Agree with both. I hadn't even ever watched a gladbach game before last year and he ripped Bayern to shreds nearly by himself both games.

Not sure how I feel about Rooney now. He scored a lot last year but was never really great. I thought RVP might make him better, he really hasn't.

reus has been slightly disappointing this season in comparison to last tbh

Damiao at 16 is beyond crazy.

Bjorn--how would you rank league quality?

England, Spain, Germany, Italy are top 4 I know. You seem to prefer Brazil and Portugal over Dutch league...how would you round out top 10 or so leagues?

Just use the uefa coefficients more or less and put Brazil somewhere between 7-10.

I can accept #6 league. Being worse than portuguese/ukraine league makes no sense.

Remy should only get better. I do have some reservations IF he'll be great playing with Crouch though if that becomes the Redknapp scenario.

Do you watch Champions League? In terms of pure level of play quality that's the best I think. I really enjoy those games. Even some relative under the radar, not hailed as a great game by anyone, like the last Porto-PSG was real quality and far better than the large majority of games I watch across the leagues every week.

I realize I'm well into blasphemy and it's probably a symptom of having become too far removed from any sort of healthy football-fandom, but just from a pure disturbing wet-dream of fantastic level of play week in and week out the now pretty much buried idea of a European Super League full season does actually appeal to me. The quality could be so great! But of course I'd hate to see the effect (possibly ruin) of the various leagues that I enjoy so much and that has so much history. The downside of it must be too grave.

It's very possible it would also seem like that to me had I seen his performances in Brazil recently but though it's an argument that doesn't work great when doing current rankings of players, I do think time (hopefully soon) will prove me right. I think he is a beast.

It's a classic argument. Maybe the best thing is just to look at the coefficients. The leagues still have their different characteristics. Certainly those 4 are still quite different and teams would be a lot different if they were in another country.

In the European battleground I do think the Spanish teams have it most right currently but apart from the big two they have huge financial issues that seriously hurt them. The English teams as a whole can buy more valuable players and it's almost inexcusable if they don't seriously pull away with their advantages. Outside of Real, Barca, Bayern and maybe Juve (if not now then soon) their biggest theoratical competition for most valuable players is from Russia, China and maybe talent staying longer in Brazil. Thankfully the talent pool in this the most global of sports is so bottomless deep.

Germany as everyone knows is in a good state that seems to only be getting better while Italy are sort of stuck at least trying to avoid the same trap of Spain. The Italian tv deal is better though and thankfully Juventus rebounded or things would look really bad. If I try and compare teams across those two leagues it's still pretty close though you have to give Germany an advantage just by having both Bayern and Dortmund where they are right now in terms of quality. Italy have a number of good teams, some with good looking futures, some with bad, but apart from Juve not really comparable with those two.

Outside of the big flag bearers (where you can count a few more big quality squads in England) in those leagues I still like some of the Spanish clubs the most right now, like Atletico and probably Malaga as well but in general it's pretty close between a big number of clubs in those four leagues I think. Too close to argue too strongly over x-German midtable club vs x-Spanish.

Swansea are kind of interesting right now since they're probably the closest thing to a La Liga good midtable team you have ever seen in England. Laudrup coaches exactly like he did at Mallorca and Getafe and if he had resources and control there these are pretty much the players he would have brought in as well.

So where would Swansea place in Spain? In general I think the big mass there around 13-14-15 teams are quite equal. Some with more upside than others of course but in many ways they just trade blows every week.

Brazil is just too strange for me. Maybe I'm catching wrong games, I don't understand all the different competitions either and my sample is too small anyway, but it really does seem like a totally different game when I'm watching. One where samba-entertaining, not least individually over the collective, really does seem to play a large role. Something almost non existent in the European leagues. I'm pretty sure there are players there actually playing for *GASP* fun! The horror!

I wouldn't know where to rank them but will agree that with the amount of talent there it should be better than Ukraine, Portugal and Russia.

I've become too wary almost of scorepoint machines in Holland to include any forwards but there will be a number of midfielders from there.

Bjorn what do you think the chances are of Moratti pumping money into the club again? Or with him winning the champions league now - I know he kept going on about emulating his father by winning it again as his main goal will be continue to hold back on issuing funds and cutting the wage bill?

nice post. maybe this isnt the thread for it, but I think that part of what makes the Swansea example interesting is that Laudrup is actually fairly conservative. Swansea is a pretty stereotypical Spanish team tactically imo. They dont do anything too creative, but some of the things they do just seems to confuse their opponents.

Like Swansea let their wingers drift inside a lot and use them in the build up and often the other team looks like they have no idea how they should counteract that (whether the right/left back should follow them etc.). For example both Stoke last week and Sunderland this week tried some halfhearted pressure and it just didnt work for them at all. Both are midtable sides and they just looked incredibly impotent against a Swansea team that's decent, and would be even better than that with a good striker, but is certainly nothing special.

