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Old 05-29-2008, 01:20 PM   #8526
NameOnTheCake
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Originally Posted by tbach24 View Post
just as a preview to seadood's writeup, mike miller's TS%'s the past 4 years (since he turned 24):

61.4%
59.5%
58.8%
62.5%

guy can ****ing shoot
plus, he's snuggly soft!
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Old 05-29-2008, 01:22 PM   #8527
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

with KG, Lambeer and Horny....jeeeeeeeesus game over
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Old 05-29-2008, 01:36 PM   #8528
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Round 3 Recap

1. Antonio McDyess, PF (KLJ)
2. Andre Miller, PG (GKA)
3. Kiki Vandeweghe, SF (Mebenhoe)
4. Baron Davis, PG (BigCat)
5. Mark Aguirre, SF/SG (JoA)
6. Detlef Schrempf, SG/SF/PF (sergz)
7. Ron Artest, SF (van_exel_fan)
8. Tyson Chandler, C (cowboy)
9. Shane Battier, SF (tdarko)
10. Otis Thorpe, PF (fanmail)
11. Michael Finley, SG/SF (SammyKid)
12. Tom Chambers, PF/C (NopairParker)
13. Hersey Hawkins, SG (Dudd)
14. Anthony Mason, PF (mmbt0ne)
15. Arvydas Sabonis, C (tbach)
16. Dale Ellis, SG/SF (battschr)
17. Andris Beidrins, C/PF (Dr Zoidberg)
18. Joe Johnson, SG/SF (Nicholasp27)
19. Tayshaun Prince, SF (Victor)
20. Mark Eaton, C (KLJ)
21. Al Horford, PF/C (BJLTNYK)
22. Derrick Coleman, PF (Bobbo)
23. Jeff Hornacek, SG (Seadood)
24. Andre Iguodala, SG/SF (capone0)
25. Jose Calderon, PG (nath, taking over dtemp's squad)
26. Kevin Martin, SG (Epeen)
27. Charles Oakley, PF (Franchise)
28. Kevin Willis, C (HighStakesPro)
29. Antawn Jamison, PF (LurchySoprano)
30. Richard Hamilton, SG (Shark)
31. Rashard Lewis, SF (.Alex.)
32. Mookie Blaylock, PG (ClarkNizzle)
33. Rolando Blackman, SG (AC-Cobra)
34. Lamar Odom, SF/PF (BigChips)
35. Andrei Kirilenko, SF/PF (Assani Akbar!)
36. Sam Cassell, PG (kidcolin)
37. Hot Rod Williams, PF/C (RUFFNECK)
38. Drazen Petrovic, SG (horizon)
39. Brad Miller, C (FaDi)
40. Josh Smith, SF (Steroid Boy)


