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View Poll Results: results of this series
cavs in 4 6 6.90%
cavs in 5 25 28.74%
cavs in 6 25 28.74%
cavs in 7 7 8.05%
celts in 4 2 2.30%
celts in 5 2 2.30%
celts in 6 8 9.20%
celts in 7 12 13.79%
Voters: 87. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 05-06-2010, 06:54 PM   #1151
EPiPeN11
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

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Originally Posted by SchererBoy View Post
Jordan is the only who played the same position, and he's not that good obv.

The rest all play diff. positions, and are asked to do different things. So if I were to choose someone off that list it would be a personal preference, and I wouldn't be able to back it with facts or anything since they have to perform differently.
ok fair enough, i'll phrase it like this then. say ur starting an nba franchise from scratch and u get all these guys as rookies. u have the #x pick and the player had to be a mostly 1990s+ player (in other words no magic/bird) but if u took jordan/hakeem etc u still get their careers in the 80s too. what are the players u'd pick ahead of kobe?
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Old 05-06-2010, 06:56 PM   #1152
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

Well that's sort of the same thing, I only need one SG and I'm going to take MJ.

What SG from the 90s+ would you pick over Kobe? Other than MJ
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Old 05-06-2010, 06:56 PM   #1153
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

jordan and thats it.

cmon epi, you know what his answer is.
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Old 05-06-2010, 06:56 PM   #1154
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

ok now u have the 2nd pick in the draft as mj was already taken, who do u take?
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Old 05-06-2010, 06:59 PM   #1155
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

So I have the 2nd pick and Jordan was taken, I'm taking Kobe. Like I said, this is a personal choice for everyone.

Could you tell me what SG u take ahead of Kobe from 1990 on, other than Michael.
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Old 05-06-2010, 07:00 PM   #1156
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

so u just took kobe over shaq/duncan/hakeem/drob/kg etc? lol

back it up with facts on why kobe is a better player than those guys for ur franchise pls

off the top of my head yes kobe is the 2nd best SG from 1990 on, however hes clearly not the 2nd best player
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Old 05-06-2010, 07:02 PM   #1157
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

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And, I said LBJ had played 7 seasons which wasn't half of Kobe's 14, I meant including Kobe's playoff games. 6 Finals runs is almost 1.5 seasons, not including the rest of the years. So ya, it looked dumb because I didn't clarify it correctly lol

FWIW,
Kobe has played a total of 1021+183 = 1204 games.
Lebron has played a total of 548+67 = 615 games.

1204 < 615 * 2.

It still looks dumb.
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Old 05-06-2010, 07:04 PM   #1158
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

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FWIW,
Kobe has played a total of 1021+183 = 1204 games.
Lebron has played a total of 548+67 = 615 games.

1204 < 615 * 2.

It still looks dumb.
dont respond with actual numbers!
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Old 05-06-2010, 07:04 PM   #1159
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

Oh no, I would take Shaq lol I misread you. Shaq was clearly NBA ready from day 1, and dominated for at least his first 10 seasons. I would choose a Center over a SG simply because there aren't many other Centers to stop him, and he would/did attract tons of attention. However, Shaq is the only center I would take first.

I would choose Kobe over Duncan/KG/Hakeem though, and I'm not sure I would put David Robinson on that list, but again, That's my personal choice.
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Old 05-06-2010, 07:08 PM   #1160
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

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I would choose Kobe over Duncan/KG/Hakeem though, and I'm not sure I would put David Robinson on that list, but again, That's my personal choice.
back it up with facts pls
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Old 05-06-2010, 07:17 PM   #1161
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

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And, I said LBJ had played 7 seasons which wasn't half of Kobe's 14, I meant including Kobe's playoff games. 6 Finals runs is almost 1.5 seasons, not including the rest of the years. So ya, it looked dumb because I didn't clarify it correctly lol

FWIW,
Kobe has played a total of 1021+183 = 1204 games.
Lebron has played a total of 548+67 = 615 games.

1204 < 615 * 2.

It still looks dumb.
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Old 05-06-2010, 07:36 PM   #1162
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

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EDIT: I remember watching NBAtv and they said that Kareem had never won a championship until Magic showed up. So wouldn't that put guys like Wilt, Russell, Shaq and even Hakeem, ahead of Kareem?

Kareem won a ship in Milwaukee.
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Old 05-06-2010, 08:42 PM   #1163
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

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Kareem won a ship in Milwaukee.
On this note, while we're sidetracked, is having Oscar in my Top 3 all that bad?
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Old 05-06-2010, 08:52 PM   #1164
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

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back it up with facts pls
Well, I'm not going to back it up with stats and numbers, because as I said before, they each play diff. positions, and will be asked to do diff. things. And I'm in no way saying that these players aren't great, they're all HOF for sure.

