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Joe Cole was the most overrated footballer in the PL because he had no end result. Its all well nutmegging someone on the halfway line and all the crowd clapping and cheering but it doesn't help your team win the game does it? He couldn't pass, couldn't keep the ball and I don't remember him scoring often either. He had all the skill in the world but in reality was just a muffin.

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05-25-2020 , 06:28 AM

#15552

sixfour

should be called sevenfour

Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 74,764

Did anyone ever work out his best position? If you're continually flung into a side just to fit around other players you're just wasting him (cf. the entirety of Scholes' England career)

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05-25-2020 , 06:59 AM

#15553

ukbilly

old hand

Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 1,867

Quote:

Originally Posted by sixfour

Did anyone ever work out his best position? If you're continually flung into a side just to fit around other players you're just wasting him (cf. the entirety of Scholes' England career)

Has anyone ever worked out Phil Jones best position? Sometimes you have to accept that someone is a muffin and move on. Cole flattered to deceive and wasn't really a top level player.

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05-25-2020 , 07:00 AM

#15554

PeteBlow

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Joe Cole scored the most underrated England goal.
2005/6 showed what a player he was. Only Lampard and Terry played more games for Chelsea that season.

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05-25-2020 , 07:03 AM

#15555

ukbilly

old hand

Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 1,867

Quote:

Originally Posted by PeteBlow

Joe Cole scored the most underrated England goal.
2005/6 showed what a player he was. Only Lampard and Terry played more games for Chelsea that season.

I can only tell you what my eyes saw and my special brain processed and all I saw from Joe Cole was him playing like he had his shoelaces tied together.
Muffin, end of story.

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05-25-2020 , 07:06 AM

#15556

Hoopie1

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Having seen him interviewed, I wonder how much being very stupid held him back.

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05-25-2020 , 07:12 AM

#15557

ukbilly

old hand

Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 1,867

Maybe having no brain, football or otherwise didn't help but I just didn't get the hype around him. He is typical of Englands golden generation, all fur coat and no panties.

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05-25-2020 , 07:17 AM

#15558

joejoe1337

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He ended up with about 0.2 score points per game over his PL career. That is definitely not "no end product," even if he never hit elite levels.

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05-25-2020 , 07:26 AM

#15559

sixfour

should be called sevenfour

Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 74,764

Quote:

Originally Posted by ukbilly

Maybe having no brain, football or otherwise didn't help but I just didn't get the hype around him. He is typical of Englands golden generation, all fur coat and no panties.

Still maintain that if the tactical genius that is Sven had have worked out that 3-5-2 could have been a thing in 2006 and just gone keeper - Ferdinand, Terry, some CB - Cashley, Gerrard, Scholes, Lampard, Beckham - Rooney, Owen, then we would have had legit chances to win it.

That, and being able to take penalties and/or have someone coming on in the 120th minute being able to take a penalty

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05-25-2020 , 07:31 AM

#15560

ukbilly

old hand

Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 1,867

Quote:

Originally Posted by sixfour

Yeah but the players were selfish. Lampard and Gerrard wouldn't compromise, Beckham got in the team when his performances didn't warrant it and kicked up a fuss when Sven tried to move him out of CM. Scholes got shoved on the left cause Sven was a pussy. The golden generation didn't click as a team and were more bothered about themselves.

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05-25-2020 , 08:10 AM

#15561

O.A.F.K.1.1

Ted Patrick

Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 27,952

Quote:

Originally Posted by ukbilly

Scorching hot take.

Firstly I dont think many people actually rate Joe Cole that highly. I doubt many itt do.

Joe Cole had a short shelf life, he played really well and was a joy to watch for a few seasons for Chelsea, before that he was frustrating as ****, then injured and fell of a cliff.

At his short peak he absolutely deserved every minute in a side like Chelsea with its ambitions thereby.

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05-25-2020 , 08:16 AM

#15562

ukbilly

old hand

Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 1,867

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.A.F.K.1.1

Fair points made. I remember when Joe Cole first came through at West Ham and he was talked about like a god, he was going to be the next England superstar ect and it never happened. I just thought he played ok in a very good side and couldn't do anything much after.

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05-26-2020 , 07:08 AM

#15563

Liverpool

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Quote:

Originally Posted by ukbilly

I think it's fair to say that he had the 'potential' to be England's next superstar but he just didn't have "it" and wasn't able to reach that potential. He's certainly not the first, and won't be the last, player with enormous potential not to reach it.

