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Old 05-08-2008, 12:24 AM   #426
tarheeljks
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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Originally Posted by .Alex. View Post
I think it's close. Stockton is a better shooter, but Paul is a better slasher. Stockton is probably a slightly better passer and defender, but Paul is a better rebounder. Paul's stats are much more likely to improve than to regress. Stockton had great longetivity but variance plays a big part of that, and Paul doesn't seem to be injury prone or anything.
stockton was a better passer???
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Old 05-08-2008, 12:25 AM   #427
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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The point is that when everyone picks a guy who is retired or near retirement, they are basing the value on the pick on the guys career. When CP3 or any of the other super young guys get picked, a lot of people are going to value them on near (or at) the ceiling of their upside. I just don't know if that is fair, and was wondering what people think about it.
Thats what we signed up for at the beginning of this whole draft...take the player at their peak.

Numbers wise - Pauls numbers are better than anyones at the point guard position (Magic Johnson and Paul are neck and neck).

Im not overrating him - Im taking his numbers for face value...they say "GREATNESS" all over them.

This draft is about drafting a team - no one actually wins this draft through a season, its all about the arguement you have to back your player up with...and I feel very strongly about mine. Pauls prime (even though he still rising) is greater than any one single point gaurd ever not named Magic.

And the great part is - he is still getting better. (even if he isnt - there is not one point gaurd I couldve picked that was better than him)
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Old 05-08-2008, 12:25 AM   #428
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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If someone picks Paul, there's really no reason to wait to discuss why they chose him over Stockton, Nash, Isaiah is there? It's the obvious question.
Agreed
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Old 05-08-2008, 12:25 AM   #429
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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umm.. it's Karl Freaking Malone.. no one is forgetting him

people really need to stop being such ninnies about the naming thing.
read my post above urs pls
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Old 05-08-2008, 12:25 AM   #430
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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umm.. it's Karl Freaking Malone.. no one is forgetting him

people really need to stop being such ninnies about the naming thing.
Haha, I know. Everyone one of these players is on everybody's mind--just b/c they aren't picked doesn't mean they were forgotten.
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Old 05-08-2008, 12:26 AM   #431
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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stockton was a better passer???
He has like the top 8 seasons in Asst %. Malone helps somewhat obv
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Old 05-08-2008, 12:27 AM   #432
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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What do you think is a realistic floor for Paul?

What do you think is his expected career projection?
He is going to be really really really good at worst. But can you with a straight face say right now he is going to be the second best PG since 1980 behind Magic? Because thats what he is being valued at right now.

We know what Isiah, Stockton, Kidd, Glove, etc did for 15 years, that should be a positive for them, not a negative.

EDIT: Whatever, who cares.
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Old 05-08-2008, 12:28 AM   #433
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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read my post above urs pls
read mine above this one.. the astute poster will realize my slick tactics.
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Old 05-08-2008, 12:28 AM   #434
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

Just to clarify, Stockton was a much better defender than Chris Paul. John was next to impossible to post up due to his strength.
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Old 05-08-2008, 12:29 AM   #435
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

Clark is just butthurt that Deron isn't making the Paul/Deron argument close anymore
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Old 05-08-2008, 12:29 AM   #436
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

EDIT: Just read all the hooplah about not discussing dudes that are undrafted.

Last edited by flyingmoose; 05-08-2008 at 12:37 AM.
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Old 05-08-2008, 12:30 AM   #437
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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You're right, I must not be getting it. How on earth can you know what a player's career, peak etc. is going to be after 1 incredible season at 22 and two really good seasons before that? What am I missing? Help a brotha out.
Obviously we don't know for sure. But extrapolation, as I answered, is the process of constructing new data points outside a discrete set of known data points. The data we know is CP3's stats in 3+seasons. The other data we know is other elite PG's data early in their career, and how they fared in the long run.

Basically, we are assuming that he will be fairly healthy and just as if not more productive as he has been thus far.
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Old 05-08-2008, 12:31 AM   #438
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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I wonder how high Iverson would have gone after his MVP season. I'm guessing way higher than he should have.
QFT. If we could somehow get through these picks today, I might have a shot at Deron
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Old 05-08-2008, 12:31 AM   #439
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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read mine above this one.. the astute poster will realize my slick tactics.
whatever, I mean I honestly think people should save the analysis for like 10 picks after so we don't have any of this.

I mean Kobe slipped to #10 in this draft, so clearly anything is possible.
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Old 05-08-2008, 12:32 AM   #440
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

well that's just 10 people being smarter than you. Standard
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Old 05-08-2008, 12:33 AM   #441
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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well that's just 10 people being smarter than you. Standard
No
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Old 05-08-2008, 12:33 AM   #442
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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Originally Posted by Franchise 60 View Post
He is going to be really really really good at worst. But can you with a straight face say right now he is going to be the second best PG since 1980 behind Magic? Because thats what he is being valued at right now.

We know what Isiah, Stockton, Kidd, Glove, etc did for 15 years, that should be a positive for them, not a negative.
It is a positive. But this is the NBA, not the NFL. It's very rare to see a guy put up amazing numbers one year, and then stray too far away from that the next. It's completely reasonable to assume that he will put up at least similar numbers for the next 10 years. It's not like he's playing with an amazing supporting cast or anything either.

To answer your question, yes, it is likely. And many analysts have said the same thing.
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Old 05-08-2008, 12:34 AM   #443
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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well that's just 10 people being smarter than you. Standard
Haha Epipen.
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Old 05-08-2008, 12:35 AM   #444
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

I would love to have seen Isiah and Stockton play with these new hand check rules and such.
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Old 05-08-2008, 12:36 AM   #445
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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Haha Epipen.
Hes just mad that I insulted his Bird pick
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Old 05-08-2008, 12:36 AM   #446
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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He has like the top 8 seasons in Asst %. Malone helps somewhat obv
/a whole ****ing lot
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Old 05-08-2008, 12:36 AM   #447
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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I wonder how high Iverson would have gone after his MVP season. I'm guessing way higher than he should have.
I doubt it. There were a lot Iverson haters back then, and that probably wasn't even his best season anyway (04-06).
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Old 05-08-2008, 12:36 AM   #448
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

What's the cutoff for number of years in the league? Lebron was chosen third overall after only five years, no one was complaining about that. They're even practically the same age, Paul just played two years of college ball. He had a historic season this year for a point guard and a pretty good first two years as well, how much you project that forward is up to you.
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Old 05-08-2008, 12:37 AM   #449
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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/a whole ****ing lot
it's more of a symbiotic relationship

edit: link for Epip: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/symbiotic

Last edited by kidcolin; 05-08-2008 at 12:40 AM. Reason: helpin' a brotha out
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Old 05-08-2008, 12:38 AM   #450
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

Also if anyone who owns the following players and is willing to discuss a trade, let me know.

Jordan
Shaq
Lebron
Duncan
Hakeem
Robinson
Kobe
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