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Old 10-19-2020, 07:46 PM   #17501
GodgersWOAT
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2019-2020

Westbrook in the Mecca is a top 50 STORY no question.
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Old 10-19-2020, 08:09 PM   #17502
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2019-2020

I actually think Chris Paul might be a Knick next year
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Old 10-20-2020, 01:40 AM   #17503
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2019-2020

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I actually think Chris Paul might be a Knick next year
I'd say Lakers, but it's so hard for them to acquire him (might even not be possible aorn, I'm too lazy to check).

So I also feel pretty confident the Knicks will trade for him. WHEN THEY SHOULD BE TANKING! JFC.
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Old 10-20-2020, 04:01 AM   #17504
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2019-2020

Luka at least in same tier as Curry, Kawhi and Harden. He's already better than Harden.
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Old 10-20-2020, 04:35 AM   #17505
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2019-2020

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Originally Posted by candybar View Post
We already went over this. The Warriors net rating without KD in the playoffs was just 0.0. They were fine, but not great without KD. This includes all of the wins you're talking about, so they must have been especially bad outside of those. You can't just exclude that. There also were a bunch of games KD did play, and the Warriors didn't look that great. You can't exclude that either. If you're trying to evaluate teams, you have to be able to use some kind methodology that would apply to any team, not just this team. You can't just cherry pick a handful of games, create a narrative around it, and use it to prove something. You can make these kinds of narratives around any team to make them look better.
Playoffs are always "a handful of games", so narratives will be for any analysis. I mean the Warriors blew the Rockets out by 40 points in the 2018 playoffs. Are they significantly worse if in junk time Rockets got that back to 10 points? I mean it moves their average winning margin by 2 ppg.

I mean the numbers show that the Warriors are pretty good without Durant. You've used the on and offs for Durant during the regular season. There's a simple reason for that. Curry played about 25% of the minutes Durant didn't play (they're +13pp 100 in those minutes fwiw). So, yes, if Curry only plays 25% of our minutes next year, we're probably going to suck.

You can't ignore that they went well in the playoffs before they hit the wall with injury when Durant was out, or their success in games when Durant was missing in his time there.
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Old 10-20-2020, 12:46 PM   #17506
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2019-2020

So we have more rankings today

Ill post Partnows 78-39

4A: Oladipo Tobias Harris SGA Ingram brook Lopez CJ Gallinari Derrick Rose DeRozan Danny green Sabonis FVV ingles Dragić Hayward wall Nurkic Aldridge Brogdon PJ Tucker smart vucevic Covington

4B: LaVine Dinwiddie Rubio Beverley Otto Porter joe Harris JJ Redick Conley Harrell Myles Turner OG Anunoby Lou Will Jaren Jackson Mike Conley John Collins Eric Bledsoe Caris LeVert Bojan bogdanovic
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Old 10-21-2020, 02:35 PM   #17507
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2019-2020

LaMelo Frank RJ Gallo Mitch w/ Fred VanVleet 6th man of the year.

Death lineup of VanVleet LaMelo Frank RJ Gallo

I'd **** w/ dat
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Old 10-21-2020, 05:12 PM   #17508
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2019-2020

I'd **** w/ dat too THAY THAY!

That's a spicy Italian meatball!
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Old 10-21-2020, 07:45 PM   #17509
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2019-2020

Who gains more weight in Nola next season between SVG and Zion?
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Old 10-21-2020, 08:11 PM   #17510
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2019-2020

I wonder how much SVG can do for their defense.

Zion needs to slim down to a svelte 265 lbs with a heavy cardio regimen.
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Old 10-21-2020, 09:30 PM   #17511
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2019-2020

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Originally Posted by All-inMcLovin View Post
I'd say Lakers, but it's so hard for them to acquire him (might even not be possible aorn, I'm too lazy to check).



So I also feel pretty confident the Knicks will trade for him. WHEN THEY SHOULD BE TANKING! JFC.
Seems the Knicks have been rebuilding for 20 years
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Old 10-21-2020, 11:46 PM   #17512
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2019-2020

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I mean the numbers show that the Warriors are pretty good without Durant. You've used the on and offs for Durant during the regular season. There's a simple reason for that. Curry played about 25% of the minutes Durant didn't play (they're +13pp 100 in those minutes fwiw). So, yes, if Curry only plays 25% of our minutes next year, we're probably going to suck.
Again, I think you're missing the point of these numbers. The point isn't that the Warriors were terrible without Durant - they were obviously a pretty good team even without KD, just as the Raptors were without Kawhi - but that the numbers went from absurd (2017) to normal (2019). Which supports the thesis that the 17 Warriors and the 19 Warriors were very different in terms of their overall quality. Of course starters play more together than not, that's not the point.

