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Old 06-23-2008, 09:27 PM   #13751
TheQuietAnarchist
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

D and I have our picks ready if an executive decision is reached.
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Old 06-23-2008, 09:28 PM   #13752
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

I have no complaints about BigCat getting the boot
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Old 06-23-2008, 09:29 PM   #13753
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Originally Posted by Assani Fisher View Post
This sounds good to me. Just to be clear: Only drafters do #1, #2 is open to everyone, right?
Right. #2 I'd say for anyone who posted more than 10 posts in this thread.
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Old 06-23-2008, 09:31 PM   #13754
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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"Good offense usually beats good defense. "
Couldn't disagree more. Look at Spurs/Suns recent series. Or look at how the Warriors fare when they go up against the Spurs. Or look at the Lakers/Celtics Finals. Or I could give 100 more examples, but you get the point.


I meant in a one on one case. If bird olajuwon is against mutumbo, the dream will dominate him most of the game.

As team offense and defense goes your absolutely right, good team defense beats good team offense
1. Is Bird Olajuwon some sort of hybrid player combining the strengths of Larry Bird and Hakeem Olajuwon?

2. Well we were talking about teams, not players.

3. You're still wrong. Stars players score much less efficiently against better defenders. To use your example, Hakeem was a 51.2% FG for his career, yet he was only 49.0% FG against Mutombo in 27 career games.
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Old 06-23-2008, 09:33 PM   #13755
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

I'm going to defend my offense one time since it's been critiqued.

KG, Laimbeer, Hornacek, Mike Miller, Bobby Phills, Elden Campbell.

I actually think my offense>my defense. Given this lineup, there are just a ton of plays that can be run. My top 4 guys are extremely efficient, and all of them can hit the midrange jumper. Phills, Miller, and Horny are all career 40%, 40%, and 39% 3 point shooters, and that's over their careers, not just their peak. Those three are collectively above average slashers and finishers, as well as above average passers. KG is a good post-up guy, not stellar, a good face-up player, and awesome jump-shooter. Laimbeer is an excellent garbage man and spot up jump-shooter. Elden's strength was in the post and his athleticism, although I'd hardly call him efficient.

With this lineup, there's really no limit to the types of plays that can be run. You can PnR with Horny/Miller and KG/Laimbeer. The PnR can go both ways, with the big man rotating toward or away from the basket. Double PnR's would be especially dangerous given Miller/Horny's range coupled with KG/Laimb's, and I could see that creating some very easy shots. These guys can run back-screens for Horny/Miller with two of the best pick-setters and shooters around. Jeff can Iso, although that's not something I'd consider to be a strong suit. KG and Elden can post-up, and they are going to have a ton of room to maneuver with all that space. If you double off them, especially KG, then your faced with a very high percentage shot.

Even setting your defense is going to be hard against this team. Mike, Jeff, and Bobby can all bring the ball up, and a defender will have to play them tight or their going to get a tre launched in their eye, with a big front-court waiting for the rebound. If they come up too tight, those guys can just blow right by...

Last second shots? Are you kidding me? It's not like teams don't set screens for players at the end of games (Reggie Miller, anyone?), and it's not like these guys are campers who have never created their own shots. I think having a team full of shooters is the exact group of guys that you want out there. Sure there is no dominant ISO guy that can take the last shot, but does there need to be? With the exception of perhaps Elden, all of these guys have taken crucial shots in big games. I'd rather have 4 go-to guys who are very good than one who is great... and there are very few greats anyway.

So I've basically got a team full of above average passers, who are above average at scoring inside, and they're all excellent shooters (-Elden). To top things off, they're all high BBall-IQ guys who do well in the team/ball-movement environment. I see lots of layups and lots of 3's attempted, which are the two best shots you can take in basketball. I don't have a great iso guy, but I really don't need one, imo.

Last edited by Seadood228; 06-23-2008 at 09:38 PM.
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Old 06-23-2008, 09:34 PM   #13756
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Ok, I'll let you guys take BigCat's place. Personally I'm not in favor of it, but it seems as if I'm in the minority.

Is everyone ok with Tarpley being dropped and them getting 2 picks? Lets make sure thats ok before they pick.

And if you guys take my guy, I'm gonna be pissed lol.
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Old 06-23-2008, 09:36 PM   #13757
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Seadood,

I don't disagree with your analysis. However, it really helps to have a wing player who when the offense is just sputtering and the shot clock is at <10 seconds can just take over and create himself a shot. Thats one reason I went with Penny even though I knew the injury concerns. Your team is severely lacking that, maybe more than any other team in the draft. Thats my only beef with your offense.

