I think the real question, as far as analyzing the morality of it all, is how far up this kid's butt Sandusky's dick was. I mean, if we're talking full length here, then yes, OBVIOUSLY something needed to be done. But a couple inches and everyone's supposed to go running to the cops?

I'm actually disappointed we haven't had a "Brooks Bollinger's cousin" gimmick yet.

I'm pretty sure there is a "Bdidd's cousin/half-brother" somewhere out there.

I think T36 has a point inasmuch as any hint of skepticism is being shouted down before it even has a chance to be digested and just in general that's not always the best thing.

That said- the skepticism we've seen so far suffers from being uninformed. I was there myself earlier in this thread. Basically Paterno's actions (and the other three as well) become just really hard to understand if you accept that they knew exactly what was going on. Sandusky almost makes more sense, he's a damn sociopath. The other guys in a sense seem "normal".

I mean obviously we know the motivating factors in the cover-up and in a way it makes sense, but it's still difficult for me to believe (not that I don't believe it, I'm just perpetually flabbergasted by it) that these people could hand-waive away child rape in the name of protecting their/PSU's reputation. It does make you want to find some other way to explain things, even if you know that's stupid.

This makes perfect sense iyam.

Paterno failed horribly, but in general people aren't binary. The world isn't divided into monsters and good people. That's not meant to defend Paterno at all, his actions and failures are still terrible. He made a set of bad decisions and a ton of kids got hurt for it... he wasn't pure evil.

Am I the only one who finds JoePas death convenient?

Im not saying he wasn't sick or anything... But maybe someone assisted his suicide...

Which parts was he confused on? He seemed to really just weigh the facts correctly without becoming emotional especially not layering "omg paterno controlled every aspect of activity on campus, football related or not", like gotleib was screaming.

He was 85 with cancer. That's what old people do, they die

I'm willing to have a discussion with a person holding the "I just can't see how a non-sociopath like JoePa or Spainer could hide this" because I do think the fact that they did is very tough to comprehend, but at the end of that talk, if they don't agree with the facts as stated (JoePa did that ****), they're probably a PSU Alum/Bdidds.

It's this or Sandusky leveraged the situation ("You all hid it for years, if I go down, we all go down"). The problem I have with that is I really don't think Sandusky ever thought of what he was doing as wrong so I don't see him taking that line.

Have to be careful with all these. Seems perfectly likely Jurrah did some raping back in the day, but it's also a non-zero chance that people are seeing dollar signs in this whole thing.

http://youtu.be/YR5ApYxkU-U?t=3m1s

He may not have thought it was wrong, but he certainly knew the consequences if it went public. That was never lost on him. He went to extreme lengths, obviously, to keep it secret. So yeah, him blackmailing them into keeping quiet seems pretty reasonable.

But he had plenty of opportunities to run before he finally got caught, he didn't. I'm sure he realized that society just wouldn't understand his actions, and maybe he really felt like he wouldn't ever be caught (or would be acquitted) but nothing in Sandusky's actions lead me to conclude he'd blackmail everyone on the way out.

More obviously, given how meticulous the PSU top brass were in documenting their conspiracy to cover this up, you don't think we'd have seen one e-mail mentioning his attempts to shut them up?

lol. i mean criminals dont try and run all the time cause of various reasons. where the **** is he going to go? he wont make it far. ask scott peterson.

it's one thing to use code words and stretch meanings of things to execute a cover up

it's another thing to document that you are being blackmailed and how you are giving into it.

Oh come on, think about the people to whom you're referring. Surely one of them would've fired off a "Jerry's done, we gave him everything he wanted, no more issues" email around the time he retired or something.

These guys were beyond careless in almost every regard here. It's muuuuuuch more likely that JoePa and Co. felt it was best to quietly phase him out (whether this was because JoePa felt he owed him or because they all knew this was a ****storm I'm not sure, but I'd guess the latter) as opposed to a full on extortion attempt.

Richard,

The below is from the Freeh report. It is listed in chronological order. Draw your own conclusions.

Didn't Sandusky threaten some of the victims with never seeing their families again if they told anyone about their shower horseplay? Slip your mind? Not applicable or you think maybe that part exagerated? Trolling again?