Teams So Far

1 Steroid Boy - Michael Jordan, Marcus Camby, Josh Smith
2 BobboFitos - Shaq, Eddie Jones, Derrick Coleman
3 horizon - LeBron James, Horace Grant, Drazen Petrovic
4 RUFFNECK - Magic Johnson, Micheal Redd, Hot Rod Williams
5 kidcolin - Larry Bird, Vlade Divac, Sam Cassell
6 Assani Fisher - Tim Duncan, Penny Hardaway, Andrei Kirilenko
7 BiiiigChips - Hakeem Olajuwon, Glen Rice, Lamar Odom
8 Jack of Arcades - David Robinson, Terry Porter, Mark Aguirre
9 Seadood228 - Kevin Garnett, Bill Laimbeer, Jeff Hornacek
10 Alex - Kobe Bryant, Big Al Jefferson, Rashard Lewis
11 SHARK DOCTOR - Chris Paul, Terry Cummings, Rip Hamilton
12 LurchySoprano - Karl Malone, Alvin Robertson, Antawn Jamison
13 HighStakesPro - Charles Barkley, Stephon Marbury, Kevin Willis
14 Franchise 60 - John Stockton, Chris Mullin, Charles Oakley
15 flyingmoose - Isiah Thomas, Jermaine O'Neal
16 nath - Dirk Nowitzki, Carlos Boozer, Jose Calderon
17 capone0 - Dwight Howard, Tim Hardaway, Andre Iguodala
18 ClarkNasty - Patrick Ewing, Larry Nance, Mookie Blaylock
19 FaDi - Clyde Drexler, Peja Stojakovic, Brad Miller
20 BJLTNYK - Jason Kidd, Mitch Richmond, Al Horford
21 EPiPeN11 - Kevin McHale, Chauncey Billups, Kevin Martin
22 Victor - Amare Stoudamire, Mark Price, Tayshaun Prince
23 Nicholasp27 - Alonzo Mourning, Buck Williams, Joe Johnson
24 Dr. Zoidberg - Dominique Wilkins, Kevin Johnson, Andris Biedrins
25 battschr - Scottie Pippen, Brad Daugherty, Dale Ellis
26 cowboy2579 - Gary Payton, Rasheed Wallace, Tyson Chandler
27 mmbt0ne - Steve Nash, Manu Ginobili, Anthony Mason
28 Dudd - Tracy McGrady, Tony Parker, Hersey Hawkins
29 NopairParker - Dwyane Wade, Andrew Bynum, Tom Chambers
30 SammyKid11 - Yao Ming, Carmelo Anthony, Michael Finley
31 fanmail - Allen Iverson, Ben Wallace, Otis Thorpe
32 tdarko - Shawn Marion, Deron Williams, Shane Battier
33 tbach - Grant Hill, Shawn Kemp, Arvydis Sabonis
34 van_exel_fan - Reggie Miller, Dennis Rodman, Ron Artest
35 sergsz - Dikembe Mutombo, Gilbert Arenas, Detlef Schrempf
36 AC-Cobra - Chris Webber, Joe Dumars, Rolando Blackman
37 Big Cat - James Worthy, Chris Bosh, Baron Davis
38 MEbenhoe - Elton Brand, Jesus Shuttlesworth, Kiki Vandeweghe
39 GreenKoolAid - Paul Pierce, Pau Gasol, Andre Miller
40 KLJ - Vince Carter, Sid Moncrief, Antonio McDyess
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Old 05-29-2008, 01:37 PM   #8529
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

got rid of the by position crap it takes too long and it's less interesting now that teams are forming and some fits are better than other.
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Old 05-29-2008, 01:39 PM   #8530
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

I'm putting Jamison at the 3, even though you have him listed as a PF.
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Old 05-29-2008, 01:48 PM   #8531
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

So who does everyone think are the top 5 worst drafts pick through 3 rounds (take into account which round they were taken in ie. someone goin in the 2nd round should be better than someone going in the 3rd and you should factor that in)

How about the top 5 best picks valuewise outside the top 10 (just to make it fair obv Jordan would be #1 etc)
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Old 05-29-2008, 01:52 PM   #8532
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Originally Posted by EPiPeN11 View Post
So who does everyone think are the top 5 worst drafts pick through 3 rounds (take into account which round they were taken in ie. someone goin in the 2nd round should be better than someone going in the 3rd and you should factor that in)

How about the top 5 best picks valuewise outside the top 10 (just to make it fair obv Jordan would be #1 etc)
1 is eazy for worst and it's still Bynum followed closely by Horford. I think Battier went way too high as well as Beidrins.
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Old 05-29-2008, 01:54 PM   #8533
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Originally Posted by capone0 View Post
1 is eazy for worst and it's still Bynum followed closely by Horford.
What about Marbury, I think i'd argue him being worse than Bynum because Bynum at least COULD turn out to be a legit superstar, and if he doesn't I assume he will at least be a very good player/not cancern/bigman who brings scoring/rebounding and surprisingly good d.
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Old 05-29-2008, 01:56 PM   #8534
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Round 4 - Pick 130 - F/G Mike Miller / 6'8"



VIDEO HIGHLIGHTS

With two high IQ big men who set great picks, I wanted to go with someone who could take advantage of those attributes, and a guy who had enough versatility to play multiple outside positions.

Here are the vitals, age 24 to the present.

15.4 PPG
.482 FG%
.418 3 PT %
.605 TS%
78% FT %
3.3 AST/GM
5.3 Rebs/Game (6.7 in 2007-2008)

What I like about Mike Miller the most is his ability to come off the high pick and either pass to the roll man or take the three with amazing accuracy. I think this is a tremendous weapon, especially given Mike's size and ability to shoot in traffic. Since Mike is an excellent shooter with great range, and he makes it extremely penal if you leave him to double. This is another great asset given very skilled passers like I've already got. Mike also has pretty good playmaking ability for a forward, averaging better than 3 assists per game during his peak. In earlier years when he played more guard, that number was higher.

