be hard as I'm annoyed by the situation, but whatever, it's futile on both ends).

Will you guys be pissed if he fights Cotto again?
If not, would you be pissed if he fight Peterson?




[x] Unfinished business
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Old 01-14-2012, 05:15 PM   #6850
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Re: SE Boxing Thread (still waiting for PBF v. Pac)

Manny has been heavily criticized over the past week or so for being's Arum's puppet. Saying Arum calls the shots would only confirm that, and look bad on Manny. Like you previously said, how can Manny run a country, if he can't even run his own career?

Floyd has repeatedly said he is his own boss and he makes the decisions. Manny Pacquiao, on the other hand, has been criticized for saying "well... it's up to my promotor Bob Arum" in post-fight interviews. I don't think Floyd gets pushed around like Manny does. I don't think Haymon has as much power in Floyd's career as Arum does over Manny's. Haymon does what Floyd wants. I can't say the same about Manny and Arum.

---

On a different note: Has anyone read ANYTHING about Floyd and Arum going into negotiations with each other? Floyd was supposed to make an announcement on Friday about his next opponent. Maybe they are trying to quietly work it out behind the scenes? Maybe Floyd is trying to something out with Canelo?

Floyd still hasn't addressed why late May would be a problem from him, right? I know he has insisted on May 5th over and over, but I haven't read anything about him saying why late May won't work.
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