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View Poll Results: GOAT?
labron 140 30.91%
MJ (Michael or Maple) 232 51.21%
Therapist 7 1.55%
George Mikan 2 0.44%
Shaq Attaq 18 3.97%
Wilt the Stilt (100 pts yo) 12 2.65%
Timmy "Big Fundamentals" Duncan 18 3.97%
"Roger Murdock" 3 0.66%
Enchanted AIDS Wang (er, HIV+?) 8 1.77%
Larry Legend (+ HM to Bill Russell's laugh) 13 2.87%
Voters: 453. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-01-2013, 08:02 PM   #201
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Re: NBA: MJ vs. Labron GOAT Discussion Containment Thread



I don't see Bron topping this movie either.
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Old 06-01-2013, 08:02 PM   #202
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Lebron isn't even the best player in the league right now.

Duncan and Kobe >>>>>>> Lebron
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Old 06-01-2013, 08:07 PM   #203
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Re: NBA: MJ vs. Labron GOAT Discussion Containment Thread

Oh good. EdBratz is here.
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Old 06-01-2013, 08:08 PM   #204
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Re: NBA: MJ vs. Labron GOAT Discussion Containment Thread

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Originally Posted by monikrazy View Post
Are you really advocating that lebron is as 'competive and mentally tough' as MJ was?

(Winning) psychology seems like a pretty normal thing to discuss in the context of greatest-of-all-time players.

And it seems perfectly fair to suggest that Lebron mental approach to the game was markedly weaker than other great players until he

- handpicked 2 superstars to play with him, including SACRIFICING salary - clearly trading $$$$ for mental infirmities

- handpicking hall of famer Pat Riley to manage his team

- **losing championships / playoffs / choking

- negative media about the decision faded

Lebron has improved some part of his game every single year while not allowing other parts to fall off. So Idk where this notion he lacks competitiveness comes from.

Lebron has admitted faults and corrected them.

There have been 1000s of players in multiple sports to leave a team in FA. Lebron is somehow the only person who apparantly isnt allowed to do so.

Jordan lost playoff series. If he happened to lose a few finals series his career wouldnt be any less spectacular. Im sure Jordan would tell you himself he would rather get to a few extra finals and lose then not get there at all.
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Old 06-01-2013, 08:20 PM   #205
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Re: NBA: MJ vs. Labron GOAT Discussion Containment Thread

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Originally Posted by ClarkNasty View Post
What is the betting line for LBJ titles? At 1 now and a 75-80% favorite to be at 2 before the end of the year. He is 28 (turns 29 in late December). o/u 5.5 with over being a money favorite?
end of next season?

as for the o/u, depends on how long he wants to play, how well he ages, how much he chases RANGZ late as an old man, etc, hard to say really

i'm a nit so i'd probably take the under
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Old 06-01-2013, 08:26 PM   #206
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Re: NBA: MJ vs. Labron GOAT Discussion Containment Thread

no poll?
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Old 06-01-2013, 08:33 PM   #207
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Re: NBA: MJ vs. Labron GOAT Discussion Containment Thread

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What is the betting line for LBJ titles? At 1 now and a 75-80% favorite to be at 2 before the end of the year. He is 28 (turns 29 in late December). o/u 5.5 with over being a money favorite?
no way. they really that big of favs over spurs?
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Old 06-01-2013, 08:37 PM   #208
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Re: NBA: MJ vs. Labron GOAT Discussion Containment Thread

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end of next season?

as for the o/u, depends on how long he wants to play, how well he ages, how much he chases RANGZ late as an old man, etc, hard to say really

i'm a nit so i'd probably take the under
actually, its more important how much he chases rangz when he opts out in 2014. not sure that heat are gunna maximize his title opps as wade is ripe for a big decline. will lebron be ruthless and callous enough to relocate?
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Old 06-01-2013, 08:37 PM   #209
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Grunching. I'm from Chicago and love Jordan, but I don't get sore about LBJ being tossed into the goat discussion because (1) if his career continues on path it's on, he'll obviously deserve to be in the discussion and (2) I want to see jaw-dropping greatness, even if it puts my favorite player in its shadow. A part of me wants to see LBJ fail because of, I'm ashamed to admit, puerile jealousy, but I can admit where the schadenfreude comes from, and I can't deny I get the same feeling of awe I got watching Jordan.
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Old 06-01-2013, 08:38 PM   #210
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Quote:
Originally Posted by poisoneye1986 View Post
Lebron has improved some part of his game every single year while not allowing other parts to fall off. So Idk where this notion he lacks competitiveness comes from.