Also re:

Quote:
Curry played about 25% of the minutes Durant didn't play (they're +13pp 100 in those minutes fwiw).
Where are you getting this? For 18-19,

Curry was +13.2 in 2321 MP
Curry/Durant was +15.7 in 1854 MP

So if you do the math (assuming relatively constant pace) Curry without Durant must have been roughly -3.3. Again, I fully acknowledge that the 2017 Warriors likely were the most loaded super team ever and the 2018 Warriors were still an all-time great team, well above mere championship level teams. My point is that the evidence points to the 2019 Warriors being substantially worse. This happens to every top team - the Pistons from 90 to 91 to 92, the Lakers from 02 to 03, the Heat from 12/13 to 14, etc, etc. Dominance is difficult to sustain and playing in the Finals for 5 straight years is going to be mentally and physical exhausting. The Warriors were so good in 2017 that even a substantial decline, they were at worst a top-2 team, but it looks like they declined just like all great teams eventually do.
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Old 10-22-2020, 01:42 AM   #17513
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2019-2020

Oh the 2019 Warriors were clearly far worse. This shouldnt even be a debate. I posted this last week but Draymond at the 5 defensively in 2019 playoffs was not good, way way way worse than before

2017 was as dominant as any team in NBA history up there with 86 Boston, 96 Chicago etc.

2019 was not some special team. That Houston series before KD went down end of the 3rd quarter in game 5 was as dead even as it gets. And Houston was far worse than in 2018 also. They blew 2 games to LAC. They were beatable had they won a title in 2019 and you ranked all the title teams in NBA history they wouldve definitely been below average on such a list.

What the KD injury did was

1) The Warriors offensive rating skyrocketed for the last 5 quarters of that Hou series the moment it happened, Hou actually had more trouble defending them without KD

2) It brought focus, a sense of urgency and not just taking stretches off. They lose 2 games to LAC in rd 1 with KD but sweep Portland while super banged up....hmmm

The entire vibe was different. But the KD/Steph Warriors it was just so hard to keep focus, energy, drive etc 3 yrs in. And it showed. Im not saying GSW wouldnt have beaten Toronto if healthy but Ill say this: Toronto was definitely capable of beating the GSW team you saw pre KD injury those first 2 rounds. Still think in the NBA Finals GSW probably wouldve rose to the occasion enough to pull it out but it wouldve been hard they wouldve gotten pushed good. Ultimately focus and being engaged is why they blew the 2016 Finals they were flat out better. Had complete control of the series. But they did **** like completely no show the first halves of game 3 and game 6, not bother making adjustments etc and it kept the door slightly open for hte Cavs. You keep giving the opponent a chance and dont put them away eventually theyll catch a break and hit the high end of their variance for a stretch. And that's what happened, Kyrie and LeBron got super hot the series flipped GSW didnt know what to do and everything cascaded from there

Last edited by GrapesofRath; 10-22-2020 at 01:53 AM.
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Old 10-23-2020, 08:16 PM   #17514
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2019-2020

Quote:
Originally Posted by candybar View Post
Again, I think you're missing the point of these numbers. The point isn't that the Warriors were terrible without Durant - they were obviously a pretty good team even without KD, just as the Raptors were without Kawhi - but that the numbers went from absurd (2017) to normal (2019). Which supports the thesis that the 17 Warriors and the 19 Warriors were very different in terms of their overall quality. Of course starters play more together than not, that's not the point.

Also re:



Where are you getting this? For 18-19,

Curry was +13.2 in 2321 MP
Curry/Durant was +15.7 in 1854 MP

So if you do the math (assuming relatively constant pace) Curry without Durant must have been roughly -3.3. Again, I fully acknowledge that the 2017 Warriors likely were the most loaded super team ever and the 2018 Warriors were still an all-time great team, well above mere championship level teams. My point is that the evidence points to the 2019 Warriors being substantially worse. This happens to every top team - the Pistons from 90 to 91 to 92, the Lakers from 02 to 03, the Heat from 12/13 to 14, etc, etc. Dominance is difficult to sustain and playing in the Finals for 5 straight years is going to be mentally and physical exhausting. The Warriors were so good in 2017 that even a substantial decline, they were at worst a top-2 team, but it looks like they declined just like all great teams eventually do.
Apologies, they were +13 for the 3 years, not 2019. In 2019 they were "only" +6 according to cleaning the glass on limited minutes (less than 1000 possessions).
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Old 10-23-2020, 08:20 PM   #17515
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2019-2020

Warriors being discussed as nauseam in a historical thread is apt.
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Old 10-23-2020, 08:39 PM   #17516
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2019-2020

I purposely didn't bring it over to the other thread to not ruin it. And I'm sure cb thought the same.
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Old 10-23-2020, 08:41 PM   #17517
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2019-2020

No, no, this is definitely where WarriorsTalk belongs

The past.
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Old 10-24-2020, 05:07 AM   #17518
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2019-2020

OH SNAP!
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Old 10-24-2020, 12:38 PM   #17519
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2019-2020

Lock it up AiM
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Old 10-24-2020, 04:41 PM   #17520
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2019-2020

lol I'm not a mod.

Even though I play one on TV.
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Old 10-24-2020, 05:14 PM   #17521
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2019-2020

We need an NBA mod in this forum. I nominate you!
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Old 10-24-2020, 05:20 PM   #17522
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Re: NBA Season Thread 2019-2020

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