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Old 05-07-2008, 07:03 PM   #301
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

I am really going to hate who I take at 20...I just know it...I have a list of like 7 guys right now and it's not looking pretty as people keep getting picked.
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Old 05-07-2008, 07:03 PM   #302
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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Yes I can't believe he slipped that far as I was trying to desperatly trade up and get him. Imo he was easily a top 5 player, and honestly could be the best, even better than Jordan by the time his career is over although i'd still take Jordan.
There is absolutely zero chance Kobe Bryant will ever, ever, ever, ever surpass Jordan. In fact, there's only a small chance Kobe will ever have a year as good as Lebron's this year.
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Old 05-07-2008, 07:04 PM   #303
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

ain't close son
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Old 05-07-2008, 07:05 PM   #304
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

IT AIN'T CLOSE
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Old 05-07-2008, 07:05 PM   #305
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

Has the # of teams been locked up yet so we can have any idea of where we will pick in round 2 and such?
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Old 05-07-2008, 07:08 PM   #306
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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There is absolutely zero chance Kobe Bryant will ever, ever, ever, ever surpass Jordan. In fact, there's only a small chance Kobe will ever have a year as good as Lebron's this year.
Kobe's defense is only slightly worse than Jordans. Kobe's jump shot is argualy better (Jordan's midrange was better but Kobe kills Jordan in 3's).

Both were not the greatest passers, but were not bad either. Pretty even in rebounding, maybe very slight edge to Jordan. Both are killers/clutch etc

Jordan played in a weaker league, with a great/underrated player in Pippen. He also had Rodman, who was great as well. Horrace Grant before Rodman is very underrated, and BJ Armstrong was very good as well. Jordan also played in a weaker era during his prime.

I think Jordan was/is better but its very close and a ton closer than most people on here apparently believe.
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Old 05-07-2008, 07:09 PM   #307
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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IT AIN'T CLOSE
Kobe defense >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bird

Kobe offense > Bird

Stats don't tell the whole story like they do in baseball.
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Old 05-07-2008, 07:10 PM   #308
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

A small chance KObe Will ever have as good a year as Lebron had this year in terms of stats, I believe thats what someone just said yes? 2001-2002 I believe, Kobe had 30/7/7.......thats pretty damn ****ing close to 30/8/8-- this invalidates any opinion you ever have on this site ever. Well done.

Edit: Also kobe is almost 30, of course he wont have a 30/8/8 season or close to that again....altho I argue that 29/6/5 is really not THAT much different but whatever, go on being a kobe hater and not knowing anything about basketball and disgareeing with everything the analysts say.
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Old 05-07-2008, 07:12 PM   #309
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

Michael Jordan had 4 seasons where he used up 30% of his team's possessions and had a TS% of .600. Kobe has not done this once.

Hell, Kobe hasn't even had any season where he's had a TS% of .600, regardless of usage.
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Old 05-07-2008, 07:13 PM   #310
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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There is absolutely zero chance Kobe Bryant will ever, ever, ever, ever surpass Jordan. In fact, there's only a small chance Kobe will ever have a year as good as Lebron's this year.
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/...Fe5t6fdQ2kvLYF

30/7/6 2002-2003....also theres zero chance Lebron james will ever average 35.4 in one season or 42 for a month or score 81 in a game or have as many games over 50 as kobe has, blah blah blah blah GOD you dont even have a clue do you? YES Kobe has a chance to surpass jordan, and although theres also a solid chance he wont, if you dont admit he has a shot you really are a donk and know nothing about basketball (no ban please this donk refers to the general person and not to this poster)
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Old 05-07-2008, 07:14 PM   #311
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

The only player in front of me who I might have taken Kobe ahead of is Robinson, and that's only because I was too young to remember how dominant he was and I don't quite trust PER on that.
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Old 05-07-2008, 07:14 PM   #312
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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Kobe's defense is only slightly worse than Jordans. Kobe's jump shot is argualy better (Jordan's midrange was better but Kobe kills Jordan in 3's).

Both were not the greatest passers, but were not bad either. Pretty even in rebounding, maybe very slight edge to Jordan. Both are killers/clutch etc
why does everyone insist on comparing players like this? It's as dumb as comparing teams position by position. So useless.

And you're so far off when comparing D. Kobe is immensely overrated in that regard. He's had a couple of elite years early on and has ridden that reputation since. Don't just take it from me. Take it from Tex Winters, who has coached both:
Quote:
Because the Lakers need so much of his effort at the offensive end, Bryant has adopted a save-energy plan on the defensive end, Winter said. "He's basically playing a lot of one-man zone. He's doing a lot of switching, zoning up, trying to come up with the interception.

