+1 ldo

Stockton and Malone is the exact thing I'm talking about in my last post. Guys were made to play with each other and thus their stats are better than they actually are. It's not like football where Randy Moss is going to make every quarterback he ever plays with look like he should be in the HOF. You put Kemp with a great passer (Payton was never that great of a passer) and he'll be putting up much larger numbers.

tbach,

fair point about PFs/Cs drawing interior D out of the lane, and I do like the inside out ability of Sheed a ton. I've just watched (yes watched, I watch an assload of ball) too many games where he goes through long stretches of hardly being involved. Just roaming the perimeter, swinging the ball.

It's when Sheed asserts himself that he's absolutely balla. But you don't get that 100% of the time.

Ok, but part of this is that he has been playing with a team that doesn't really have other 3 pt shooters (Chauncy and..... ??), while they do have other guys who are good rebounders at their position (other Wallace before, Maxiel now, Prince, etc).

except you've got no data to back this up. People say this **** all teh time and I don't see it.

+1


Although its weird...even though I didn't love either the Hill or Kemp picks at the time, I really like pairing them together.

Yeah, he may or may not be as effective, and does get lost at times, but by accounts Sheed is one of the smartest basketball players in the league and I'm sure he's got a reason for doing what he does. If I watched more Pistons (I probably only saw them like 6-8 times this season) I'd know more. I'm gonna watch him really closely in the next round though.

And there's no data to say that it isn't true. This whole draft is pretty speculative so you've got to form an opinion sometime

Seriously? I mean Dwight Howard and Amare Stoudamire have already put up MVP type seasons and you're assuming that someone who has put up All Star type production for 1/4 of a season will be better? Thats not to mention other big men entering the league or guys like Bosh, Ming, etc.

The problem is that I'm not sure that their offensive talent makes up for the fact that they are two guards and neither of them is an elite stopper. It's just that quality bigs will be harder to find, it's going to be tough to get a good one in the third and I'm not sure what you'll get picking up late in the fourth. Basically, you're probably never going to have a good defensive team, and might struggle to score inside.
to make up for that they'll need to be even better offensively, especially when guys with top scorers won't struglle top put points on the board.
At this point , Ginobilie is great value, but it's unfortunate to match up with Nash. It will be interesting to see how this team end up, maybe I'm wrong i my estimation of the talent left in the third and fourth round.

Malone is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Kemp

yes, we've all noted your extreme hatred for kemp. was one of his children with your sister or something?

I'm not saying Malone and Stockton playing together isn't a + for each guy, but I don't think it's a HUGE factor. I mean I've seen arguments for both Malone and Stockton saying they'd never be all world without the other guy. That's ridiculous.

I can't name any guys so I won't, but there are lots of examples of great players getting split up and neither really dropping in production. If they raise it's usually just do to usage.

Take McHale and Bird. Bird missed the '88-'89 season. You'd expect McHale to step it up.. or perhaps you'd think losing Bird would make it too tough for him. Nope.. neither. Just about identical to his previous year.

Ad hominem...

Doesn't change the fact that you greatly overrate Kemp...

The Kemp/Hill combo is good, but stop comparing Kemp to all-time greats...

+1

Love the direction of that team. Sick defense.

Dirk and Nash would be a classic example. Both actually improved after they split up.

Pippen played just as good (if not better) the year without Jordan.

sheed + gp has to be the best trash talking duo in the league right?

Clark, can you name (PM me if you think it'd be an issue here) some guys who you think looked as good as Bynum and then dropped off without some reasonable explanation like injuries?

This is something I'm completely willing to change my mind on, but as I've said a bunch in the past, I see a lot of reasons why Bynum should be able to sustain and even improve on his performance so far.

of course. Just another reason I wanted Larry + Sheed, btw. I'd have the real loud obnoxious **** talker and Larry whispering in your ear telling you how and where he's going to burn you.

McHale had been played injured for a year before that and obv it was even worse during the 88-89 season. McHale in the 88-89 season wasn't close to the one in the 85-86 season or even the 86-87 one where he hurt it.

When you take into account the type of people he will have to defend against in this league he will probably be doing a lot worse than he is now.

So much of what McHale did was done in iso postups though. I think he was more helped by the fact that other teams would have more trouble doubling him (because he had great 3 pt shooters and the chief to help him out). I just remember so much of what Malone doing was greatly derived from one of the greatest passers of all time. Honestly, I think you put Kemp with Stockton (or Nash or Kidd) and you can pad up those stats all day.

Haha yeah van exel ad hominem. It's just that you've hated on the Kemp pick a lot already. That's the last I'll say about the Kemp to Malone comparison for now though. I've probably talked enough about what I think his play could've been (and Hill's injury) to make you think that my team is a lock for the 'ship (which I don't, depending on how a couple guys up top fill out their rosters).

Like I said, my only concerns are that neither of them can really rebound and you're really missing out on 3pt shooting. These can be remedied, but you're gonna be looking at a team without a real number one.

I don't wanna give too much away, but doesn't that kinda remind you of another team that Rasheed plays on?

epip,

you don't have to keep reminding us how incredible and awesome McHale is every time someone mentions his name. Even injured McHale was pretty damn awesome; that wasn't my point.

just saying ur example was flawed because u are comparing a healthy McHale with Bird to a hurt McHale without Bird and then trying to show that it sometimes doesn't matter about ur supporting cast ussage.