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Old 05-14-2008, 02:54 AM   #2051
Seadood228
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Originally Posted by kidcolin View Post
false, I'll leave it at that.
There are a few 20ppg guys around .590 and one oft-injured guy at .594, but that's still a ways behind .614.. You don't think that's a big gap? Speaking of volume shooters of course.

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Because sometimes you're going to be relied upon to score when it isn't convenient. It also limits the roles of teammates somewhat. I'm not against off-ball screens at all, they're an effective weapon, but it bothers me when that's pretty much all you run.
Reggie could score when needed, how else would you explain his last second heroics in all those playoff games? It's not like that was all they ran, but they did use it a lot.

Last edited by Seadood228; 05-14-2008 at 03:14 AM.
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Old 05-14-2008, 02:55 AM   #2052
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Originally Posted by horizon View Post
he doesn't have to pick a shooting guard.
There's a couple of players that are clearly better than miller
that are still available. Plus, you can get shooting in later rounds.
There's a player who suffered injury latter in this career who's incredible value right now considering guys like Marion have been taken.
We've already talked about this...stop it please.
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Old 05-14-2008, 02:58 AM   #2053
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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I would have banked on a couple 20 PPG 3point sharpshooters from the 80s to have fallen to the 2nd round before taking Miller.

this too...stop! Giving hints about players is the same as naming them. In fact it could be argued that its worse because only a few people may be able to figure out the hints so it helps some but not others.
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Old 05-14-2008, 02:59 AM   #2054
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Come on that could be a couple of players, but okay, it wasprobably useless to say it anyway
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Old 05-14-2008, 03:12 AM   #2055
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

ok my bad, again. I would edit I werent already quoted.
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Old 05-14-2008, 03:17 AM   #2056
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

-**** Reggie Miller. Cheating bastard shoved Greg Anthony to the ground. That game never happened. He didn't ruin my childhood. *******. I hate him. KAJFKLJAF:S

-I think some of the past few picks have been interesting/stretches. I agree with someone who said that knowledge of 80s/early 90s players will be critical.

-Lastly, I will defend the Kidd pick til the bitter end. Saying GP is world's better is a little absurd to me. I think they're pretty close and that Kidd allows me to be alot more flexible.
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Old 05-14-2008, 03:19 AM   #2057
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

I can only think of one off the top of my head. To basketball-reference I go!
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Old 05-14-2008, 03:21 AM   #2058
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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I think they're pretty close and that Kidd allows me to be alot more flexible.
I've seen this said a few times. How so? What about GP pigeonholes you?
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Old 05-14-2008, 03:24 AM   #2059
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

I'm thinking mainly offensively on that statement. They're both going to be solid in the halfcourt offense with GP basically having a better ability to post up smaller PGs. However, I think Kidd on a running team blows GP out of the water. Depending on how the draft shakes out, I'm planning on getting some guys to run along side Kidd.

Also, I realize GP is the glove and was an amazing defender but Kidd really is/was a pretty solid defender too. I won't say he was on GP's level but I think people really have CP3 torching an older Kidd too fresh in their minds. Kidd in his prime was one hell of a player and he still is.
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Old 05-14-2008, 03:41 AM   #2060
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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I'm going to be a nit here. there is no such thing as an inefficient 20/10/5. lol. here are the people to have accomplished such a feat:
Charles Barkley
Larry Bird
Kevin Garnett
(and 1 other guy I'll leave nameless)

Also going to bed, but, you're better off saying people are drafting guys who play offense and defense rather then just offense.
What I meant earlier was that there are plenty of guys who'll get you 20points with a decent shooting percentage, and even more that'll give you 10 boards or 5 assists. There are only a handful who'd get you 20 shooting .600+ TS, and they've all long since been picked. Not only did Reggie do that, but he completely wore out whomever was guarding him from running through all those screens. And with the exception of just a couple who've also long-since been picked, was one of the sickest players when it mattered most.

And for a guy who had a fair amount of post-season success, his supporting cast wasn't up to the level of some that have been mentioned. During their runs on the mid 90s, a teammate of his made it to the ASG a total of 1 time.

I think there are better overall players than Reggie, but he is one of the few left who does something better than anyone else. And in a league where we can draft specialists, versatility isn't as important as it would be in the real world.

