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View Poll Results: who rang?
Los Angeles Lakers 17 35.42%
Brooklyn Nets 6 12.50%
Milwaukee Bucks 3 6.25%
Los Angeles Clippers 4 8.33%
Boston Celtics 2 4.17%
Philadelphia 76ers 0 0%
Miami Heat 0 0%
Denver Nuggets 4 8.33%
Dallas Mavericks 6 12.50%
other (shoot your shot) 6 12.50%
Voters: 48. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-23-2021, 01:24 AM   #9501
candybar
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

Looks like at least an earlier version of the NBA case book is online:

https://official.nba.com/wp-content/...ok-2017-18.pdf

The case in question is 169 (on page 41).
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Old 06-23-2021, 01:30 AM   #9502
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

Quote:
Originally Posted by candybar View Post
Looks like at least an earlier version of the NBA case book is online:

https://official.nba.com/wp-content/...ok-2017-18.pdf

The case in question is 169 (on page 41).
Nice work.

This is gonna shock most of you, but apparently PokerHero77 did not, in fact, find something that all the ex-NBA coaches and other experts missed.



Lol "ball which is alive" as apparently something different from "live ball".

The rules here seem pretty clear - ball must have a chance to score.

https://official.nba.com/rule-no-11-...e-goaltending/

11-f:
Quote:
Touch any ball from within the playing area that is on its downward flight with an opportunity to score. This is considered to be a “field goal attempt” or trying for a goal.

Last edited by suzzer99; 06-23-2021 at 01:44 AM.
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Old 06-23-2021, 01:40 AM   #9503
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

Saw this stat on Twitter. The starting PGs for Phoenix in first two games of their last two series have a 22/1 A/TO ratio, 44 assists to 2 turnovers. I'm not a math geek but that seems pretty good.

Last edited by Seadood228; 06-23-2021 at 01:46 AM.
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Old 06-23-2021, 01:47 AM   #9504
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

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Originally Posted by PokerHero77 View Post
I think the reffs could have said there was not 100% certainty the ball was not in the cylinder. But the case book makes that irrelevant, so why the 2 minute review?

Perhaps they were reviewing if a Clipper player touched the ball first, which would have put the ball in play satisfying the case book requirement.

I did not hear what the reffs or announcers said afterward. But somebody told me what Jaffe said about the Booker off foul and I can probably ignore most of it.
I think they were mainly checking how much time to put back on the clock
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Old 06-23-2021, 01:51 AM   #9505
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

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Originally Posted by vinivici9586 View Post
fyp
Maybe, but the Suns were about the third best team this year overall during the year. I thought it was because they were the most healthy and you'd see them thinned out in the playoffs, but I was certainly wrong. Generally these series seem to devolve into stars being stars and then slowly, almost one-by-one, you'll see role players become less and less reliable until it turns into a rock-fight down the stretch.

I thought given the Suns lack of apex superstars that they'd struggle, but if anything their system and collective IQ has made them even stronger. Perhaps if they are pushed we'll see them struggle a bit, but they are playing with a ton of confidence right now.

If MIL makes it past Atlanta I think I like the Suns.
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Old 06-23-2021, 02:11 AM   #9506
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

Not sure how well Lopez would hold up vs Suns, and Bucks don't exactly have the depth to go small for long stretches. Also, tough to do that vs Ayton if you can't spread him out, which the Bucks really can't. No 1 leg Harden to milk on D over and over either.

As the Bucks/Nets series is in the rearview mirror I find myself downgrading the Bucks even though they won the series, they struggled to score against a team with 2 good defensive players in KD and Bruce Brown. Blake was solid defending Giannis/the rim but had issues in space. Harden/Harris/Shamet awful. Suns have no one like that.
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Old 06-23-2021, 03:47 AM   #9507
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

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Originally Posted by LFC_USA View Post
Playoff P might be the biggest mental midget in the league. Damn. Actually feel sorry for him
George played well in this game He's not Ben Simmons
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Old 06-23-2021, 04:13 AM   #9508
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

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Originally Posted by Seadood228 View Post
Maybe, but the Suns were about the third best team this year overall during the year. I thought it was because they were the most healthy and you'd see them thinned out in the playoffs, but I was certainly wrong. Generally these series seem to devolve into stars being stars and then slowly, almost one-by-one, you'll see role players become less and less reliable until it turns into a rock-fight down the stretch.

I thought given the Suns lack of apex superstars that they'd struggle, but if anything their system and collective IQ has made them even stronger. Perhaps if they are pushed we'll see them struggle a bit, but they are playing with a ton of confidence right now.