With KG, you're pretty much gonna want to run a Spurs type offense primarily. But even the Spurs have Manu who you can just clear out for and Parker who is a "one man fast break." You have neither.
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Old 06-23-2008, 09:37 PM   #13758
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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I don't know why everyone keeps saying we all have offensive juggernauts. Look at the teams we have. Try to isolate the best offenses. Compare those offenses to this years best offensive teams: Phx, Utah, LAL. are the best offenses better?
I definitely think so. Let's compare Utah to flyingmoose or nath. Their PG/big man combos are fairly similar. But one has Richard Jefferson as their third option plus the two best players on a .500 Blazers team in the west, while the other has motha****ing Dirk. And it's not like you can even argue that Brewer is a better scorer than Stevie Franchise in his prime.
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Old 06-23-2008, 09:38 PM   #13759
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Originally Posted by Assani Fisher View Post
Ok, I'll let you guys take BigCat's place. Personally I'm not in favor of it, but it seems as if I'm in the minority.

Is everyone ok with Tarpley being dropped and them getting 2 picks? Lets make sure thats ok before they pick.

And if you guys take my guy, I'm gonna be pissed lol.
although i dont think it's fair that BigCat be dropped, I'm selfish and vote for things that benefit me. give him the axe, imo.

if tarpley gets dropped, is he undraftable? i'm fine with this
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Old 06-23-2008, 09:42 PM   #13760
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Seadood,

In the first two rounds you drafted guys whose defense was better than their offense. Considering that, is it really surprising that most of us feel D is your strength?
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Old 06-23-2008, 09:44 PM   #13761
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Originally Posted by KLJ View Post
although i dont think it's fair that BigCat be dropped, I'm selfish and vote for things that benefit me. give him the axe, imo.

if tarpley gets dropped, is he undraftable? i'm fine with this
I would only allow Tarpley to be dropped if nobody claims they would've taken him before now. IF anyone says they would've then it would've impacted other picks and the pick must stand.

Therefore, if Tarpley is allowed to be dropped then he'll still be eligible to be drafted.


Also if BigCat shows up before we decide all of this then he may have his pick provided he can assure us no more stoppages for him and better writeups and commentary in the thread.
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Old 06-23-2008, 09:48 PM   #13762
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Woot! So is it a go, then? I don't want to make a move until its 100%.

D
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Old 06-23-2008, 09:49 PM   #13763
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Originally Posted by Assani Fisher View Post
Seadood,

I don't disagree with your analysis. However, it really helps to have a wing player who when the offense is just sputtering and the shot clock is at <10 seconds can just take over and create himself a shot. Thats one reason I went with Penny even though I knew the injury concerns. Your team is severely lacking that, maybe more than any other team in the draft. Thats my only beef with your offense.

With KG, you're pretty much gonna want to run a Spurs type offense primarily. But even the Spurs have Manu who you can just clear out for and Parker who is a "one man fast break." You have neither.
Umm.. Mike Miller scored more inside buckets than Manu, and shot a higher percentage of inside shots. Do you really think Horny and Miller don't create their own shots? or drive the ball? especially given their ridiculously high FG%? I really find that puzzling. Perhaps it's their reputation for being such great outside shooters. Or their lack of coverage on TV.
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Old 06-23-2008, 09:51 PM   #13764
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Originally Posted by D104 View Post
Woot! So is it a go, then? I don't want to make a move until its 100%.

D
Is everyone ok with Tarpley being dropped and them getting 2 picks? Lets make sure thats ok before they pick.
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Old 06-23-2008, 09:52 PM   #13765
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Is everyone ok with Tarpley being dropped and them getting 2 picks? Lets make sure thats ok before they pick.
I'm fine with it.
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Old 06-23-2008, 09:53 PM   #13766
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Is everyone ok with Tarpley being dropped and them getting 2 picks? Lets make sure thats ok before they pick.
I vote yes.
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Old 06-23-2008, 09:53 PM   #13767
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Definitely fine with it
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Old 06-23-2008, 09:54 PM   #13768
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Seadood,

In the first two rounds you drafted guys whose defense was better than their offense. Considering that, is it really surprising that most of us feel D is your strength?
I can see it now. I actually drafted Laimbeer because I really wanted a center who can shoot and play decent defense to go with KG's passing ability. That's an extremely rare trait across the board. I thought there were quite a few better defenders at the C position available, but none who could really shoot. His rebounding was just a bonus.
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Old 06-23-2008, 09:54 PM   #13769
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

oh and I'm cool with it too
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Old 06-23-2008, 09:56 PM   #13770
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Definitely fine with it
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Old 06-23-2008, 09:58 PM   #13771
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Hold on...everyone read my post after that. Is there anyone who would've taken Tarpley if he was available?
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Old 06-23-2008, 10:00 PM   #13772
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Hold on...everyone read my post after that. Is there anyone who would've taken Tarpley if he was available?
Niet.
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Old 06-23-2008, 10:00 PM   #13773
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

hell no
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Old 06-23-2008, 10:05 PM   #13774
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Ok, I'm heading out so D104 can do write ups later or I can do one later as well.

I'm PMing my picks to Assani, I think D104 will be on later but if not Assani can post as soon as a definitive consensus is met.
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Old 06-23-2008, 10:05 PM   #13775
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Is everyone ok with Tarpley being dropped and them getting 2 picks? Lets make sure thats ok before they pick.
yayayayayayayayayaayay
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