Choosing Shaq, or Kobe or Bill Walton would all be a personal choice.
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Old 05-06-2010, 08:56 PM   #1165
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

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On this note, while we're sidetracked, is having Oscar in my Top 3 all that bad?

Check out 1961-62.


http://www.basketball-reference.com/...roberos01.html
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Old 05-06-2010, 09:03 PM   #1166
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

Only one to ever do it, no?...and as he would say "and we couldn't carry the damn ball either"
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Old 05-06-2010, 10:52 PM   #1167
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

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epinen the reason i say you and many others are ******s is that you are talkin about **** that happened in the 60s with such assertion. i wouldnt even dare make a list of GOAT because i cant speak about stuff pre 1995 with all the facts. i doubt you are an old guy or have watched tons and tons of tapes of every team that played 30-50 years ago so how the hell do you expect to have any credibility with your statements? what id appreciate is if you can explain to me what russell did bad on offense, give more insight into the "countless" times wilt abused russell, and talk about the specific other player matchups which allowed celtics to still do okay.


They played against each other 142(!) times.

Chamberlain averaged 28.7 pts and 28.7 rebs.
Russell averaged 14.5 and 23.7
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Old 05-06-2010, 11:01 PM   #1168
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

so wilt scored 1.4 pts less than his career average and 5.8 rebs more than his career average

but ya russell dominated him!
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Old 05-06-2010, 11:09 PM   #1169
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

Chamberlain averaged exactly 28.7 points and 28.7 rebounds a game during those 142 games, the point totals brought down a bit by his late-in-career transformation from relentless scoring machine to more well-rounded player. In the early years Wilt scored 50 or more points seven times against Russell, including a high of 62 on January 14, 1962
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Old 05-06-2010, 11:10 PM   #1170
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

RANGZZZZZZZ
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Old 05-06-2010, 11:18 PM   #1171
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

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i don't disagree with you guys if you have kobe out side of 10. i was just looking at a list that has him on top 9 and it made sense. I haven't created my own top 10 but i don't think kobe is top 5 or even best Laker ever. But if he wins the title this year he moves up on the list for sure. All I want to know is since kobe is not top 10 is the ringless lebron in top 10?
Jesus just stop.

Kobe won rings when he was young with Shaq, and old with Pau.

What did he do when he was in his prime? Yes, first round exits or missing the playoffs.

His TEAM did it, not just him. If it was just him, he wouldn't have been sitting on his ass at home during the playoffs every year of his prime

Kobe does not get the rings argument. Jordan does.
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Old 05-06-2010, 11:20 PM   #1172
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

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Only one to ever do it, no?...and as he would say "and we couldn't carry the damn ball either"

Take a look at team averages for scoring in that era compared to now. League average for scoring that year was 118ppg (heh). More possessions=increase in bulk stats. Was just a different game then, so you can't really compare his numbers straight up with Bron's.

* Not that he wasn't a beast obv
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Old 05-06-2010, 11:23 PM   #1173
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

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Was actually going to just post something like this but refrained because we had this argument in the decade thread. Garnett might be the most underrated player of all-time, and I hate his guts.
+1 Its the same thing as Kobe being overrated. Because Kobe won 4 rings in the years before and after his prime. Garnett won 1, and it was of course "because of his teammates."

If Garnett won 2 in his first couple years in the league, he is ranked way higher, even though it's obvious his team won/lost those rings and he would've been a 2nd fiddle at that point.
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Old 05-06-2010, 11:24 PM   #1174
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

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Wait, I just read this...You guys have KG>>> Kobe and/or Duncan? KG might have been a good basketball player and a great defender, but he never did anything with the teams he was on. At one point the guy couldn't get out of the first round. So it's not like he was doing all this winning despite being on a really bad team. When he made it to Boston they had (including him) 3 HOF, and an upcoming PG.

I think Kobe won the Player of the Decade because of making 6 Finals appearances. He won 4/6 and Duncan "only" made 3. Also, you have to consider the markets in which they play, San Antonio isn't New York or anything, hell it's not even Houston.

And, I said LBJ had played 7 seasons which wasn't half of Kobe's 14, I meant including Kobe's playoff games. 6 Finals runs is almost 1.5 seasons, not including the rest of the years. So ya, it looked dumb because I didn't clarify it correctly lol
lol, sounds like Kobe's prime.
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Old 05-06-2010, 11:25 PM   #1175
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Re: NBA Eastern Conference Playoffs: Cavaliers vs Celtics

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some of duncan's supporting casts have been overrated imo. when they won in 02-03 david robinson was the 2nd best player. he was 37 and still good but nowhere near great while parker and ginobili were only decent at that stage. that team played the nets (lol) in the nba finals, but beat the defending champ lakers en route and duncan absolutely beasted those playoffs. obligatory lol per but look at the playoff #'s for the spurs that year
Robinson always underrated(Maybe not at 37), but he always seemed underrated to me
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