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FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion
View Poll Results: Who you got?
Brasil
47 17.28%
Germany
40 14.71%
Argentina
20 7.35%
Spain
22 8.09%
Belgium
22 8.09%
Holland
11 4.04%
Italy
11 4.04%
England
22 8.09%
Colombia
3 1.10%
USA USA USA
74 27.21%

06-27-2014 , 12:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bjørn
I don't know if this can turn into a team of the group stages or something but my best players so far:

The stars:

Neymar often with little help so far looks amazing and just has another gear than everyone else this tournament. His performances actually reminds me of Messi 4 years ago who was such a vertical threat almost whenever the ball was at his feet. Neymar isn't quite at that complete high level of playmaking for his team but no one (not named Robben in transition) is a bigger threat this World Cup in parts because physically there is no doubt he is capable of more faster, more stronger, longer than Messi and what I would call more amazing spurts of his.

Hector Herrera and his almost unreal lift in quality currently is just fantastic. He's been a physical two-way beast right from the start a few years ago but cleverness tactically and to some extent creatively as well and the seemingly dramatic rise in his technique that has come along with it looks extraordinary. He is playing that right-central midfield spot defending and attacking out of his mind right now fully set at a high level that I thought, if he would ever reach it, were years away. Hopefully he can keep it up.

Vidal is still more high-level versatile with his ability to play all kinds of midfield roles great but what Herrera is doing at his particular spot currently isn't even a bad comparison.

Probably my favorite performer so far.

Ochoa with his heroics obviously has a case for best goalkeeper performer.

Robben goes without saying. At his best he has a valid argument for being the best transition player in the world and he looks to be at his best right now.

Alexis Sanchez also has to be mentioned. He has been in inspired form for most of the tournament which is always fantastic to watch. Skill with the ball, change of pace and directions relentlessly + all that hard Chile style physical work.

Tim Cahill I don't like very much but at least for a few games he was the often uncontrollable penalty-area threat, not least in the air, the nastiness naturally being part of his arsenal that used to make him one of the better players in England for a number of years.

Manolos young greek defender has been close to immense. I don't think that can be said about a lot of defenders in this tournament.

Both him and partner Sokratis has looked very solid and Greece in years past at their shut-down defensive best/most ugly I don't think ever had two centrebacks this good individually.

Manolos is fast for a centreback, looks like a decent footballer and I haven't seen anything wrong with marking, helping or positioning in general. On the contrary it has simply been great positives all-around.

When I've been doing my rankings the last couple of years whenever I'd get to James Rodriguez I always said that what separated him from an otherwise impressive wave of new winger-types was his high degree of creativity and skill going into playmaking central of the pitch in the smallest of spaces. Yeah, he's also pacy. Has an impact foot going for him. But there is even more to him than that and it's really a treat watching him being the number 10 wearing man leading his national team. He is a star.

Cuadrado also have to be named. He just continues to be attacking chaos personified coming at poor defenders. Not long ago there was still some questions if he could transform his staggering success (winning dribbling in Serie A every year) at mostly wing-back pn to the attacking midfielder right-wing as well but sure enough in this role also for a while now, featuring more decisions to get right more often, it hasn't slowed him down at all and he just continues to perform his thing terrorizing defenders not least 1v1 one.

Messi has been very good.

Now if he is pacing himself somewhat can he really lift himself to something at least close to his own goatish-level nearing Maradona 86 epicness or will it just be the current path which is really more Maradona 90 moments of magic lifting his team through the rounds only to fall short eventually because neither he or his team are at their peaks.

Very good performers:

Thiago Silva isn't playing unreal great so far but there are still too few centreback rivals to seriously challenge him so he can't be ignored.

Miguel Layún is delivering all you could ask for and sometimes more as a wing-back.

Other Mexico: Vasques I haven't watched closely enough to determine just how good he really but I suspect very good, very important and therefore fear for his absence against Holland.

The three defenders, especially the vets cuz they need it, Marquez and Maza look so much better when they're three and Guardado who basically haven't been good at club level for 4 years straight with his particular characteristics looks like a great match both attacking and defending in that system.

Perisic: Sizable, athletic kind of old school winger who is strong enough to also play and thrive in old school 442s. Yeah I think he is one of those players who could actually be more of a hit in England than in Germany. Not for the very best teams but there are definitely teams where he could be extremely useful.

Van Persie also up there as one of the best forwards in transition. What a boost it is for a not so impressive looking Dutch side to have Van Gaal cover weaknesses and all out play to his team's elite strengths.

