I dono about the size argument, many of the biggest punchers in history were midgets by today's standards and they constantly handed naps to much bigger men : Tyson, Liston, Shavers, Frazier... obv weight counts but these guys had either natural beastness, great technique or both. Plus chin isn't related to size from what I know. And speaking of size, watch the Vitali - Lewis highlights and try naming how many HW's would take that much punishment and not go down. Joshua got rocked by Povetkin ffs. The only entertaining HW these days is Wilder, watching him slapping guys into oblivion at a 98% KO rate is the funniest ****.

My fav example of an old school chin :



How many punches in do you reckon Joshua or Wilder go down? This is Mike ***** Tyson ffs.

Also this :

This guy is a nobody in boxing history by and it took Tyson 5 KD's to dispose of him. And Wilder thinks he can slap Rooney's Tyson behind the ears, just lmao. At least Joshua is man enough to admit he'd be obliterated.

Size argument is pretty legit. Why do you think Nikolai Valuev never became a legend? You get to Joshua's size or bigger, you don't have the stamina to go 12 rounds. Hell, most can't go 6 without looking like they're about to pass out. They're carrying too much weight around.

When your stamina goes, everything goes. Your power fades. Your legs start quivering. Your head gets rocked back easily because your neck and shoulders are weakened, meaning that punches that did nothing to you in round 1 could devastate you in round 10. It even hurts to hold your arms up to defend yourself after blocking so many monstrous shots. Your body hurts and you have trouble taking deep breaths to gain enough oxygen to help you recover between rounds. Your nose gets busted up and you can barely breathe while fighting. I remember exerting myself so heavily while sparring that I no longer had the strength to hold my arms up.

Guys like Ali and Frazier didn't have stamina issues at heavyweight because they were smaller, less muscle-bound heavyweights. Heavyweights now are way larger and look like Olympians. That's good for straight power but for 12 round fights? Better get that knockout early.

Well yea, I meant size doesn't make a difference in terms of chin and plenty of old school smaller guys were much bigger hitters than today's giants. Even Foreman was small by today's standards (6'3''/ 220) but he hit and took hits like no one else. When he returned in his 40's he was just absorbing everything, the Tommy M. fight is a great example.

And since, like you said, size means more fatigue, why do they **** around for ages and jab each other to death instead of going for the kill before the batteries run out? Just betting on not gassing out first? Why did the old guys have so much punching power and chin when they were so much smaller? Frazier got up 6 times vs Foreman and could still walk without assistance at the end. Why are today's ''legends'' so weak when compared? Everything seems to be about how ''cool'' your entrance is or how much ''glam'' the event has.
Just look at this ****ing ****:



Povetkin is ranked no.3 in the world. He'd have been a bouncer in the 20th century.

What makes a fighter have a good chin or a lot of power is really one of those unknown questions that will likely never be objectively answered. Size is clearly only one factor though it is an important one. Mixed martial artist Francis Ngannou has the record for hardest punch ever measured and he's 6'4", 253 lbs. Obviously, there are bigger fighters out there but cannot throw with the violent force of Ngannou. There are also fighters who are larger but don't have the chin of a smaller fighter in their division. There are thoughts that it's related to the size of a fighter's neck, shoulders, and a lower center of gravity. It could also be related to slight, subtle defensive moves that reduce the impact of a punch yet cannot be seen in real-time by the naked eye.

Missed punches sap more energy from a fighter than a successful strike. With stamina in such short supply for big men, there's a greater loss for each missed punch than there is in smaller fighters. That's why punch output generally goes down as the size of the fighters increases. They have to be more selective in order to avoid gassing out. Jabs score points with the judges without risking leaving yourself open for a potential fight-ending counter and consume less energy to boot.

Another reason you don't see that risk-taking is financial. The boxing world overvalues an undefeated record because that mark is a strong selling point. A loss can cost a promoter and fighter millions in future income. This incentivizes fighters to be more risk-averse in the ring. You don't see many well-known fighters with double-digit losses. As a matter of fact, only one heavyweight fighter in BoxRec's top 50 heavyweight fighters has more than 5 losses (Dereck Chisora has 8 losses). The top 10 combined have 7 losses.

But that's also what makes heavyweight boxing exciting. Openings for aggression are rare. So when they happen, a fighter has to act fast and aggressively on it because there may not be another one. This results in fighting in spurts of rock'em sock'em robots type of exchanges. This can also lead to a lot of unpredictability in the division. MMA is a perfect example. The record for consecutive successful title defenses in the UFC is just 3 fights. There's so much riding on each wave of aggression given how few there are.

Inter-generational comparisons are mental masturbation. I find it best to just enjoy what we see and be impressed with that.

Im a casual fan and I know about that fight. But I know it as the fight that made boxing be 12 rounds instead of 15.

I'm watching Foreman v Holyfield... no HW today could take 10% of that and still be up, it's unreal. Foreman was 42 here. Ranked no.3. The Povetkin of early 90's. But let's not compare ages, that would be pure speculation.

We have been treated to multiple toe-to-toe slugfest wars between huge guys putting their lives on the line in the past couple of years.

Some of these comments are laughable.

Nothing will come of further discussion. Arguing over unanswerable questions is a waste of time.

You'd be a good fit on r/boxing krawk.

Who'd win tho, Prime Mike Tyson or 2 Grizzly Cubs?

http://mycountry955.com/the-wyoming-...nds-and-teeth/

Mike will be fine especially if he uses those teeth.

Tyson loses by DQ in round 1 after stomping on their tethticles.

Apparently, Victor Ortiz raped somebody

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/09/26/u...ape/index.html

Guess he wanted to skip over the quitting on his stool by quitting the fight entirely. Always thought there was something up with the guy mentally. This is completely unsurprising to me.

Speaking of rape one of the judges had AJ up 5-1 on Povetkin. Looks like Eddie is on at least equal footing with Oscar re: gettin' **** done.

I had it 4-2.

Gone under the radar a bit but it's the final of the WBSS super middleweight's tomorrow night in Saudi Arabia.



George Groves (1.75) v Callum Smith (2.54)

Despite still being unbeaten I think Smith's stock has declined recently and he hasn't looked too impressive. Leaning towards Groves by KO but not particularly confident on that.

Groves by decision imo

Guess the winner beats Ramirez

Smith's got some physical advantages in his favour here.

Oh dear.

Remember when BJS called for Canelo to be banned for life due to a VADA violation.

So he's a cheat and a guy who pays hookers to sucker punch people. Class act.

Kind of weird that Smith/Groves is on a Friday. Even weirder that it's in Saudi Arabia. Wonder what the crowd will be like.

Eubank Jr fighting a total tomato can on the undercard. His opponent got knocked out by a 37 year old fighter with a 3-3 record. His most recent loss was a unanimous decision to a 2-0 prospect.

lol

I dunno who wins tonight but I do fancy Groves to edge it.

Tyson always went balls out in training when on video. Even his shadow boxing was overly dramatic.

And let's be real here. Prime Tyson knocks out Wilder, possibly in the first round.

Is there a broadcast for the western world for Smith/Groves?

I found some foreign language feeds but that's it.

EDIT: Oh why are they bothering to show the undercard fights on TV. They're **** fights.