Two Plus Two Publishing LLC Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > >

Sporting Events Discussion centered around sporting events.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 05-18-2008, 03:14 PM   #4001
vixticator
clutch
 
vixticator's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Watch the throne
Posts: 117,345
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by EPiPeN11 View Post
Rebounding yes edge Barkley, but it's not a huge edge by any means.
wat
vixticator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2008, 03:15 PM   #4002
EPiPeN11
banned
 
EPiPeN11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: akon is the goat
Posts: 18,605
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by tdarko View Post
epi,

Jealous?

ok that was actually really funny, I laughed.
EPiPeN11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2008, 03:17 PM   #4003
capone0
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
capone0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Philly
Posts: 43,035
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by vixticator View Post
wat
Yeah 11.7 for career vs 7.3 for career.

Also 11.5 vs 8.5 per 36 minutes.

Also 12.5/23.7 Oreb/Dreb% vs 9.2/16.9. Yeah they're both about even.

Last edited by capone0; 05-18-2008 at 03:28 PM.
capone0 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2008, 03:18 PM   #4004
vixticator
clutch
 
vixticator's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Watch the throne
Posts: 117,345
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by capone0 View Post
Yeah 11.7 for career vs 7.3 for career.

Also 11.5 vs 8.5 per 36 minutes.

Also 12.5/23.7 Oreb/Dreb% vs 9.2/16.9. Yeah there both about even.
[x] Round Mound of Rebound
vixticator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2008, 03:18 PM   #4005
EPiPeN11
banned
 
EPiPeN11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: akon is the goat
Posts: 18,605
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by capone0 View Post
Yeah 11.7 for career vs 7.3 for career.

Also 11.5 vs 8.5 per 36 minutes.

Also 12.5/23.7 Oreb/Dreb% vs 9.2/16.9. Yeah there both about even.
Ya let's just ignore the fact that McHale played with 2 of the best rebounders in the history of the game, and Barkley played with much worse rebounders.

And lol at u putting words into my mouth again, implying that I said they were even when I clearly said multiple times in this thread that Barkley was a better rebounder.
EPiPeN11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2008, 03:18 PM   #4006
HighStakesPro
banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 1,949
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by xxThe_Lebowskixx View Post
Will McHale's brilliant moves in his Minnesota office position count for anything?
Nice.

And I think the reason Epipen is prattling on and on about McHale is because he doesn't pick again until #140 (by which time everyone everyone in the top 20 will have made three more picks).
HighStakesPro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2008, 03:21 PM   #4007
MikeyPatriot
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
MikeyPatriot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Sack Mike Goldberg
Posts: 11,891
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Assani Fisher View Post
I don't have the answer to the riddle at hand actually. I'm sure its available though. Just google "three gods problem" or "Harvard Review of Philosophy Hardest Logic Problem Ever."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Har...ic_Puzzle_Ever

It has the answer apparently, so don't get spoiled.
MikeyPatriot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2008, 03:27 PM   #4008
mjw0586
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
mjw0586's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 37,375
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by EPiPeN11 View Post
scorer is very debatable, i'd take McHale but like I said it's close so I will just call it a tie since obv I have been over this 1 million times.

Rebounding yes edge Barkley, but it's not a huge edge by any means.

Passing huge edge Barkley.

But defense McHale's edge over Barkley is soooooo big, and defense being the most important thing in this league, makes it that McHale is a better choice over Barkley.
I realize that there's more of a premium on defense because of the offensive potency of the early players in this draft, but people are seriously overrating the importance of defense in this draft. Sure, it's important. But, offensive efficiency is extremely important as well.
mjw0586 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2008, 03:37 PM   #4009
EPiPeN11
banned
 
EPiPeN11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: akon is the goat
Posts: 18,605
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by mjw0586 View Post
I realize that there's more of a premium on defense because of the offensive potency of the early players in this draft, but people are seriously overrating the importance of defense in this draft. Sure, it's important. But, offensive efficiency is extremely important as well.
Of course offensive effciency is very important. That's a good part of the reason I drafted McHale, he is imo the 2nd most efficent player of all time when consistantly creating his own shot in this draft.
EPiPeN11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2008, 03:41 PM   #4010
HighStakesPro
banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 1,949
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Just wondering but has someone PMed Nicholasp27? After him we have the active people so it should go quick.
HighStakesPro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2008, 03:41 PM   #4011
Assani Fisher
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Assani Fisher's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 48,128
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by tbach24 View Post
assani,