"The way Kobe plays defensively affects the team," Winter added. "Anybody that doesn't play consistently good defense hurts the team. That's not only Kobe. Our other guards tend to gamble and get beat. Another problem is that the screen and roll is not played correctly."
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Old 05-07-2008, 07:15 PM   #313
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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Michael Jordan had 4 seasons where he used up 30% of his team's possessions and had a TS% of .600. Kobe has not done this once.

Hell, Kobe hasn't even had any season where he's had a TS% of .600, regardless of usage.
Jordan also had a lot easier time because he had much better teammates during his prime, and his midrange game was amazing. Kobe takes more tough shots also (obv Jordan took a lot but Kobe took a lot more), which he def needs to cut back on although he has done a good job this year.
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Old 05-07-2008, 07:15 PM   #314
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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Michael Jordan had 4 seasons where he used up 30% of his team's possessions and had a TS% of .600. Kobe has not done this once.

Hell, Kobe hasn't even had any season where he's had a TS% of .600, regardless of usage.
I have no ****ing idea what TS% is.........when it comes down to kobe being compared to jordan, stats are pretty ****ing stupid to be using-- they are both amazing and if you arent a kobe hater and youve watched both, you must admit the simliarties are striking. FOrget ****ing stas, I hate stats wow, and not just becuase they usually dont favor kobe trust me. You can come up with stats for ****ing anything, what ever happened to ****ing watching basketball and being ablet o tell who the best player is!?
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Old 05-07-2008, 07:17 PM   #315
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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Jordan also had a lot easier time because he had much better teammates during his prime, and his midrange game was amazing. Kobe takes more tough shots also (obv Jordan took a lot but Kobe took a lot more), which he def needs to cut back on although he has done a good job this year.
Shaq?
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Old 05-07-2008, 07:18 PM   #316
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

oh sweet the "hard shots are a good thing" defense.
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Old 05-07-2008, 07:18 PM   #317
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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Shaq?
Kobe wasn't in his prime then except for maybe 1 year? Remember he came outa HS, so he was 3-4 years behind most rookies in the 80's/early 90's.
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Old 05-07-2008, 07:18 PM   #318
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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Jordan also had a lot easier time because he had much better teammates during his prime, and his midrange game was amazing. Kobe takes more tough shots also (obv Jordan took a lot but Kobe took a lot more), which he def needs to cut back on although he has done a good job this year.
We're not talking about his championship years here, y'know. We're talking about those 80's years where he was w/o Scottie but was still just a one man wrecking crew.

Also, yeah, part of the reason he's better (and we take him at 1) is because his midrange game is better.
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Old 05-07-2008, 07:19 PM   #319
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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why does everyone insist on comparing players like this? It's as dumb as comparing teams position by position. So useless.

And you're so far off when comparing D. Kobe is immensely overrated in that regard. He's had a couple of elite years early on and has ridden that reputation since. Don't just take it from me. Take it from Tex Winters, who has coached both:
Eh I dunno, Kobe is still an elite defender. You'd be very hard to find 5 players at the SG/SF position who play better defense. Heck it's hard to name 3.
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Old 05-07-2008, 07:20 PM   #320
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

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We're not talking about his championship years here, y'know. We're talking about those 80's years where he was w/o Scottie but was still just a one man wrecking crew.

Also, yeah, part of the reason he's better (and we take him at 1) is because his midrange game is better.
Well then its even closer because he was better in the 90's than he was in the 80's.

And like I said, I would still take Jordan, and odds are that Jordan will be the best player when Kobe is retired, but it's a lot closer than people think.

Anyway I am going out for a bit, I will respond to this thread later tonight/tomorrow.
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Old 05-07-2008, 07:21 PM   #321
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

Stephen Jackson plays better defense than Kobe.
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Old 05-07-2008, 07:21 PM   #322
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

He's stepped it up some this year, but he coasted for like the past 5 seasons before this
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Old 05-07-2008, 07:23 PM   #323
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

Are people flaming Bird still? Its hard to keep up with.
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Old 05-07-2008, 07:25 PM   #324
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

Please save some flames for me, I have one person in mind and if he gets taken I'm going off the board so to speak.
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Old 05-07-2008, 07:28 PM   #325
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Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion Thread

I wish this didn't devolve into a Kobe/MJ argument but I like that Tex Winters article so I will comment:

He is spot on on how Kobe plays defense - "energy saving plan", "one man zone". But Kobe still gets a lot of intense man on assignments from time to time in tight 4th quarter games and he always brings it. Maybe my favorite 4th quarter Kobe performance this year came when he played incredible ball denial versus Kevin Martin.

IMO, his man defense will shine out more if he's surrounded by a bunch of hall of famers and all-defense role-players, as he should be in an all-time franchise draft.
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