If MIL makes it past Atlanta I think I like the Suns.
It's been exactly this in the playoffs too. Lakers minus AD, Denver minus Murray, Clippers minus Kawhi. Sweeping Denver was still impressive I suppose, but honestly they haven't done anything really to raise opinion of them above what it was entering playoffs IMO. It's just that literally everyone else in the West has fallen apart.
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Old 06-23-2021, 05:23 AM   #9509
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

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Originally Posted by LFC_USA View Post
I thought this during round 1. Is it possible that the 3 real teams in the top 5 of that 2018 draft (lol Kings, lol Mempis) don't re-do their picks given the chance?
I'm a big Luka fan, but for the moment he's more Westbrook than LeBron.

Trae and Ayton landed in better situations but both are really thriving. Neither of those teams is in the conference finals without them.
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Old 06-23-2021, 06:04 AM   #9510
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

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Originally Posted by PokerHero77 View Post
WTF are you talking about? Read the rule. Does it say the ball must be "live"?
"Touch any ball from within the playing area when it is above the basket ring and within the imaginary cylinder."

The very rule you quoted says it's not goaltending as the ball is not from within the playing area.
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Old 06-23-2021, 06:24 AM   #9511
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

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Originally Posted by Seadood228 View Post
Maybe, but the Suns were about the third best team this year overall during the year. I thought it was because they were the most healthy and you'd see them thinned out in the playoffs, but I was certainly wrong. Generally these series seem to devolve into stars being stars and then slowly, almost one-by-one, you'll see role players become less and less reliable until it turns into a rock-fight down the stretch.

I thought given the Suns lack of apex superstars that they'd struggle, but if anything their system and collective IQ has made them even stronger. Perhaps if they are pushed we'll see them struggle a bit, but they are playing with a ton of confidence right now.

If MIL makes it past Atlanta I think I like the Suns.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seadood228 View Post
Same way I felt after game 2 last round. Suns too good with a depleted squad. They are having a magical, Dallas 2011-like season rn.
+1

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seadood228 View Post
Maybe, but the Suns were about the third best team this year overall during the year. I thought it was because they were the most healthy and you'd see them thinned out in the playoffs, but I was certainly wrong. Generally these series seem to devolve into stars being stars and then slowly, almost one-by-one, you'll see role players become less and less reliable until it turns into a rock-fight down the stretch.

I thought given the Suns lack of apex superstars that they'd struggle, but if anything their system and collective IQ has made them even stronger. Perhaps if they are pushed we'll see them struggle a bit, but they are playing with a ton of confidence right now.

If MIL makes it past Atlanta I think I like the Suns.
Well said.
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Old 06-23-2021, 07:23 AM   #9512
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

what a game, sad I missed it....
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Old 06-23-2021, 10:13 AM   #9513
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

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Old 06-23-2021, 10:34 AM   #9514
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

So much hate for a guy who scored 6 points in the final minute including two potential game winners. To be fair I guess everyone forgot about all those plays since they happened like 30 minutes earlier. If you have the option to pause/record NBA games and you're still watching them live, you're doing it wrong.
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Old 06-23-2021, 10:49 AM   #9515
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

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So much hate for a guy who scored 6 points in the final minute including two potential game winners. To be fair I guess everyone forgot about all those plays since they happened like 30 minutes earlier. If you have the option to pause/record NBA games and you're still watching them live, you're doing it wrong.
Yeah I feel really bad for PG.
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Old 06-23-2021, 11:12 AM   #9516
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

Lol. Don't do Book dirty like that.
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Old 06-23-2021, 12:40 PM   #9517
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

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Not sure how well Lopez would hold up vs Suns, and Bucks don't exactly have the depth to go small for long stretches. Also, tough to do that vs Ayton if you can't spread him out, which the Bucks really can't. No 1 leg Harden to milk on D over and over either.

As the Bucks/Nets series is in the rearview mirror I find myself downgrading the Bucks even though they won the series, they struggled to score against a team with 2 good defensive players in KD and Bruce Brown. Blake was solid defending Giannis/the rim but had issues in space. Harden/Harris/Shamet awful. Suns have no one like that.
Why wouldn't Lopez hold up?

They didn't attack Harden on D at all. He hid on Tucker mostly and the bucks didn't involve him.

I think the nets, Blake in particular, did a good job on Giannis, and Milwaukee just ran bad shooting the ball. That's kind of the thing with Giannis though, the Suns would probably play good D vs him and things would look ugly at times but he is still such a freak that he's going to go like 8 BPM. Which is kind of hard to overcome when your best player is like a 4 BPM guy.

Beating the nets with KD playing the way he was and with Blake, Bruce Brown, and even Jeff Green stepping up is still a nice win. Also overcoming those game 7 refs.