Lebron has admitted faults and corrected them.

There have been 1000s of players in multiple sports to leave a team in FA. Lebron is somehow the only person who apparantly isnt allowed to do so.

Jordan lost playoff series. If he happened to lose a few finals series his career wouldnt be any less spectacular. Im sure Jordan would tell you himself he would rather get to a few extra finals and lose then not get there at all.
Well yeah of course he would say that, but it doesn't change the fact that MJ never lost when reaching the finals. Lebron has, multiple times in choking fashion.

Lebron has gotten better in all facets of the game and the one thing that sets him apart in a lot of ways is his basketball IQ. His post game is still the weakest part of his game. I know its not his mentality, but with his physique ge needs to be going down low more often.
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Old 06-01-2013, 08:47 PM   #211
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Re: NBA: MJ vs. Labron GOAT Discussion Containment Thread

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Originally Posted by LeoTrollstoy View Post
I'm also a big fan of the "but LeBrons teammates weren't better" argument because guess what? LeBron joined his buddies in south beach, had a 2-1 lead in the finals, then got cocky and decided to mock Dirks illness with gay wade coughing for cameras that lit a fire in Dirk LeBron is incapable of.

Oh yeah, they lost that lead and series.
We can't underestimate the skill level of that Mavericks team though. You have Dirk in his prime, The Matrix, Vinsanity, and J-Kidd. That is like 4 legit HOFers. El Heat only have 2 HOFers -- Labron & Dwayde.
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Old 06-01-2013, 08:51 PM   #212
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Re: NBA: MJ vs. Labron GOAT Discussion Containment Thread

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Originally Posted by Victor View Post
actually, its more important how much he chases rangz when he opts out in 2014. not sure that heat are gunna maximize his title opps as wade is ripe for a big decline. will lebron be ruthless and callous enough to relocate?
Is Wade on pace for a big decline though?
Reg Season Stats

24 PER
.571 TS

His little nagging injuries have been concerning, but i think the heat can manage his season better to keep him more fresh.

I think he can still play great but in shorter spurts.

I know it wont happen but maybe utilize as the spurs use ginobili. Wades always gonna be a starter but maybe limiting those minutes to <28 and giving him days off, etc.

The way spoelstra plays lebron in the reg season. Sitting 1st 6 mins in the 2nd Q and 4th Q.

Play wade 1st 6 mins of 1st Q. Bench. 1st 6 mins of 2nd Q. Bench. 1st 6 of 3rd Q. Bench. 6-10 4th Q mins.

He can increase his effectivenes getting 12 mins w/o lebron and have more legs to finish off the game.

Really im more concerned with chris bosh. His rebounding is weak and im concerned this play with him just spotting up at 3 will become his game. He has a good shot but hes not dirk nowitzki.

Last edited by poisoneye1986; 06-01-2013 at 09:10 PM.
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Old 06-01-2013, 08:54 PM   #213
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Re: NBA: MJ vs. Labron GOAT Discussion Containment Thread

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It's an interesting argument because I would argue Jordan was a better player in some of the title years than during his PER peak years pre-title. Same with Labron, it seems his defense is much better, his outside shooting is better and he can post up. I think he's a better player now than in 2009.
I think he definitely is better now. He's just a smarter player now too, both in terms of basic basketball IQ and knowing when to press and when to relax and let his teammates do the work.
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Old 06-01-2013, 09:03 PM   #214
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Re: NBA: MJ vs. Labron GOAT Discussion Containment Thread

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Originally Posted by mucksandgravs View Post
Well yeah of course he would say that, but it doesn't change the fact that MJ never lost when reaching the finals. Lebron has, multiple times in choking fashion.

