Depends on how you view Hamonic they possibly blew a bunch of trade currency on a below average defenseman.

Also, Reaves sucks.

Jeremy Rutherford‏Verified account
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Reaves: "First thing I saw was, 'It sounds like Reaves is going for a first-rounder.' I was like 'OK, obviously that's a bunch of garbage.'"

I don't get all the hate for the Reeves trade. Yeah it's not ideal, but I'm sure the move was pushed from the stars and ownership. Trading a guy that probably will never be a regular NHLer and moving down 20 spots in a weak draft to keep your stars happy and have one of the best 4th liners in the NHL isn't terrible. Hopefully it helps keep Tom Wilson and the like in line better next post season.

I'm sure guys like Tom Wilson will just cower in the corner now that the Penguins got Reaves.

I don't know; the Penguins have just won 2 Cups utilizing speed and driving the puck to the net on every line. They had a guy like Sundqvist that not only has above-average speed but is 6'3" 210 lbs and can drive to the net.

Fifteen years ago this would've been a great move, getting a gritty guy that restores order when your star player takes a shot. It's just not that kind of NHL anymore. The Penguins have proven that the last 2 years.

See your point and still disagree. And I'm not calling him a star by any means or worth what they gave up. Which was a lot I agree. And you are correct all teams do not need an enforcer these days. But some do. If you have some overall team toughness then understand you hit Crosby or Kopitar or McDavid, the first guy closest after the hit takes him on. Sid last played with Guentzel and Sheary. Pitt didn't have hardly any of those guys on this team. Kunitz? Bonino? Yes there's some people back there on D with some size and toughness. But the team is made up of Kessel, Guentzel, Cullen, Hagelin, Rust, Sheary....it's not a team with team toughness so you better reserve a roster spot for a Reeves. And if you don't have one you better pay the cost to get one. Reeves don't take no **** out there if you haven't noticed. This will be a good move. Costly but good. And he's dirt cheap at 1.1m. No brainer.

There's literally zero evidence that goons deter anything or anyone and even if they did, you can pick up these guys everywhere for minimum salary. That's what replacement level means.

He's not a goon. GMJR said the league wasn't doing enough to protect it's star players so he'd go out and get a player that can play and do that. He was protected by the blues and the stats show he has a positive impact when he's on the ice. Again he was traded for a bust prospect and a draft pick 20 spots lower.

Kolesar and Leipsic.in the same locker room? That should go well.

https://youtu.be/6tK0TBGf070

You mean like that analytics fad saying if you out play a team you should win a Stanley cup final?

he makes Tom Wilson look like Eric Lindros, so gl with that

he shouldn't have been protected, and he shouldn't have been traded for anything

you can probably find a bunch of better guys for the goon role on the scrap heap for free

it's a no brainer all right

this Hamonic thing will also be pretty interesting. he seems to be on the decline for the last few years as well, and was quite bad last season. was in the basement for the Islanders in point production, Corsi, Fenwick, shots, and goals. was an amazing -20.3% in goals for. he's only 27yo, so he shouldn't be falling apart already, not sure what this is all about (i'm sure whatever personal issues he was having that caused his trade request will be cited), but obv i hope he ends up being trash for the Flames.

2017 HHOF class should be interesting

- Teemu Selanne is a lock
- Daniel Alfredsson probably should be too, 444 goals & 1,157 points is pretty good considering like his entire career was in the dead puck era
- might be a good time to finally get Mark Recchi in, his counting stats (577 goals & 1,533 points) are fairly insane

then there's Paul Kariya, point per game player in the dead puck era
Dave Andreychuk who probably has to get in at some point because of his 640 goals
Jeremy Roenick who's stats (513g/1216pts) are better than i would have guessed
Theo Fleury who might never get in
while CuJo & AlMo are longshots waiting for an especially weak year probably

SN article also mentioned Saku Koivu, Tim Thomas, and Chris Osgood, but i think those are all pretty massive stretches

Osgood for HHOF is LOL

I'll take him over everyone but a Terry Toporowski comeback.

I agree, but the bar for goalies was lowered a lot last year. You can tell that the old boys club has no idea how to rationally evaluate goalie performance. The "led his team to 3 cups" narrative is going to carry a lot of weight with a certain kind of old school hockey base.

Agree

LOL Jeremy Jacobs HOF

ya, every ****bag owner who hangs around long enough gets in

had to laugh that when announcing Lanny didn't try to justify the selection in any way shape or form, he was just like yo, JJ is in

Alfredsson was probably the 2nd most worthy inductee this time around

but they obv wanted to put Kariya in the same year as Teemu
and these oldz are biased toward the older players like Andreychuk & Recchi
and this stupid thing about being a FIRST BALLOT HOFER (as if it really matters for anything) meant they wanted to differentiate between him and Selanne

He gonna be 2nd pair with Brodie? They prolly won´t take on a lot of the toughest assignments? Could be a decent situation, with some pdo (hello, mike smith) might post a solid plus-minus. Caring about corsi is so 2015. Kinda root for the flames (geddy lee factor), hope they make a bit of a push. Or are the refs still mad at the wideman incident and fart in their general direction?

btw if you wanna talk about underrated HOF candidates, so underrated he didn't even make Sportsnet's 12-man longlist the other day


dmen from 1990-2010

points:
Lidstrom - 1046 (HOF)
Leetch - 887 (HOF)
Blake - 777 (HOF)
Zubov - 771
MacInnis - 768 (HOF)
Niedermayer - 740 (HOF)
Bourque - 739 (HOF)

points per game: (minimum 500pts)
Bourque - 0.90 (HOF)
Coffey - 0.86 (HOF)
MacInnis - 0.86 (HOF)
Leetch - 0.85 (HOF)
Housley - 0.76 (HOF)
Lidstrom - 0.74 (HOF)
Zubov - 0.72
Murphy - 0.71 (HOF)

playoff points:
Lidstrom - 175 (HOF)
Pronger - 120 (HOF)
Zubov - 117
Murphy - 108 (HOF)
Niedermayer - 98 (HOF)

playoff points per game: (minimum 50pts)
Leetch - 1.01 (HOF)
Coffey - 0.88 (HOF)
Bourque - 0.81 (HOF)
MacInnis - 0.76 (HOF)
Murphy - 0.73 (HOF)
Lidstrom - 0.71 (HOF)
Zubov - 0.71


and unlike some of the guys above, Zubov was actually really good defensively
(HRef's d-point share stat has him as #1 defensive player itl in 00-01, and #2 in 05-06)

and he won rangz with 2 different teams

he led the 94 Rangers in points, 5 more than Messier, 10 more than Graves & Leetch

and he won Olympic gold in 1992, defeating a Canadian team featuring Eric Lindros


ridiculous!


PREACH

72off (or someone else with the knowledge)

What are good career benchmarks for the HOF?

Like in baseball 500HR and 300 wins used to be locks (obv things have change a bit)...is there a PPG or is it xxx goals/assists etc that is typically looked on or something I'm missing

Zubov does belong in the hall, definitely underrated.

So happy Kariya got in, one of my favorite players of all-time.

What gets you in the HOF as a forward is generally averaging a point per game for guys who are eligible now. D men is a little different but having lots of points certainly helps. Being a guy who played 30 minutes a game and won championships seems to be a benchmark for a lot of D men going in. For goalies, it's really tough to say. Wins used to matter and same with shutouts and cups but guys like Osgood being at the top of some of these lists suggests that some less than stellar goalies should be getting in so they'll probably have to look at that.

Andreychuk and not Fleury?