Charles Aránguiz Not the Chile midfielder I most expected to perform the best. But I like the Chile midfielders. Even Chile midfielders not getting playing time or not even in the squad. Even with Vidal struggling it's a good bunch.

Carlos Sánchez has easily been one of the best defensive midfielders of the tournament. Performing very strong physical and intelligent defensive clean up duties and also well capable of starting the well oiled Colombia transition.

Sokratis: Not as outstanding as his talented partner but very solid and strong nonetheless.

Serge Aurier when I first saw him some years back it was the athleticism and the problems it gave his matchups that caught my eye but in the meantime he looks very polished at 21. Dare I say, almost Sagna-polished?

The Costa Rica defenders! I'm not sure who to single out but as a unit they haven't missed a beat whether neutralizing opponents protecting a low-block or being more aggressive higher up making the Italy-attack look like a joke 90 pct of the match.

Keylor Navas:Impressive athletic goalkeeper.

Diego Godin should probably have been included among the stars but I was being very selective. He's just relentlessly coming through winning defensive sequence after sequence.

Benzema: There will be tougher tests to come but step one is looking in top condition and that he does. Such a complete striker.

Matuidi He provides his teams with so much useful quality work and it never stops.

Shaqiri is a little borderline here but even though it's more on and off I suppose he is doing a mini-James Rodriguez being the man lifting his team's attack.

Di Maria He just never stops in his midfield role constantly putting opponents to the test with the aggressiveness and quality in actions. Not least his strong skillful running.

Emmanuel Emenike is a very strong and highly capable striker. I could see him at a top club.

Thomas Müller can't be ignored. Likely the best winger/attacking midfielder anticipating and attacking the inside of the box off-ball. He does that so good he will also guarantee goals as a striker. However I do think Müller and his teams are even better if it's not all relied upon him solely trying to do it.

USA: who to single out? Dempsey has delivered which was a must but Jones with his overall midfield work is my first thought as their best player so far.

Bradley seems like he is being asked/trying to do more than ever and his output has been inconsistent.

Fabian Johnson has been dynamic taken effectively advantage of space not least against the disaster that was the Portugal left side. The centre-backs seems to have been pretty solid but not sure who to single out or if they would be deserving at all.

William Carvalho was very brief and he doesn't really deserve to be mentioned but holy **** it does look like the hype is real and this is the most physically imposing young defensive midfielder I can remember seeing in a while. The rest looked good too.

Algeria is another team where I'm not sure who to single out if any. Feghouli who I've never liked much is the easy answer and I do like him more here than about 80 pct of the time for Valancia. Maybe Bentaleb and his influence is the smart answer though while players like Brahimi and Slimani have been surprisingly impactful.

Eden Hazard and I don't think it's a great thing that the only other Belgian player who might be in contention happens to be Fellaini.
Ok Kompany is also mentionable I guess.

I'm probably forgetting some and there seems to be a drastic enough shortage of left and right-backs to prevent a team getting made.
Great post as per usual Björn. Any chance you could pop into the summer transfer thread and give your thoughts on Ander Herrera and his fit in LvG's United
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote
06-27-2014 , 12:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sugar Nut
When we had possession yesterday we kept the foot off the gas pretty substantially, and that was the smart thing to do. As I wrote above, our approach when we had lost the ball was 100% commitment to winning it back, so yeah, I guess in that regard we've played to the top of our abilities yesterday. In possession not so much.
I think Germany played a well controlled game against USA and I don't think you can't expect anything more given the situation in the group (similarly I wouldn't put too much weight into France's final game). The game against Ghana did mean something though and it was a very even game.

It's fun to argue who's been playing best in the tournament, but when I have some doubts in this German team it's partly due to past performances. Germany was my favorite team in WC 2010 and they played great, until they ran into a brick wall that was Spain. Germany was also my favorite team in Euro 2012 and they played great, until they ran into a brick wall that was Italy. Those games weren't even close. Sure, Spain 2010 was a phenomenal team and playing from behind against Italy is really tough, but the way they completely shut down Germany has shaken my confidence in their ability to perform against high level teams and handle adversity. It was reinforced when they dropped their 4-0 lead vs Sweden. Fair enough, with a 4-0 you can't blame them for thinking the game was over, but their inability regain control of the game and seeming nervousness in the face of adversity was pretty shocking.