Lebron has gotten better in all facets of the game and the one thing that sets him apart in a lot of ways is his basketball IQ. His post game is still the weakest part of his game. I know its not his mentality, but with his physique ge needs to be going down low more often.
Im just saying like other posters have stated people make too big of a deal about losing in the finals.

Lebrons critics have nit picked every aspect of his game and he has improved every area. Theres really nothing to nitpick anymore. The guy won his 4th MVP and he said he wants to improve foul shooting. He shoots 75% probably league avg for a perimeter player. But that is where we are at with him. Hes improved every aspect of his game and its down to foul shooting.

And again, no one is arguing that if Lebron retired today he is > Jordan.

But after 10 seasons assuming he wins ring #2 along with 4 MVPs that accomplishment is =/>Jordan.

If Lebron accomplishes all that and we use the age comparison its definitely > Jordan.

I dont thinks theres much else to say except stop resisting lebron and appreciate what were watching. It doesnt come along very often. I feel fortunate to see MJ play his last 3 years with the Bulls and wish I could see the whole career but I had to settle for ESPN classic to watch more of his career.
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Old 06-01-2013, 09:07 PM   #215
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Re: NBA: MJ vs. Labron GOAT Discussion Containment Thread

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I think he definitely is better now. He's just a smarter player now too, both in terms of basic basketball IQ and knowing when to press and when to relax and let his teammates do the work.
Agree completely. More diverse, more efficient and just looks like hes in complete control at all times and can do as he feels at any given moment. He is patiently waiting to take charge. If its necessary he will if its not he'll go with the flow.

I wouldnt necesarilly call him streaky in Cleveland but it just seems he can flip a switch anytime he wants now.

Last edited by poisoneye1986; 06-01-2013 at 09:12 PM.
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Old 06-01-2013, 09:10 PM   #216
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Quote:
Originally Posted by monikrazy View Post


I don't see Bron topping this movie either.
LeBron would take his talents to Moron Mountain when they're down at halftime.
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Old 06-01-2013, 09:12 PM   #217
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Thought the consensus was bosh is a favorite for the hof
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Old 06-01-2013, 09:15 PM   #218
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Thought the consensus was bosh is a favorite for the hof
We're talking about a guy that made some dumbass video to try and make the all star game.
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Old 06-01-2013, 09:21 PM   #219
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Re: NBA: MJ vs. Labron GOAT Discussion Containment Thread

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We're talking about a guy that made some dumbass video to try and make the all star game.
Well he will campaign just as hard for the HOF. He will make it if he wins some more.

Speaking of Bosh. Who do you like more going forward, wade or bosh?

Luxury tax will come in, I believe next year. If you had to trade one who is it?
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Old 06-01-2013, 09:33 PM   #220
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When LeBron opts out I hope there is another televised "the Decision."

Also, if MJ was in the league right now at the same age as LeBron there would be a tiny number of LeBron backers on here and the rest of SE would be gigantic MJ slurpers because of his mega baller lifestyle.

Last edited by Palo; 06-01-2013 at 09:39 PM.
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Old 06-01-2013, 09:35 PM   #221
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Re: NBA: MJ vs. Labron GOAT Discussion Containment Thread

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LeBron would take his talents to Moron Mountain when they're down at halftime.
One point lead mother****ers
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Old 06-01-2013, 10:02 PM   #222
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Well hey we know what Lebron is the GOAT at...flopping.
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Old 06-01-2013, 10:06 PM   #223
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Re: NBA: MJ vs. Labron GOAT Discussion Containment Thread

confirmed
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Old 06-01-2013, 10:12 PM   #224
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LeBron choking again in big games
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Old 06-01-2013, 10:14 PM   #225
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Thread can be closed now. Lebron GOAT BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
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