My (probably) dumb opinion: If sexist remarks by players and coaches were taken as seriously as racist comments, then about 90% of NFL players and management would lose their job.

I certainly agree that in the Gruden case, his resignation or firing was absolutely necessary.

Having said that, with the ever-widening encroachment of so-called "cancel culture", it will be interesting (at least to me) to see if the same standard will soon be applied to, say, sexist remarks. If so, I suspect that would lead to resignations/firings on a mass scale. (Which perhaps it should, I might add.)

The bar to fire Gruden was so ridiculously low it's a miracle he lasted this long.

Well he was such a Grinder. He kept grinding along.

Point of Information: Gruden was not fired; he resigned.

Does it matter? Fairly certain Gruden would have been fired if he did not resign basically immediately.

If he was fired they might have had to pay him.

Him resigning went along with a buyout.

Yeah, I don't know the terms of his contract so maybe. AFAIK the team and him are still negotiating the final payout.

Point is his leash was shorter than anyone else.

Agree 100%

Saw the game and noticed the words “end racism” in the end zone. Kind of funny (and horrifying at the same time) the end zone had the words “end racism” after the team hired a racist coach with $100 contract and the owner was angry that the coach was pushed out.

This is painted in the Kansas City Chiefs stadium too. You can see it when they show the end zone fans doing the Tomahawk chant.

The tomahawk chant might be dumb, but it isn't racist. Naming a team the Chiefs is honoring the virtues that Native-American tribal leaders were perceived to have embodied (strength, courage, fortitude, etc). It's kinda the opposite of racism; you don't name a team after something you hate.

addendum: That said, maybe the students, staff and faculty of U.C. Irvine really do hate anteaters.

It's as racist as Grudens emails.

Just as the WFTs old name was.

So, is it your opinion that the team was named "Redskins" because the owners hated Native-Americans? (I assume you understand that racism is rooted in hate, right?)

"Redskins", "Chiefs", and "Braves" are the embodiment of courage, strength and fortitude.

There is a reason why most pro teams have names like "Eagles" and "Lions" and "Tigers", rather than names like "Cockroaches" and "Weasels."

A team is typically named because it represents a virtue.

Keep your mindless drivel and racist apology nonsense in the politics forum.

Hate is a part of racism, but so is a lack of respect. It matters how the other side feels, not just what the racist intends.

Blind use of stereotypes and names is a big part of racism, not an incidental error of well meaning supremacists.

Terrible contortions are necessary to paint the WFT's old name as anything other than racist and if you don't get that you should probably just shut the hell up. It's no different than having a football team named "*******" or "*****" or etc.

Kewl rant post, Skippy!

Naming your team the Redskins is dumb but yeah, was meant in a positive way on some level ("hey, them injuns are a buncha tough mother****ers! Let's show everybody how tough we are and name ourselves after em"). That said, you can easily argue it's a darker kind of stereotype (they're all savages, etc.) and that's where the racism comes in.

Then you have the matter of keeping the name as long as they did, which unequivocally sucks.

Maybe I'm splitting hairs, but I think the "toughness and courage" angle is more cultural than racial.

I don't recall a great outcry about the San Diego State Aztecs for example. (Maybe because Aztecs no longer exist.)

San Diego also had an ABA team called the Conquistitors, and still of course have the Padres. Those are clearly cultural references, given the history of California.

Having said all that, it is really, really dumb to have a team nickname or mascot that offends people.

Redskins is an epithet. It's demeaning. It may have meant something else sometime ago, but to the people who are referred to as "redskins" it is not a compliment.

By that logic, the Tennessee Titans should actually be called the Tennessee N-words because of their hard work and resilience out in the fields.

This message is hidden because lagtight is on your ignore list.

Very fortunate that he found sports

Good.

I wouldn't say that's the worst analogy I've ever read, but it's for sure on the short list.

As recently as 2016, a Washington Post survey revealed that 80% of those polled who self-identified as Native-American either were not offended by nor were bothered by the nickname Redskins.

Pretty sure far less than 80% of African-American's would be unoffended and/or not bothered by the Tennessee N-word.

Having said that, it's still idiotic (in my opinion) to have a nickname that offends people.

Nice spin job but the idea that we can genocide a people nearly out of existence and then mock them for eternity by naming our sports teams after them is simply no longer gonna be accepted. That's just a natural consequence of popular struggle making society more civilized.

Or maybe you're right. Can't wait for the NFL to go global so I can finally watch the Berlin Jews vs the Istanbul Armenians!!

So, the original owners of the Kansas City Chiefs chose that nickname because they wanted to mock native-Americans?

Did the original owners of the Philadelphia Eagles choose that nickname because they wanted to mock birds?

Did the original owners of the Cleveland Rams choose that nickname because they wanted to mock horned animals?

Did the original owners of the San Diego Clippers choose that nickname because they wanted to mock big ships?

Did the New York baseball team switch it's nickname to Yankees because they wanted to mock Americans?

Chiefs represent courage and strength and a host of other virtues.

Having said that, it is still idiotic (in my opinion) to have a nickname that offends people.

Anyway, this discussion is a derail from the purpose of this thread. And since we all agree (I assume) that it is stupid to keep a nickname that offends people, I will return to only discussing Jon Gruden in this particular thread.

Maybe the mods can move this derail to a new thread if anyone wants to continue this discussion.


Stay well and be safe, everybody!