Last edited by Seadood228; 05-14-2008 at 03:49 AM.
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Old 05-14-2008, 03:48 AM   #2061
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

You guys are totally underrating Reggie's trashtalking. One, its entertaining. Two, Michael Jordan getting suspending for a game in the playoffs is huge(possibly two or more games suspension in today's NBA).

Add a few Bad Boys, hire Kermit Washington as your fighting coach, and you have the scrappiest team in the league.
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Old 05-14-2008, 03:52 AM   #2062
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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?
!
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Old 05-14-2008, 04:41 AM   #2063
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Its funny that the Suns had 4 of the top 32 picks in this draft on their team this year (albeit a combo of Nash, Stoudamire, Shaq/Marion) and a guy who will be a top 100 pick (Hill) and they nearly got swept in the playoffs this year. Wow.

EDIT: Make that 5 of the top 33 picks in the draft with 4 man combos. Unreal. Can I just take this current Suns team with everyone of them in their primes? (I think this would be the greatest team ever)
Better than the 2004 Lakers?
Payton, Malone, Shaq, Kobe.

2003 Spurs?
Robinson, Duncan, Ginobili, Parker, Bowen. All in primes. Yowza!
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Old 05-14-2008, 05:33 AM   #2064
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

edited because I'm an idiot and misunderstood

Last edited by Assani Fisher; 05-14-2008 at 05:58 AM.
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Old 05-14-2008, 05:39 AM   #2065
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

He's saying if the 2003 Spurs were all in primes.

I think the Lakers win out though, but it's damn close.
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Old 05-14-2008, 05:59 AM   #2066
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Spurs also had Steve Smith, Malik Rose, Steve Kerr, and Stephen Jackson who had decent primes.
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Old 05-14-2008, 06:00 AM   #2067
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

What about the 02-03 Wizards if MJ and Dixon were both in their primes!!!
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Old 05-14-2008, 06:02 AM   #2068
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Man my pick (two more before me) is looking tough as hell. All this waiting is letting doubt creep in.

Was surprised at the Hill pick, obviously injuries are a major concern there. The Marion pick I like, he's great to build around as long as you get a primary scoring option in there somewhere. Reggie Miller's good too, best at what he did, theres definitely not four or five better SG's available as others have said.
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Old 05-14-2008, 09:55 AM   #2069
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Not a big fan of the Grant Hill or Reggie Miller picks. IMO Miller went a solid round and a half too early and there were at least a four to five SG's I would have taken over him.
Round and a half???? There are 60(!) players you'd take over him? No wai.

I'd have taken someone else, but Reggie is clearly among a half dozen players that were legit options there.
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Old 05-14-2008, 10:05 AM   #2070
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Not enough love or respect for Reggie IMO. LIke I said above, I'd have taken a few guys above him (at least one for sure), but man, dude was a freaking stud. Nothing soft at all about him, COULD create his own shot (don't know where this idea that all he did was run off screens came from), and played good (not great) D.

Two things that I think are really important in this league: 3pt shooting and defense. He's one of the very best at the first and unlike Nash he doesn't cripple you at the second.
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Old 05-14-2008, 10:38 AM   #2071
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Yea, not enough love for Reggie. He was the fifth of the five I was picking from. There is still an obvious pick out there though.
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Old 05-14-2008, 10:52 AM   #2072
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Not to mention you KNOW what you're getting with Reggie.
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Old 05-14-2008, 10:53 AM   #2073
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

i don't think it's really possible to make bad picks right now. was reggie miller BPA? probably not, but it won't hurt you at all. what's more important is fitting the right pieces around your first round pick's skillset.
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Old 05-14-2008, 11:29 AM   #2074
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

I'm picking Dikembe Mutombo. Write-up coming. I expect this pick will get a fair share of hate, but I looked closely at some more obvious alternatives, and really think Mutombo is the right pick here.
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Old 05-14-2008, 11:29 AM   #2075
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Not a huge Reggie fan but he did have a long career which was relaitevely injury free (only 1 season below 70 games before his final season), an dhad a PER around 20 for most of ihs career and 18.4 for his career. Defensively he was pretty blah and other that shooting he was pretty blah but as a scorer he was damn efficient and in the playoffs he was usually clutch and played really well. There are probally better players over a short period available but for a player who was efficient and a great scorer it's not a bad pick.
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