Defensively, nothing really stands out. Admittedly I've only watched him play about ten games, and I didn't recall him being particularly good or bad. His defensive rating was very good prior to 2006-2007, but has been pretty bad since. His steals and blocks are modest, so if I had to make my guess I'd say he is an average defender that's capable of looking better or worse depending on the team around him.

Mike Miller is fairly young at 28, but his overall consistency over the years and relative health gives me the confidence that his production will not waver too much over the years. True he's not the iron-man that Laimbeer, Horny, and to a lesser extent KG have been, but
with an average games played/year of around 70 and no seasons missing 20 games, I don't think injury concerns are an issue.

Adding Mike Miller to my team of KG, Laimbeer, and Hornacek gives me great balanced scoring, and more importantly great spacing on the court. All of these guys have impressive range for their respective positions, and they are all good passers and guys without the ball.

Team so far:

Kevin Garnett - PF/C
Bill Laimbeer - C
Jeff Hornacek - PG/SG
Mike Miller - SF/SG
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Old 05-29-2008, 01:58 PM   #8535
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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What about Marbury, I think i'd argue him being worse than Bynum because Bynum at least COULD turn out to be a legit superstar, and if he doesn't I assume he will at least be a very good player/not cancern/bigman who brings scoring/rebounding and surprisingly good d.
Forgot all about him, but yeah he's pretty damn awful too that early especially when noone would touch him for a couple of rounds in my estimation.
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Old 05-29-2008, 01:58 PM   #8536
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

No order, just taking a quick glance:

worst: Bynum, Biedrins, Mason, Marbury, Horford

best: Moncrief, Derek Harper, Ray Allen, Detlef, Mark Aguirre
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Old 05-29-2008, 02:00 PM   #8537
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Originally Posted by EPiPeN11 View Post
So who does everyone think are the top 5 worst drafts pick through 3 rounds (take into account which round they were taken in ie. someone goin in the 2nd round should be better than someone going in the 3rd and you should factor that in)

How about the top 5 best picks valuewise outside the top 10 (just to make it fair obv Jordan would be #1 etc)
I'll take a stab at top 5 value out of the first 10 picks.

1. AI at 32 I think is robbery. I could be in the minority here but I still don't know how he dropped that low.

2. Dale Ellis at 96. For a guy who's peak scoring for 5 years was around the 25ppg range and considered one of the best pure shooters for 10-15 years this is really low in my book.

3. Mookie Blaylock at 112. Considering alot of the players of the same position taken in front of him this is great value at 112.

4. Drazen Petrovic at 118. see # 3.

5. Shareef Abdur Rahim 124. see # #3.
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Old 05-29-2008, 02:01 PM   #8538
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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No order, just taking a quick glance:

worst: Bynum, Biedrins, Mason, Marbury, Horford

best: Moncrief, Derek Harper, Ray Allen, Detlef, Mark Aguirre
I like Ray Allen but I don't think he was that great of value at 42. I personally don't think he's that much better than Mullin, Richmond, Manu, etc.
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Old 05-29-2008, 02:03 PM   #8539
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Awesome work KC, that Baron clip is hilarious.

Quote:
So who does everyone think are the top 5 worst drafts pick through 3 rounds (take into account which round they were taken in ie. someone goin in the 2nd round should be better than someone going in the 3rd and you should factor that in)

How about the top 5 best picks valuewise outside the top 10 (just to make it fair obv Jordan would be #1 etc)
Worst picks

1. Al Horford
2. Andrew Bynum
3. Starbury
4. Mark Eaton
5. Drexler/Paul

(obv the first 3 are a lot worse than the other two)

Best Value Picks

1. Scottie Pippen
2. Sidney Moncrief
3. Eddie Jones
4. Joe Johnson
5. Meh Ewing probably was pretty damn good value


EDIT:Forgot about Biedrins, really dont like that pick either. Also AI was insane value and I forgot that
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Old 05-29-2008, 02:03 PM   #8540
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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I'll take a stab at top 5 value out of the first 10 picks.