you said something along the lines of "nash is not that great a passer" or something like that. you didn't discredit him entirely, but it implied that he's not as great a passer as everyone gives him credit for. this might be true. maybe his passes aren't the sharpest (i disagree and believe he delivers insanely accurate passes at the level of kidd and stockton), but it's not just that, but also his decision making that leaves defenses confused and thus allows amare to do what he does to an extent. at the same time, nash's confidence in amare's athleticsm and finishing ability allows nash to be able to create the way he does.
.
I don't think Nash is a bad passer or decision maker at all. What I was saying was that I think people overrate how much better Nash is at those things compared to other PGs. I didn't want to name drop too much, so I'll just give you one example of a player who isn't going to be drafted any time soon: For pure court vision and passing ability, a guy like Jason Williams is just as good as Nash imo. Hell, every PG is very good at finding the open man and getting the ball to him. Thats what makes them PGs. If they couldn't do that they'd be moved to the 2 or be an score first PG(like Barbosa).

What makes Nash great is his shooting combined with PG skills. I don't think throwing an accurate alley oop or an accurate chest pass is that tough of a skill for any NBA PG. Of course some PGs like Nash/Kidd/Paul will go above and beyond and make some crazy passes that really make you go "wow." However those type of passes happen maybe once per game and only make up maybe 2 or 3% of Amare's baskets(I say this because we're discussing how Amare would do with a normal PG).

BTW I think Kidd is a better pure passer than Nash, but thats another argument for another time.
Assani Fisher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2008, 03:44 PM   #4012
Assani Fisher
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Assani Fisher's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 48,128
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by EPiPeN11 View Post
so 90% is like 3-4 people who never saw McHale play either, um yea.
Nearly everyone in this thread has disagreed with your love of McHale, and I can't think of one person that has agreed with you. I'm not talking about the 5 or 6 guys disagreeing with you right now; I'm talking about throughout the entire thread. And many of them have seen McHale play.

Please show me one time where I was ever being told I was wrong by everyone in the thread, yet I refused to believe it and kept saying that I had insight that went beyond that stats(that apparently nobody else has).
Assani Fisher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2008, 03:45 PM   #4013
tdarko
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
tdarko's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 13,183
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by EPiPeN11 View Post
Of course offensive effciency is very important. That's a good part of the reason I drafted McHale, he is imo the 2nd most efficent player of all time when consistantly creating his own shot in this draft.
2nd most efficient? Come on now.
tdarko is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2008, 03:45 PM   #4014
D104
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
D104's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: In a better place.
Posts: 18,272
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Pls no more McHale talk. This topic has been discussed thoroughly. There is nothing more to say. Agree to disagree. A whale's vagina.

D
D104 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2008, 03:47 PM   #4015
Assani Fisher
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Assani Fisher's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 48,128
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by EPiPeN11 View Post
Wow you people have serious reading comprehension problems. I said in THIS particular draft because defense is so important I would, obv if we weren't made avaliable to 30 years of NBA players I would take Bird/Magic over McHale.
I'm not sure I'm understanding this either. This draft does have a much bigger player pool than the NBA at any give time in real life. However this league also has 40 owners. And this league doesn't have any rebuilding teams(Bobcats) or teams that are just horribly managed(Knicks). These factors even out imo and make our league very similar to real life NBA. Why do you think defense is more important in our league than in real life?
Assani Fisher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2008, 03:49 PM   #4016
EPiPeN11
banned
 
EPiPeN11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: akon is the goat
Posts: 18,605
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Assani Fisher View Post
Nearly everyone in this thread has disagreed with your love of McHale, and I can't think of one person that has agreed with you. I'm not talking about the 5 or 6 guys disagreeing with you right now; I'm talking about throughout the entire thread. And many of them have seen McHale play.

Please show me one time where I was ever being told I was wrong by everyone in the thread, yet I refused to believe it and kept saying that I had insight that went beyond that stats(that apparently nobody else has).
There are plenty of people out there on message boards etc. that think McHale was better than either Barkley/Malone or both and this is when comparing their career's too which I don't even believe. People don't realize the rules, we are cloning these players at age 24, not basing it strictly on what exact stats they put up/how long they played etc. which actually helps McHale.

