Read my followup post.. I'm not saying they are AFC favorites. I'm saying you saying they won't even be strong AFCW favorites is going to be wrong.

Nice sample size you got there.

But mostly I was making fun of your standard posting situation. Appeal to whatever authority agrees with you -- and when it doesn't go ahead and discredit it.

with von miller injured. way to make his point

Yeah their D did suffer when Von Miller got than injury and had to play with a cast.

Im not saying their D cant be good moving forward with fully healthy players, but you cant look at their overall play/stats last year and talk about them like a great D.

man you're still buthurt over your lolbad line predictions. looking forward to another season of this hilarity

I agree. However, I think you can project that this year, with a healthy Miller, they can be a very good D. A better D than Peyton has ever had, perhaps.

Not at all. I still think your 2 points was horribly wrong. My predictions were never lolbad. You just, as usual, appeal to whatever authority goes along with your internal narrative.

someone will pay for tebow, tbh i think they'll get a helluva lot better than a mid round pick

denver D is awesome, right? seems like a fringe top 5 team with like 83% of peyton

No, they aren't awesome.

They have two elite players.. an aging Champ.. and some questionable LB's.

hope broncos are ready for some choke jobs

Like I said, though.. even if this goes as bad as possible its still a great move. Any out to the Tebow situation is awesome.

ahh, my bad, how did they win games last year?

It was clear to see Von Millers ability to get to the QB was severly hampered by the cast in that he couldnt use his hand to gain leverage etc. How will the suspension to williams effect their D at the start.

I mean, you dismissed out of hand all of the other games where Denver put in a good defensive performance. It's not like San Diego was the only team they did that too-- in 11 games after the bye they held their opponents to 15 points or less 6 times.
Yeah, Miller didn't miss either game but he slowed down significantly after he injured his thumb. And, of course, New England's offense is very, very good.

Miller was hurt and missed the Minnesota game.

Points the Denver defense allowed in the six games after the bye and before Miller was hurt: 15, 31, 24, 10, 13, 13.

Points allowed staring with the Minnesota game, through their playoff elimination: 30, 10, 41, 19, 3, 23, 45.

That's almost a touchdown a game difference before and after. And if Cutler had been healthy for the CHI-DEN game you can be sure the Bears would have scored more than 10. Same with the Chiefs not having Cassel and putting 3 in the regular-season finale. And of course you can make a similar argument that if the team hadn't been pocket-passing with Tebow vs. DET, the defense isn't on the field so damn much and doesn't give up 31.

I'm not even trying to argue that Denver's defense is elite, but they don't suck. And not having Von Miller at full strength made a big difference.

Mostly Jesus.

But what others are saying right.. Miller was all time elite rookie before the injury.. and only above average after. He was in a cast -- and that hurt the entire defense.

Now if Manning can actually put up points.. having Doom and Miller in a situation where opposition has to throw.. is just awesome.

chim I wouldn't punch your ticket to win the division just yet. Chiefs signed a top 5 RT and have 3 key players coming back from injury. Yes Cassel sucks but we won the division 2 years ago with mediocre Cassel and will be fielding a much improved team around him this year.

Who knows how long it will take Peyton to return to form and get comfortable with his receivers, but even if he's totally healthy there could be some lag there this year.

Also obviously the Raiders are very tough if they can figure out how to win. And I doubt SD is dead yet. The AFCW going to be a dogfight this year.

I'm not at all.

I was just pointing out all the people who said they wouldn't be decent AFCW favorites are going to be wrong. Given what Vegas and Bodog currently have up, it would be utterly shocking if they aren't strong favorites in every single book to win the AFCW.

I said:

1) Broncos won't open as AFC favorites at Pinny
2) Broncos won't be big favorites to win AFC West

you think both of these are horribly wrong? granted I didn't define 2 but we can easily bet #1

chim

it is absolutely in vegas' best interest to overrate the **** out of the broncos right now.

I was referring to your 2 points about NE vs GB. GB woulda been more than 2 point favorites.

I believe DEN will close as significant AFCW favorites. I also acknowledged they were overrated by Vegas right now.

The points against argument of Denver's defense means less when you figure their offensive makeup, but yeah there were stretches when they were very good.

A better argument for their defense imo is the fact that they will theoretically play the pass exclusively a lot more this year. If Peyton can get them more early leads, you'll see Doom and Von doing what they do best.

well that's fantastic but since we'll never find out I think you can stop beating your chest over how right you think you would have been