I think Suns-Bucks would be a close series though. Yesterday before game 2, when both teams had about the same odds to win their conference finals, Milwaukee was -105 to title and Phoenix was +130 if I recall.
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Old 06-23-2021, 03:16 PM   #9518
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

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Originally Posted by businessdude View Post
don't see any controversy - last touched by Booker, easy call.

JVG is clueless.
Yeah this is an obviously correct call given the rules. However, they should probably change the rule such that it penalizes the person who last started contact with the ball, opposed to the last person who remained in contact with the ball. So if you are in contact with the ball entire time, someone else causing the ball to roll off of you doesn't count as you touching it last, but the ball bouncing off you still does. I think that's much closer to how the rule has historically been applied in the absence of a replay.
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Old 06-23-2021, 03:18 PM   #9519
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

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Why wouldn't Lopez hold up?

They didn't attack Harden on D at all. He hid on Tucker mostly and the bucks didn't involve him.
To be fair to Bud here, Tucker had to (a) rest for D and (b) I'm not sure he could have even taken advantage of Harden. For all of his warts, Harden is a super good defender if getting backed down. I think this series will be far more indicative of Tucker's potential involvement in a PHX series, seeing if MIL tries to post and back down Trae will be more indicative for whoever guards him for PHX (Booker?). Tucker isn't someone who is going to run off a ton of screens and I don't think he's a great pick and pop threat from the wing, more of a corner 3 guy. He's the perfect place to hide Harden.
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Old 06-23-2021, 03:22 PM   #9520
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

Yeah I agree with that. It’s hard to involve Tucker so he’s a good person to hide someone on. I was just pointing out that they didn’t milk Harden on D over and over like the other poster said.
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Old 06-23-2021, 05:02 PM   #9521
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

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Yeah I agree with that. It’s hard to involve Tucker so he’s a good person to hide someone on. I was just pointing out that they didn’t milk Harden on D over and over like the other poster said.
Harden is a good one on one defender, especially if he tries which he will do if he thinks you are targeting him. He is just awful at team defense and rotations.
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Old 06-23-2021, 05:43 PM   #9522
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

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Originally Posted by candybar View Post
Yeah this is an obviously correct call given the rules. However, they should probably change the rule such that it penalizes the person who last started contact with the ball, opposed to the last person who remained in contact with the ball. So if you are in contact with the ball entire time, someone else causing the ball to roll off of you doesn't count as you touching it last, but the ball bouncing off you still does. I think that's much closer to how the rule has historically been applied in the absence of a replay.
This is obviously the intention of the rule and how it has been given the whole time up until now. You could even (at a linguistic stretch) interpret the current rules as meaning this (it says "touched it last" not "was touching it last", one could argue to "touch" something is the action of initiating contact with it. Obviously not the most natural interpretation I'll admit but when there is history/intent on your side...). But agreed they should definitely clean it up as being clearly your definition.
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Old 06-23-2021, 05:53 PM   #9523
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

Calling that ball out on Booker is similar to what's happened in baseball with replay. You'll have a guy slide into a base, clearly safe, but he'll do a pop up slide and slow-mo replay shows his spikes came off the bag by an inch. By rule, since the tag was kept on him, he's out. I think most will agree that's not what replay was meant for. But what can you do? Out is out.
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Old 06-23-2021, 06:10 PM   #9524
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

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Originally Posted by candybar View Post
Yeah this is an obviously correct call given the rules. However, they should probably change the rule such that it penalizes the person who last started contact with the ball, opposed to the last person who remained in contact with the ball. So if you are in contact with the ball entire time, someone else causing the ball to roll off of you doesn't count as you touching it last, but the ball bouncing off you still does. I think that's much closer to how the rule has historically been applied in the absence of a replay.
I didn't realize calls in the past were not ruled like this one was. But I think if a player can cause a slight losing of the grip off the ball by the dribbler, more power to him. I look at it like if the defender poked the ball causing the defender to fumble the ball OOB, then still a turnover. This case here is like the defender caused a micro-fumble.
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Old 06-23-2021, 06:13 PM   #9525
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2020-2021

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So much hate for a guy who scored 6 points in the final minute including two potential game winners. To be fair I guess everyone forgot about all those plays since they happened like 30 minutes earlier. If you have the option to pause/record NBA games and you're still watching them live, you're doing it wrong.
mehh, missing 2 FT's like that in the final 10 seconds for a 86% FT shooter or w/e is pretty bad. Term choke is overused in sports but not sure what else to call it.

Pause/record is kinda meh for sporting events. I'm interested in the result and would like to see it live.

Last edited by Onlydo2days; 06-23-2021 at 06:32 PM.
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