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Old 05-25-2008, 11:35 PM   #6951
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Remember that their backup back court players are going against a lot of other backups most of the time.

Also I did not know it was points scored while u were on the floor, I thought it was points scored by ur man? If so why do all the bigmen usually have much lower drtg's than guards, shouldn't they be roughly the same?
Yeah, these are my qs too. I did know that ~107 was around avg, but after looking through a ton of various players, it seemed as tho the bigmen i was looking at averaged ~105 and the smalls ~108. no idea how DRtg establishes merit and credits fault. I do think it's an ok stat, but not great - simply because I doubt anyone would believe Manu is a better defender than Prince, but it should obviously show Manu is quite a capable/good defender.
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Old 05-25-2008, 11:38 PM   #6952
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Yeah, these are my qs too. I did know that ~107 was around avg, but after looking through a ton of various players, it seemed as tho the bigmen i was looking at averaged ~105 and the smalls ~108. no idea how DRtg establishes merit and credits fault. I do think it's an ok stat, but not great - simply because I doubt anyone would believe Manu is a better defender than Prince, but it should obviously show Manu is quite a capable/good defender.
Also if it just shows points scored while u are on the floor, it's a much more worthless stat than I previously had thought. I mean you can be playing sick d on ur man, while ur team is getting torched and u get equally punished for it? Sounds very ridiculous imo, it obv benefits the sick defensive teams and punishes the sick defensive players who are on bad teams.

At least if it took points scored by ur man (which is what I thought it was), it would be more worthwhile, as you can see how good someone plays man to man d (obv u'd have to factor in if they were a defensive stopper like Battier/Prince and always guarded the best sg/sf and that but it would be much more effective than showing just points scored on ur team when ur on the floor).
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Old 05-25-2008, 11:40 PM   #6953
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

PER against is a decent evaluator of on-the-ball defense, although it tends to not credit your help/team/rotation defense. again, no defensive metric is perfect (hell, as we say, none of them are even GOOD) but DRtg is better than nothing.
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Old 05-25-2008, 11:41 PM   #6954
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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PER against is a decent evaluator of on-the-ball defense, although it tends to not credit your help/team/rotation defense. again, no defensive metric is perfect (hell, as we say, none of them are even GOOD) but DRtg is better than nothing.
Where can I find PER against? I checked basketball reference but didn't see it.
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Old 05-25-2008, 11:42 PM   #6955
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Originally Posted by EPiPeN11 View Post
Remember that their backup back court players are going against a lot of other backups most of the time.

Also I did not know it was points scored while u were on the floor, I thought it was points scored by ur man? If so why do all the bigmen usually have much lower drtg's than guards, shouldn't they be roughly the same?
Well unless you play for Avery Johnson, starters will get a small amount of minutes separate from each other. That big men do a little better in the metric would seem to indicate that big men D is much more important than wing D.

A better stat might be (DRtg/Team DRtg.)*100 so that 100 would be average. This would still be flawed, of course, but I imagine the majority of players would be very close to 100.
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Old 05-25-2008, 11:44 PM   #6956
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Well unless you play for Avery Johnson, starters will get a small amount of minutes separate from each other. That big men do a little better in the metric would seem to indicate that big men D is much more important than wing D.

A better stat might be (DRtg/Team DRtg.)*100 so that 100 would be average. This would still be flawed, of course, but I imagine the majority of players would be very close to 100.
Ok cool I def do agree bigman D is more important than wing d although wing d is obv important too.
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Old 05-25-2008, 11:45 PM   #6957
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Also if it just shows points scored while u are on the floor, it's a much more worthless stat than I previously had thought. I mean you can be playing sick d on ur man, while ur team is getting torched and u get equally punished for it? Sounds very ridiculous imo, it obv benefits the sick defensive teams and punishes the sick defensive players who are on bad teams.

At least if it took points scored by ur man (which is what I thought it was), it would be more worthwhile, as you can see how good someone plays man to man d (obv u'd have to factor in if they were a defensive stopper like Battier/Prince and always guarded the best sg/sf and that but it would be much more effective than showing just points scored on ur team when ur on the floor).
Yes, this is why it's important to know your stats. I imagine if you take a team's D-Rtg, add 1 or 1.5 to every guard/sf and subtrack 2 from every pf/c you'd predict individual DRtg pretty often.
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Old 05-25-2008, 11:46 PM   #6958
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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Where can I find PER against? I checked basketball reference but didn't see it.
82games
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Old 05-25-2008, 11:47 PM   #6959
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

This is harder than I thought...having a hard time deciding whether I want to go the established route or pick based on potential arghghghghghgh.
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Old 05-25-2008, 11:47 PM   #6960
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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82games
k ty
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Old 05-25-2008, 11:48 PM   #6961
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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This is harder than I thought...having a hard time deciding whether I want to go the established route or pick based on potential arghghghghghgh.
trade down with me ldo
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Old 05-25-2008, 11:49 PM   #6962
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

BTW, we ripped hard into KLJ when he traded down, but it worked out very well for him. gj.
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Old 05-25-2008, 11:50 PM   #6963
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

If anyone is struggling w/their pick feel free to PM me, I have some guys in mind
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Old 05-25-2008, 11:50 PM   #6964
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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BTW, we ripped hard into KLJ when he traded down, but it worked out very well for him. gj.
I think KLJ was the only one to get legit value for trading down. But I do think I will be able to pick a player at the end of round 4 who should be roughly around the same talent/skill level as Eaton.
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Old 05-25-2008, 11:50 PM   #6965
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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If anyone is struggling w/their pick feel free to PM me, I have some guys in mind
You better not tell them the sleeper I told you about
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Old 05-25-2008, 11:51 PM   #6966
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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trade down with me ldo
what he said, except i'm only 5 spots away!
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Old 05-25-2008, 11:51 PM   #6967
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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what he said, except i'm only 5 spots away!
I will give up more than nath will, he doesn't have TWO 4th rounders seriouslyyyyyy
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Old 05-25-2008, 11:52 PM   #6968
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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I think KLJ was the only one to get legit value for trading down. But I do think I will be able to pick a player at the end of round 4 who should be roughly around the same talent/skill level as Eaton.
Yeah, I'd be surprised if all the guys with similar skillsets to Eaton get taken in the fourth round.
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Old 05-25-2008, 11:52 PM   #6969
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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BTW, we ripped hard into KLJ when he traded down, but it worked out very well for him. gj.
i actually think this is one of those rare times where the trade looks good for BOTH people. essentially it was Chauncey Billups and the 160th pick (60 picks to go Epi!) for Mark Eaton and Sidney Moncrief. again, i think this was good for both teams.
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Old 05-25-2008, 11:53 PM   #6970
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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If anyone is struggling w/their pick feel free to PM me, I have some guys in mind
I'll offer to tell you my honest opinion about the players, but I won't tell you who to pick imo.
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Old 05-25-2008, 11:53 PM   #6971
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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You better not tell them the sleeper I told you about
Promise
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Old 05-25-2008, 11:53 PM   #6972
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

I'll give you terrible advice
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Old 05-25-2008, 11:54 PM   #6973
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

im considering moving down if none of the guys i want (list of 4) are available, only 18 more picks (lol) to go.
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Old 05-25-2008, 11:54 PM   #6974
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

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I'll offer to tell you my honest opinion about the players, but I won't tell you who to pick imo.
LOL I'm not in the draft, I just want to be. This thread as given me a reason to dig into bballref, it's awesome
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Old 05-25-2008, 11:56 PM   #6975
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

BJL has a solid base with Kidd and Mitch, i suppose this pick shapes the direction of his team tho, right?
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