This is not necessarily a fair criticism, you can argue it was a long time ago, small sample size etc, I'm just explaining where I'm coming from. I don't think analyzing Germany's chances based on events 1-4 years ago is great, neither do I think looking at just the first group stage games is perfect. It's possible this is the tournament this German generation will put it all together and have a leader and a match winner step up when necessary, but I will remain a bit skeptical until I've seen them against a high quality opponent.
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote
06-27-2014 , 12:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobboFitos
i get usa, you get algeria. put up $$$ or shut up
gtfo clown

algeria are playing the best team in the worldcup
USA are playing an overrated belgium team
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote
06-27-2014 , 12:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cashy
gtfo clown

algeria are playing the best team in the worldcup
USA are playing an overrated belgium team
False.

Second statement's true, tho.
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote
06-27-2014 , 12:52 PM
re - björn

Manolas really was outstanding, watched him closely this WC and mentioned that he is ready to make the step-up to a top-club(reminds me a little of koscielny with his athleticism/anticipation)

Aurier looked the real deal which was surprising to me, his attacking qualities were somewhat expected but he looked elite in 1vs1 situations defensively and wingers barely got a sniff vs him

also you miss Valbuena who has been france's key player so far imo as he has been a fantastic play-maker drifting in from wide
special mention to 37(!) year old karagounis who has been a key figure in getting greece back on track
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote
06-27-2014 , 01:36 PM
Best 11 from group stages according to FIFA's index:

---------------Enyeama-------------
D.Luiz---van Buyten---T.Silva---Sakho
J.Rodriguez---Perisic---Shaqiri---Lahm
--------Benzema----Robben---------

Top 3:

1. Rodriguez
2. Perisic
3. Luiz
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote
06-27-2014 , 01:47 PM
without thinking too much about it


Ochoa

Aurier/Manolas/Marquez/Rodriguez

Valbuena/James/Di Maria

Sanchez/Robben/Neymar
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote
06-27-2014 , 01:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sly Caveat
I think a lot of those rankings put too much value in the name of the country on the jersey and not enough how they are playing. If you don't have Costa Rica near the top that just proves your bias.

Germany
France
Netherlands
Colombia
Brazil
Costa Rica
Chile
Argentina
Belgium
Uruguay
USA
Mexico
Algeria
Nigeria
Switzerland
Greece

I think most people have Switzerland way overrated. France made them look like Swiss cheese. Should have been 7 goals if Benzema doesn't blow the pk and the ref doesn't blow the whistle prematurely at the end.
good list. wouldnt change a thing.
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote
06-27-2014 , 01:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by martymc1
Japan are no walkovers btw.
now you're just out - and - out trolling. afc managed 3 draws total and 0 wins. none of their sides were good. some matches were competitive, i guess. but any group with an afc team was an easier group
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote
06-27-2014 , 01:53 PM
Yeah I'm not sure how I forgot the flamboyant but effective Ricardo Rodriguez.
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote
06-27-2014 , 01:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cashy
without thinking too much about it


Ochoa

Aurier/Manolas/Marquez/Rodriguez

Valbuena/James/Di Maria

Sanchez/Robben/Neymar
Need more Messi
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote
06-27-2014 , 02:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobboFitos
now you're just out - and - out trolling. afc managed 3 draws total and 0 wins. none of their sides were good. some matches were competitive, i guess. but any group with an afc team was an easier group
claimed nothing more than Japan are no walkover, not trolling at all. If you want to disagree with that, go ahead.

wtf the rest of their confederation has to do with anything I'll never know, unless you want to enlighten me.

Not sure if you're trolling with the confederation nonsense again or not.
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote
06-27-2014 , 02:02 PM
messi needs to be on every list
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote
06-27-2014 , 02:02 PM
for his (extremely high)standard messi has been fairly poor and very fortunate to have 4 goals to his name
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote
06-27-2014 , 02:03 PM
I'm pretty sure Bobbo is actually interested in how the different confederations are doing.
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote
06-27-2014 , 02:05 PM
honduras weakest team of WC
concacaf confirmed fraud riding the positive variance
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote
06-27-2014 , 02:05 PM
He'd be the only one then.