I think they had to do so much down-scaling to comply with FFP regulations. I'm sure the Swiss Ramble guy will have great articles on it.

But they don't seem to be in a very good place right now. Even compared to various other Italian clubs where you don't automatically think "great place" and I think they could struggle to compete for a while or at the very least not pull clear of anyone.

In a way selling Coutinho is a culmination. At first it was just veterans on huge wages being let go. That could be sold to the fans. Now it's one of the most talented players in the squad. One potential star-saviour for the future. At least rivals Milan have brought in quite a few promising players. Some very promising, the same with Roma. You can already spot good foundations there. A not as expensive one as well. On the other hand you have Inter selling one of their very few very promising players.

If as they gossip about they bring in highly rated Paulinho instead, you can still see perspective. He'll be a key player immediately but if it will just be cheap not highly rated short term solutions, it will really look bleak over there.

Agreed. Maybe he can add more layers if he stays there and maybe that will be a good indicator if he really does have that coaching-gene that has sometimes been questioned, but having said all that I don't think being sort of standard-Spanish tactically and stylistically is a bad thing at all. On the contrary when you think about it, it's probably one of the best things to be in current football.

Getting ready to start posting top 50 fullbacks, not happy with the very bottom of the list though. Feels like there must be better out there and that maybe I didn't nominate enough if it was going to be a top 50. After all the nomination was done with top 300 overall in the world potential in mind. That left out a lot.

30 of these (subject to change as always) made the overall 300 list as mainly fullbacks I guess. Then also a few because they do other things/positions as well.

If ever a player was suited for that last description, it should be Adriano ;-)

Looking forward to another list; good job on the first!

Thx. Yeah he is definitely a very good allrounder these days and will of course be on the list.

50: Daniel Carvajal - Spain - Leverkusen
49: César Azpilicueta - Spain - Chelsea
48: 30 Yuri Zhirkov - Russia - Anzhi
47: Davide Santon - Italy - Newcastle
46: João Pereira - Portugal - Valencia

Since I understood Carvajal was having something of a breakthrough and Real Madrid might even be interested in getting him back, I've tried to watch him when I could and unfortunately I just wasn't impressed. Pretty good player, no bad mistakes defensively (that means I can put him ahead of many left out already) but not nearly as skilled or smart as I would have hoped. I shouldn't conclude too much of course, and he is still new, but very certain Azpilicueta is better AND since he hasn't exactly been great either (more like decent sort of solid) maybe that should be enough cue not to have included Carvajal...

Snubs would be:

Marcel Schmelzer who I've liked before but Dortmund fans didn't really, he is pretty good however. Probably better than Carvajal. Just a little bit less interesting at this point.

If Benoit Tremoulinas is playing well again, I kind of see him as a better Schmelzer, so maybe the Dortmunder can't feel too snubbed...

Mauricio Isla just hasn't found form since his coming back from injury. He is also more versatile than specialist right-back.

Jose Enrique was closer this time than I could have ever thought. 52 in fact! I will begrudgingly accept his impact going forward doing what he does but he is possibly one of my least favorite defenders in world football. He is god awful. He can thank Kyle Walker who wasn't close at all this time if I really have removed him from the top of my bad-defender's/worst tactical intelligence list.

Then there are the Dutch guys: Ricardo van Rhijn I know already can look really good coming forward but anything else would just be too much guessing on my part.

Bruno Martins Indi unfortunately had a nightmare when I saw him. Even if he was very good I don't know if would really have included him already. His best potential might be as a central defender anyway.

do you mean jose enrique?
only jose reina i know is the pool GK

Thanks for your reply. I'll do some googling and try find TSR article on them

Yeehaa full backs list started, out of curiosity what was the hardest list to compile?

oops yes. I had actually written Jose Reina in my word document haha.

Definitely the midfielders. So many different types and roles and so little between many of them.

Central defenders can be the same to a little bit of an extent until you make some interesting decisions at least. But I'll talk about that later.

45: Cicinho - Brazil - Sevilla
44: Christian Maggio - Italy - Napoli
43: Federico Balzaretti - Italy - Roma
42: 20 Micah Richards - England - Manchester City
41: Juanfran - Spain - Atletico Madrid
40: Danilo - Brazil - FC Porto


Maggio the wing-back does an incredibly amount of intensive off-the ball sprints per game. Almost like he was a striker. If only he was a little bit better on the ball.

This will probably the list with the most players that I dislike but I've never fully grasped why coaches seems to dislike Richards as much as they do. Well at least Italian ones. I'm sure it must be tactical mistakes and I guess you can see it sometimes (including with the ball which could be key), that he talks about not knowing what to do in a 3-5-2 when his team played it pre-season can't help matters, but I dunno, there seems to be much worse than him and of course physically he just blows most fullbacks away.