And just because the majority of people think something, it doesn't make it automatically right. Heck, just look at the Boston 3 sports teams thread. Everyone was arguing about the odds, and flaming me etc. and my odds turned out to be wayyyyyy more correct than everyone who was arguing against me.
EPiPeN11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2008, 03:49 PM   #4017
EPiPeN11
banned
 
EPiPeN11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: akon is the goat
Posts: 18,605
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by tdarko View Post
2nd most efficient? Come on now.
Who is more efficent while creating their own shot?
EPiPeN11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2008, 03:52 PM   #4018
cowboy2579
adept
 
cowboy2579's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: 2+2 obv
Posts: 1,104
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by EPiPeN11 View Post
Uh career wise I never said he was better than Barkley or Malone, please get ur facts straight.

I said if we took the rules of this draft into consideration (players are cloned at age 24), that McHale would be better than Barkley or Malone.
I can't believe that you're still arguing this point. Can't you see than a clone of Kevin McHale before he hurt his foot is not > Sir Charles or the Mailman? There is no way that McHale is better than either of those two.
cowboy2579 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2008, 03:52 PM   #4019
MEb
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
MEb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 24,705
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by EPiPeN11 View Post
Heck, just look at the Boston 3 sports teams thread. Everyone was arguing about the odds, and flaming me etc. and my odds turned out to be wayyyyyy more correct than everyone who was arguing against me.
lol at using that thread as a way to show how you're always "right".
MEb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2008, 03:53 PM   #4020
EPiPeN11
banned
 
EPiPeN11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: akon is the goat
Posts: 18,605
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by cowboy2579 View Post
I can't believe that you're still arguing this point. Can't you see than a clone of Kevin McHale before he hurt his foot is not > Sir Charles or the Mailman? There is no way that McHale is better than either of those two.
No I can't.
EPiPeN11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2008, 03:53 PM   #4021
Assani Fisher
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Assani Fisher's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 48,128
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by EPiPeN11 View Post
it's that you guys drastically underrate McHale because a) you never saw him play
Quote:
Originally Posted by EPiPeN11 View Post
I base my arguments off what the experts say, not the 15 or so games I saw.
Assani Fisher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2008, 03:54 PM   #4022
EPiPeN11
banned
 
EPiPeN11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: akon is the goat
Posts: 18,605
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by MEbenhoe View Post
lol at using that thread as a way to show how you're always "right".
Again, people putting words into my mouth. I never said that I am always right, I just said that just because a lot of people are against u in an argument doesn't make THEM always right.
EPiPeN11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2008, 03:55 PM   #4023
Assani Fisher
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Assani Fisher's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 48,128
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Assani Fisher View Post
I believe I brought up drtg one time: When I did my write up on Tim Duncan. When else do you remember me bringing it up? And what do you mean you "thought I brought it up"? You can read my posts, correct? Either I did or I didn't.
bump
Assani Fisher is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2008, 03:56 PM   #4024
EPiPeN11
banned
 
EPiPeN11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: akon is the goat
Posts: 18,605
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Assani Fisher View Post
bump
u brought it up earlier in either this thread or another where u used it to evaluate defensive players because it was the best tool we had. I'm too lazy to find the link, but will do so if u deny it.
EPiPeN11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-18-2008, 04:01 PM   #4025
Assani Fisher
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Assani Fisher's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 48,128
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by EPiPeN11 View Post
There are plenty of people out there on message boards etc. that think McHale was better than either Barkley/Malone or both and this is when comparing their career's too which I don't even believe. People don't realize the rules, we are cloning these players at age 24, not basing it strictly on what exact stats they put up/how long they played etc. which actually helps McHale.

And just because the majority of people think something, it doesn't make it automatically right. Heck, just look at the Boston 3 sports teams thread. Everyone was arguing about the odds, and flaming me etc. and my odds turned out to be wayyyyyy more correct than everyone who was arguing against me.
So I take it that you can't ever remember one time in which everyone in the thread told me I was wrong and I didn't change my view, correct? And thanks for bringing up yet another thread where you did the same thing(and I fully disagree with you that you were correct, lol...but I'm not going to argue that anymore).

"People don't realize the rules"
WTF? Do you think we're a bunch of third graders or something? Contrary to what you might think, there are a lot of intelligent people out there perfectly capable of understanding basic rules and applying them. Its funny how when the majority disagree with you, you just adopt this "well everyone else is an idiot" type of stance. I probably had the same type of attitude before I went to college, but as I grew up I realized how immature it was and how it actually hurt my intellectual development. I guess you havn't realized that yet.
Assani Fisher is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply
      

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:48 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2008-2020, Two Plus Two Interactive