There is a salary floor and unused cap can roll forward to future years which is why some teams have a 2017 salary cap of ~$168M and others like the Jags have a 2017 salary cap of ~$200M.

I guess there's so much cap space for 2017 because the NFL accountants didn't do a good a job at hiding their revenue from the PA.

Missed the playoffs by a half game because they scored 25 total points in 2 home games in the last 3 weeks of the season against teams that weren't trying (Panthers & Giants).

I dunno. I don't think Cousins is actually that good, despite the stats he's put up the last year & a half or so. We've had this argument in this thread earlier regarding the value of paying average QBs comparable salaries to star QBs & how I don't think a team can Super Bowl that way, but we'll see what happens.

Salary cap has taken pretty decent jumps over the last couple years, lots of money gets rolled over from year to year, lots of non-guaranteed contracts, lots of people coming up for free agency, new crop of rookies to pay, etc.

it is silly to talk in absolutes about what can't superb owl. they obviously have real equity with cousins even if he makes 25M. certainly more equity imo than having colt mccoy starting or rolling the dice in the draft.

pretty much the only thing consistent in the nfl is that rodgers is good, the patriots are good, and the browns suck.

Yeah, I mean can't is a strong word. I'll go with "never has".

I think the closest example is Eli in the 2nd SB win when he was making 11.1% of cap. Cousins would probably be making about 12%-16% of the Redskins adjusted cap over the course of his contract.

Eli's 2011 stats & Kirk's 2016 stats are remarkably similar:

	Year	Team	G	Att	Comp	Pct	Att/G	Yds	Avg	Yds/G	TD	TD%	Int	Int%	Lng	20+	40+	Sck	SckY	Rate
Eli Manning	2011	New York Giants	16	589	359	61	36.8	4,933	8.4	308.3	29	4.9	16	2.7	99T	67	18	28	199	92.9
Kirk Cousins	2016	Washington Redskins	16	606	406	67	37.9	4,917	8.1	307.3	25	4.1	12	2	80T	69	13	23	190	97.2

2011 Giants were 9-7
2016 Redskins were 8-7-1

A lot of things have to go right to win a SB like that...

Lmao Martellus Bennett is pretty mad on line about people speculating on his free agency

No idea how to embedd tweets on Tapatalk, it's @MartysaurusRex

What % of Denver's cap was Manning making last year? And he was a huge liability.

A lot of ways to skin a cat. You can burn $ on worse things than slightly overpaying a QB. Yeah it is the road less traveled but if you don't have Brady, Ben, Manning, Rodgers or draft Seattle's D then everything is road less traveled.

12%

That was also a very lucky team (as evidenced by what they did in 2016). Not sure how the Peyton example helps your argument that it's worth it to spend on an average QB, though?

Peyton was wayyyy below average that year, he was one of the worst QB's in the league and they won the SB witih him making 12% of cap. So certainly Kirk Cousins who most view as an avg/above avg QB making 12% could pull it off even if it is unlikely.

I don't think it is always worth it but what else are the Redskins gonna do? They've been a solid team last 2 years with Cousins.

So wouldn't it be easier to replicate the rest of the Broncos Super Bowl winning team with an extra $22 million dollars? Since you don't need even an average QB to win a Super Bowl?

Colt McCoy can be wayyyy below average in his sleep.

Maybe you don't need to replicate it because your QB is 2017 Kirk Cousins instead of 2015 Peyton Manning, you just need to be a little better and win a few games you aren't supposed to win.

Von Miller, Chris Harris, Aqib Talib, Demarcus Ware, etc aren't growing on trees either.

It isn't like the Redskins are in position to let Cousins walk, pay Colt 1/4th of what they pay Cousins and then stack their D up.

everyone let me know if this take is heating up the thread but I'm going with it not being easy to just go out and be the best defense in the league

Eli was 8th in DYAR, 9th in DVOA, 16th QBR. Year before he was 15th DYAR, 20th DVOA, 7th QBR. Kirk was 7th or better in all those categories past two years, and top 5 in all three this season.

I know we keep going in roundabouts with Kirk but what more does he have to do? Last year the reasoning was he'd only had a season and a half so needs to do more to get a long term deal, now it's let's see him do it without Desean/Garcon/whoever. If he does it again then what's the excuse?

On a side note comparing the 2011 NFC East to the 2016 NFC East?

It's more of a rhetorical argument technique than a take.

The Redskins would need a very good defense to win a SB with either QB, & the path to get that defense is easier with more money.

I think there's almost no chance the Redskins will actually start McCoy next year unless it's as a placeholder for the #2 pick.

McCoy also makes like 1/6 of what Cousins will, not 1/4. I also don't think McCoy is much worse than Cousins (& he's less than 2 years older) & Cousins benefited from a well-designed offense & tons of open receivers.

Colt McCoy is your guy if you just want to tank. He's not winning the Super Bowl with anything less than the consensus GOAT defense.