1. AI at 32 I think is robbery. I could be in the minority here but I still don't know how he dropped that low.

2. Dale Ellis at 96. For a guy who's peak scoring for 5 years was around the 25ppg range and considered one of the best pure shooters for 10-15 years this is really low in my book.

3. Mookie Blaylock at 112. Considering alot of the players of the same position taken in front of him this is great value at 112.

4. Drazen Petrovic at 118. see # 3.

5. Shareef Abdur Rahim 124. see # #3.

AI is really hard to build a great team around. Yes by himself he's a great player, but as a teammate you are kinda forced into to surround him with certain types of players. I know his TS% has risen with better players but it's not partcularly high. For someone who should play the 2, he has an extremly high usage rate. He's also pretty small and plays hurt which is a good and bad thing. Maybe he should have gotten slightly higher but if someone took him in the top 20 I think it would have been a horrible pick.
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Old 05-29-2008, 02:03 PM   #8541
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

balls, i wanted to jump ac-cobra to take smits
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Old 05-29-2008, 02:04 PM   #8542
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

the artest still crazy thing is one of the best things i've ever seen. he was REALLY pumped up after fouling AK47. jesus that guy is a nut.
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Old 05-29-2008, 02:05 PM   #8543
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Wow I disagree a ton with a lot of ur best value picks (both kidcolin and bigchips)

Anyway here are mine in no order not including my own picks (I named more than top 5 cause I feel like they are all similar in terms of value)

Pippen
Eddie Jones
Drazen Petrovic
Joe Johnson
Deron Williams
Monocrief
Larry Nance
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Old 05-29-2008, 02:07 PM   #8544
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Originally Posted by AC-Cobra View Post
Awesome work KC, that Baron clip is hilarious.



Worst picks

1. Al Horford
2. Andrew Bynum
3. Starbury
4. Mark Eaton
5. Drexler/Paul

(obv the first 3 are a lot worse than the other two)

Best Value Picks

1. Scottie Pippen
2. Sidney Moncrief
3. Eddie Jones
4. Joe Johnson
5. Meh Ewing probably was pretty damn good value
agree the most with this list ldo
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Old 05-29-2008, 02:08 PM   #8545
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

if you look at the difference between when miller's DRtg and DWS deflate, it's because they lost some key defensive players (battier and eddie jones). he's pretty weak defensively, but not that hard to hide. it's not like he's getting abused night in and night out.
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Old 05-29-2008, 02:10 PM   #8546
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Not doing a top 5, but Schrempf was def the best pick of round 3
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Old 05-29-2008, 02:10 PM   #8547
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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if you look at the difference between when miller's DRtg and DWS deflate, it's because they lost some key defensive players (battier and eddie jones). he's pretty weak defensively, but not that hard to hide. it's not like he's getting abused night in and night out.
For some reason they always put him on Kobe or Lebron when they would come. God he would get smoked.
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Old 05-29-2008, 02:10 PM   #8548
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Originally Posted by EPiPeN11 View Post
What about Marbury, I think i'd argue him being worse than Bynum because Bynum at least COULD turn out to be a legit superstar, and if he doesn't I assume he will at least be a very good player/not cancern/bigman who brings scoring/rebounding and surprisingly good d.
Stephon Marbury at 68 is far far far away from being the worst pick in this draft. Come on guys. Not sure what the hate for Marbury is fueled by it's not like someone took him in the top 10. The guy went mid second round.
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Old 05-29-2008, 02:11 PM   #8549
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Originally Posted by tbach24 View Post
if you look at the difference between when miller's DRtg and DWS deflate, it's because they lost some key defensive players (battier and eddie jones). he's pretty weak defensively, but not that hard to hide. it's not like he's getting abused night in and night out.
Ya drtg is a pretty useless stat imo, at first I thought it judged you vs ur man which woulda not been perfect but at least I would take it into account, then I realized it was just defense while u were on the floor and I think it is ridiculously useless and depends on the team you have around you.
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Old 05-29-2008, 02:12 PM   #8550
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Not doing a top 5, but Schrempf was def the best pick of round 3
wat? in terms of value no freakin way... I don't get the crazy love for Schrempf, he was obv good, and good in NBA Jam as well, but hes not much better if at all better than guys like Petrovic, Joe Johnson etc. who went a good 30 picks later.
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