Actually yeah, I totally forgot about that part. Hmmmm, maybe it's reasonable.

I mean the excerpts from the report don't really seem all that odd to me in light of the fact that all parties involved knew they had a goddamn pedophile running around on campus. Obviously letting him continue to run around and have access to the locker room is dumb but it doesn't make it any more likely that Sandusky was behind it then it does the top guys just panicked because they realized they were all going to hang if this gets out.

Boom RT, you just got lawyered.

Actually did not know about all that those details myself. Thought blackmail was pretty absurd, but now seems like a decent possibility.

Just watched Mark Emmert on PBS. For the first time, I feel it very likely Penn State is going to get hammered. I don't see any discussion here unless I missed it as I was sleeping. PBS airs the show in a lot of markets the next day, so summary of interview since I can't find link are:

*The NCAA is awaiting Penn State's response to the 4 questions he submitted in November. He made special mention that in this situation he wrote the letter himself. He said he needs a response quickly, "weeks not months."

* said it was a football issue, and also a systemic failure

Emmert quote:

" it's hard to look at that report and not conclude there were systemic failures across the institution including, and especially in some cases the athletic department, that strike at the heart of what education and what athletics is supposed to be about."

-another scary Emmert quote if you're a Penn State fan,

" This is so big. This issue is unlike anything that college athletics has ever seen. We can't simply walk away from this one and say, gee, I don't know that this fits the normal pattern. It doesn't fit any normal pattern thank god, but it certainly strikes at the core values we hold closely."

*Said precedent isn't much of a concern as this was unprecedented.

* Refused to take death penalty off the table. Only part of the interview where he was somewhat nuanced. When asked about the penalty, his response was in the vein of to paraphrase, "Some say this wasn't a football problem. It was, but it was that, and more."

* Spoke vaguely of the morals and ethics clauses in relation to where violations occurred.



I really thought he'd be more political and avoid any tough questions, but while he didn't render judgement yet as far as what they'll do, it has to be unnerving to PSU fans as he gave the impression that it's certainly within their purview.

Man, **** you for making me think it's possible the NCAA might actually do the right thing here.

There is a 2 minute clip on youtube, but it doesn't do the interview justice.

Really, just listening to him, he almost implies it's a matter of what penalties they'll apply rather than if.Just the impression I get. At the conclusion he hedges a bit with a comment about "if charges are brought." Some more quotes from pausing my DVR, any mistakes are not intentional, but I'll be close and not change context.



When questioned what NCAA violations Penn State may have violated-

"The fundamental core of what the NCAA is supposed to be doing is promoting athletics in a collegiate environment, and supporting all of the values that come along with collegiate athletics. The values of not just fair play, but of high ethical standards and honesty and integrity." "We will get answers back from them -on the 4 questions in the NCAA letter- on those questions of institutional control, demonstrate to us that you had control over this program in a way that would allow you to follow all the rules and comply with the values of athletics. Demonstrate to us, convince us, that everyone behaved in an ethical fashion. Then we are going to go back and determine if they meet those definitions."

Regarding Paterno having too much control-

"This isn't about being too big to fail, this is more like being too big to even question, or to even intrude on or control, and if these are the realities that were going on in this program, we need to figure out how to fix that culture. Here are these unbelievable acts that were enabled, or at least not stopped, and come across as institutional failure. Something certainly appears, and the Freeh report points in this direction, that was just out of kilter in terms of the power relationships and the authority relationships. That just can't happen."

nah, your response there was fine. dunno what karak was even talking about honestly.

pls god

Let me state up front that there is plenty of culpabilitiy for Paterno. But the Freeh report also has a good deal of speculation regarding motiviation. Freeh claims the motivation was to protect the university from bad press, but there really doesn't see to be any "smoking gun" for why from what I have seen when I looked at the Freeh Report.

The cover up may have been to avoid bad press, it may have been to protect business dealings involving the Second Mile, it may have been because Sandusky already had PSU officials over a barrel even before 2001 or 1998. The avoid bad press assertion seemed prety subjective, IMO.

it also may have been because brooklyn joe didn't want anything to get in the way of his getting the all time wins record.