If an average QB is underpaid as an asset and you won't pay the average QB, aren't you putting yourself at a disadvantage to the overall market when other teams get to underpay the average QB's? Or all average and above QB's being underpaid.

You are swimming against the tide in terms of value.

That is if you buy the argument that average QB's should get 25 and top QB's should get 50. Give or take.

Based on what? What is the difference between league average or slightly above average starting QB and McCoy who would be a good backup at best. McCoy has been a really bad QB for his entire career while Cousins has 2 years of pretty solid performance despite a good situation. As a 9er fan, I'm not sure I want the guy but if it's just going to be a swap in picks for Cousins, count me in.

The point of the Eli comparison was to say that is the closest, in my opinion, comparable Super Bowl winner. As he was making around 11% of the cap being not great. Then I looked at the basic stats & they were actually very similar, which seemed interesting.

Idk, he could not choke away the playoffs by going 2-4 in his last 6 games, including 3 of his worst 4 games of the season @ Cards, home against Panthers, & home against the Giants who had nothing to play for?

I think most of his stats are empty & he's not that good, & will not live up to a $24/m year contract. I'm happy to be proven wrong, but that's my opinion.

Do you think he's a top 5 QB?

I don't think he's a top 5 QB, but he deserves to be paid top 5 money.

@Cards isn't a cakewalk. I'll give home against the Panthers, he was poor. Even though Giants had nothing to play for it's a division game where all the starters played and a team that allowed a combined 13 points to two playoff teams in the previous three games.

You win Super Bowls by having a great value rookie QB (RW, Flacco, etc.), or by having an elite QB.

I don't think I understand your argument. Aaron Rodgers makes like $21 million per year. Tom Brady makes like $14 million per year. Teams that pay ok QBs more than Aaron Rodgers just haven't been winning. The prime examples include the Ravens, Lions & Bears.

Elite QBs don't make $50m/year, even if Riverman thinks they should. If they did, paying average $25m would make a lot more sense.

Limited sample-size 2 years ago mostly...

	Year	Age	Tm	Pos	No.	G	GS	QBrec	Cmp	Att	Cmp%	Yds	TD	TD%	Int	Int%	Lng	Y/A	AY/A	Y/C	Y/G	Rate	QBR	4QC	GWD	AV
Cousins	2014	26	WAS	qb	8	6	5	1-4	126	204	61.8	1710	10	4.9	9	4.4	81	8.4	7.4	13.6	285	86.4	46.5			4
McCoy	2014	28	WAS	qb	16	5	4	1-3	91	128	71.1	1057	4	3.1	3	2.3	70	8.3	7.8	11.6	211.4	96.4	46.93	1	2	3

It was a lazy comment, though. Cousins is assuredly better than McCoy, but I would rather pay McCoy $3.6m & have the #2 overall pick (which I'd want to then trade out of if possible) than Cousins at $24m.

Have you seen the QB situation in this year's draft?--there is no Luck level prospect much less a 1st round level QB. Are you sure you want to risk not having a solid QB this season? As a fan, I wouldn't risk it even if I have to overpay. I honestly really like Alex Smiff and was pretty annoyed with the change to Krapernick when nothing was really wrong.

I think there are quarterbacks who are talented enough to carry their team, and there are quarterbacks who can succeed if the offensive scheme is designed to their strengths and away from their weaknesses, and they are surrounded by very good talent. I think Cousins is decidedly the latter.

So unless you get Brady/Rodgers value or slightly less value on the QB deal then don't pay QB's? So let them go, draft a rookie/pay journeyman and hope he is good. If he isn't you just go 5-11 forever like the Browns?

The Lions made the playoffs 2 of the last 3 years, and 2 years ago Ravens gave NE all they could handle in the playoffs. It isn't like these teams are having no success whatsoever.

It isn't the best way to build a roster and you probably won't beat the elite teams but unless you draft great for a 3-5 yr stretch or have a top tier QB you probably won't beat them. Don't think paying Cousins/Flacco/Stafford is what is preventing that from happening. These deals are less than what they would get in a free/open market. Just because Rodgers/Brady are mega-heists doesn't make these bad deals.

Agree nath

Godgers could get the browns to 10 wins. Cousins would be the same old 4-12

I guess it depends on my job security

I think the Redskins will be better off long term trading Cousins than keeping him. But I also think the 49ers are better off getting him because of the size of their rebuild & the amount of cap space available. They can pay him a lot of money & still have plenty to roll over.

I think McCloughan is roughly a top 3 GM, & I think he'll make the right choice...

So what would you do if you were the Redskins?

I remember that season the 9ers had their rematch with the Giants from the previous year NFCCG and they lost like 23-3 or something. And I always thought that day was the day they just thought they couldn't win with Smith at QB. Kaep atleast represented upside and the NFL hadn't solved the read option yet. Still think it was the right move.