Last edited by unwantedguest; 06-27-2014 at 02:06 PM. Reason: Sorry, should have said him and Val makes 2.
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote
06-27-2014 , 02:11 PM
Messi has been completely fine.

along with the 4 goals, has created numerous good scoring chances in every game, only to be blown by Higuain & Aguero mostly. even Di Maria has been bad around the box in this tournament. watched him closely a lot, and it seemed like he almost never gave the ball away (in b4 this isn't actually true at all), despite having people all over him basically all the time.

some people just wanna hate on him, i don't really get it. or the standard for him is inhumanly high.
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote
06-27-2014 , 02:15 PM
I wasn't able to include Müller(4 goals) Benzema(3) or RvP(3 in 2) in the forward-line either
with such strong competition Messi just shouldn't be a lock to included unless he is in his typical godmode which he currently just isn't
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote
06-27-2014 , 02:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 72off
great post as always, Bjørn



the one who in particular kept making standout plays for me was Junior Diaz, who i think they've been playing at left back. 30yo now and at Mainz (but only played 2 games last season), really seems to be giving people trouble in this tournament with his athleticism and aggressiveness.

but yeah as a group they've done very well, obviously.
Extra impressive given that their best defender is missing the WC with injury.

Add Oviedo to their back line and Saborio to their forward stable and CR is an even GOATer Coast than they already are.
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote
06-27-2014 , 02:45 PM
some worst:

Fred cuz he's mostly been a zombie in slow motion in very slow pursuit of goals

Mbia cuz he is so wildly out of control - busy being a maniac

Charles Itandje cuz he looks like someone failing badly impersonating a goalkeeper

Assou-Ekotto was a disaster teammate

Song with disastrous leader attempts

Stipe Pletikosa looked washed up

Valdívia is very gifted but no one has less energy/is in worse shape

Pique and Ramos for their arrogant failure at trying to (not?) work together. Somewhere Puyol is raging.

Casillas cuz no one was more LOL

Diego Costa wasn't any good but mostly gets worst for not playing for Scolari's Brazil which should have been such an obvious match made in heaven

Yaya Toure for doing what seems like impossible little for such an immense player

Drogba for being done

Suarez cuz statistical analysis (albeit dodgy) say a shark is less likely to attack and bite you than Luis Suarez is

Di Rossi was a pathetic performer and so was his attempts blaming others all the time

Balotelli far from being solely responsible for failure but he was still absurdly unreliable in large periods

Cassano cuz it's a tragedy he took Rossi's spot only to mock it with his inability to provide anything of value

Gerrard and his position positioned and others positionings something

Senderos and Djorou because they're the centreback pairing from hell. It blows my mind that they're getting games together let alone Senderos getting games at all. It's not just a disaster waiting to happen, it's disaster happening all the time. They're literally the end of the world for their team.

Honduras being way too Stoke

Aguero and that hamstring

Maxi Rodriguez getting a start

Spahic being one of footballs bigger centreback frauds

Höwedes at left-back legitimately and shamefully being in a position where he is actually in the running for worst player in the tournament

Götze can do so much better than this surely

Pepe meltdown costing his team severely

Portugal centre-forwards

Ghana keeper clown

Muntari clown

Kevin Prince Boateng clown

Chadli with the worst 45 minutes from a winger the whole tournament

Lukaku looking lost

Akinfeev maintaining living up to being the Russian Casillas - it's not so cool anymore

South Korea everything

Last edited by Bjørn; 06-27-2014 at 02:51 PM.
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote
06-27-2014 , 02:52 PM
Quote:
Suarez cuz statistical analysis (albeit dodgy) say a shark is less likely to attack and bite you than Luis Suarez is
LOL
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote
06-27-2014 , 02:54 PM
Problem with everyone's lists is they are all based on different things. Some are odds to win tournament, some general standard, some best we have seen so far at WC, some a combination of all like power rankings etc. Not much basis to compare.
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote
06-27-2014 , 03:04 PM
Oh btw for the people talking about my Greece trolling in the other thread (now locked). No I wasn't trolling.

No non-American thought I was trolling what does that tell you?

Greece are very close in standard to the USA there is little in it. Talking about only Costa Rica and why they are good (I know they are quite good I have seen them play and I know their results!) and not mentioning Greece one single time when comparing them to another team entirely doesn't make a very good basis for an actual argument.

As for using the markets, well the markets make fools out of a hell of a lot of things you guys have said about the USA and I notice you didn't mention them. Kinda bias don't you think?

Greece are really underrated on here, they completely outplayed the Ivory Coast (no bus parking whatsoever), far harder than Colombia did for example. They have very consistent results. The 3-0 vs Colombia was a real anomaly. They are basically the European USA.
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote
06-27-2014 , 03:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ra_Z_Boy
Problem with everyone's lists is they are all based on different things. Some are odds to win tournament, some general standard, some best we have seen so far at WC, some a combination of all like power rankings etc. Not much basis to compare.
yeah

and fwiw (and not to scare you into rethinking), might have liked your list the best maybe
maybe we were just thinking about it in the same way though
FIFA World Cup 2014: General Discussion Quote

      
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