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05-26-2020 , 07:21 AM

#15564

O.A.F.K.1.1

Ted Patrick

Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 27,952

That there are so many English players like Joe Cole who have all this talent and potential but never quite get over the hump into world class must have anthropological reasons.

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05-26-2020 , 07:42 AM

#15565

MindFckr

Classic Arsenal GHW

Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 25,609

The good news for English players is, that the their 'prospect' status does not disappear with age as opposed to the case of their foreign counterparts

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05-26-2020 , 07:54 AM

#15566

Liverpool

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The Glazers at Utd

There's a long article in The Athletic about the Glazers takeover. I haven't read the whole thing and I have to leave for a while but here's a couple of paragraphs for your reading pleasure.

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United never countenanced furloughing staff either. But they have taken up the special government option to delay paying their £10 million VAT bill for a year while still finding £3.6 million to buy shares and prop up the stock price during this period of uncertainty. No plans on further dividends are being made at this stage, however.

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“People underestimate how attached the owners are to Manchester United,” says a former director. “I’m sure there have been people in the past who have been prepared to wave some notes at them but it would take a lot to get them out. Not just because they’d want to maximise their return but also because being the owner of Manchester United means something.”

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05-26-2020 , 11:51 AM

#15567

ukbilly

old hand

Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 1,867

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liverpool

Yeah but what does potential really mean?
My teachers said I had potential when I was six and look how I ended up.

A fat bird in a bar can have potential until you wake up and think how the **** can I get out of here and get home without upsetting her and the missus killing me.
Two plus Two held so much potential for me then I discovered this thread and its all gone downhill.
Joe Cole had potential but he ended up being released by Coventry to play for the Tampa Bay Rowdies.
Potential means nowt mate, its better to just accept life is **** and hope you get to 75 without getting run over by a bus.

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05-26-2020 , 12:12 PM

#15568

PeteBlow

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He was England's best player at the 2006 World Cup (doesn't exactly say much, but that's what every player ratings report concluded), whilst being stuck out on the left wing.
At the 2010 World Cup, we were calling for him to play more and in the 10 role, instead of Heskey

He showed in his time at Chelsea that when given the freedom of playing in a front 3 of a 433 he delivered.

IMO he could've fulfilled his potential if managers had the balls to let him play his natural game, but a top 6 team would've been making a huge gamble to build a team around him playing at 10.

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05-27-2020 , 03:47 AM

#15569

ukbilly

old hand

Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 1,867

Quote:

Originally Posted by PeteBlow

At the 2010 World Cup, we were calling for him to play more and in the 10 role, instead of Heskey

When you have a choice between Heskey and Cole for a key England role you really are ****ed. The best thing Heskey did in an England shirt was when he lumped up some Turks in the tunnel at half time in a Euro 2004 qualifier.

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05-27-2020 , 03:58 AM

#15570

sixfour

should be called sevenfour

Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 74,764

Ah, we've merged into the not understanding the point of Heskey line now. If you supported my club you'd probably want McGoldrick sold to Mansfield, right?

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05-27-2020 , 04:44 AM

#15571

ukbilly

old hand

Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 1,867

Quote:

Originally Posted by sixfour

Ah, we've merged into the not understanding the point of Heskey line now. If you supported my club you'd probably want McGoldrick sold to Mansfield, right?

Nah if I supported your club id want to know why the owner had his name taken off the company house records and WTF is going on.

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05-27-2020 , 05:57 AM

#15572

ashley12

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Someone post the Heskey dribble gif please

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05-27-2020 , 09:28 AM

#15573

O.A.F.K.1.1

Ted Patrick

Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 27,952

The F.A. has just announced that as a test of fitness and capability after Lockdown, all referees must drive to Barnard Castle.

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05-27-2020 , 12:33 PM

#15574

PeteBlow

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Heskey fulfilled a purpose for England and Owen has always said how he enjoyed playing with him. However, in 2010 he was 32, had no pace, and shouldn't have been anywhere near the England squad. He was awful in that world cup, hence the calls for Cole to take his place.

A younger Heskey + Owen worked.
An old Heskey + Rooney was never going to work. Rooney worked better with support from a passing partner, not a knock down/flick on partner.
Why was Heskey even in that squad when Crouch was also there. Then again, it was Fabio. He also picked Warnock and Dawson.

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05-28-2020 , 02:36 AM

#15575

joejoe1337

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Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 16,215

Good piece on Kane's decline in the athletic today:

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Overall though, the picture appears to be one of an overworked player suffering injuries and needing a break rather than necessarily anything more alarming. His Spurs and England team-mate Dele experienced something similar in the aftermath of the 2018 World Cup.

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