Danilo looks very talented.

Cicinho can be very exciting when attacking. Unsure about the rest.

Juanfran former winger and all is also good going forward and has a bag of tricks. He's improved just enough defensively to make it.

edit:

Football break I think

Just to follow up, they bought highly rated Mateo Kovacic for €13 million which must be something of the highest ever paid out for an 18 year still at a Croatian club. He better be extremely talented then! I didn't watch any of the Zagreb games in the CL this year though, so unfortunately haven't seen him in full matches.

For the more short-term they brought Kuzmanovic back to Italy and signed versatile attacking player Schelotto who has become a solid Serie A contributor.

Well, I'm here on-off (mostly on) for the rest of the day so gonna continue with the fullbacks immediately.

39: Juan Guillermo Cuadrado - Colombia - Fiorentina
38: Martin Montoya - Spain - Barcelona
37: Andoni Iraola - Spain - Athletic Bilbao
36: Maxi Periera - Uruguay - Benfica
35: Glen Johnson - England - Liverpool

Cuadrado has been beating people 1v1 for fun in Italy for over a year now. In fact he even lead the league in dribbling last season. This is definitely more of a wing-back, maybe even more winger than right-back in a four man defense also and he isn't really the most well rounded player yet, not always knowing what to do (so he just dribbles!) with mistakes here and there.

It will be interesting if he can find a role on the good looking Colombia national team. If there even is one for him. He did all he could in the game against Brazil a couple of months ago, arguably being man of the match having great impact (including scoring the winner) coming forward almost every time he touched the ball.

I have a tricky time getting a really solid impression of Montoya. His starts of course are pretty limited and while there have been games where I've tried to pay special attention to him, you kind of end up not doing that anyway. But that he seems more and more comfortable on Barcelona of all teams, arguably speak volumes.

I can't really put him ahead of Iraola yet who is a good overall player. Especially contributing to the attack coming forward.

Periera is the really aggressive kind both when defending and attacking. Pretty skilled and quick + consistent solid performer over many years now.

Glen Johnson is more athletic than the others and with his fine skills to go along he can create the most coming forward. It's also a bonus for him that he has become a good performer on both sides. BUT even though he has become an okay 1v1 defender, I think his positioning is very bad still making him a pretty big defensive liability as far as I'm concerned. He causes opponent goals quite simply.
Even when going forward, his clear strength, I don't think he is a very intelligent footballer.

34: Aleksander Kolarov - Serbia - Manchester City
33: Benedikt Höwedes - Germany - Schalke 04
32: Jerome Boateng - Germany - Bayern München
31: 8 Eric Abidal - France – Barcelona
30: Mário Figueira Fernandes - Brazil - CSKA Moscow
29: Yuto Nagatomo - Japan - Inter
28: Nacho Monreal - Spain - Malaga
27: 29 Rafael - Brazil - Manchester United
26: Alex Sandro - Brazil - FC Porto

Pretty big bunch here with various who is really better than who pitfalls.

Kolarov over Johnson might be controversial but I think he's improved enough defensively in a four man defense, removed most of the really bad errors, even if he can still be vulnerable 1v1. His very impact-full left-leg almost guarantees good situations offensively, whether it's open play or set pieces.

Höwedes or Boateng? That is difficult. Maybe some of the German posters will have stronger opinion than me. Löw likes Boateng the most it seems but of course both also natural centrebacks where they'll also be ranked. I went with more gifted Boateng, athletically and technically + there seems to also be a little bit less of his really bad mistakes these days. Stay tuned if that will put him ahead at centreback as well.

Abidal is tricky given his situation off-the field not allowing him to play so where to rank him?

Mário Figueira Fernandes just looks like a really good right-back to me and one of CSKA's better players when I watch them. Good going forward, athletic (big), technical and at least responsible defensively it seems.

Nagatomo is just a very solid fullback both ways either side. He can also play wing-back.

I remember being down on otherwise highly regarded Monreal in recent times but his play lately has been good. Good technique. Strong tactical both coming forward and defensively. Will be interesting how it translates into England but he should be a good (and much needed) upgrade for Arsenal.

The Rafael issue. I can't deny he is healthy and having his best season. I would have thought myself that would have resulted in a significant improvement (overall there will be some) in rank but I guess I can't get over how he plays with his steaming head under his arm most of the time.
Fantastic at being dynamic in his forwards runs and his aggressive 1v1 defending is probably not a bad thing either, but there are many tactical mistakes, at United that will mostly be defensively but on top of that outside of England, not least his disastrous Olympics for Brazil, he doesn't really seem to know what to do in a slower more deliberate pace. Playing quality possession is big for a lot of the best teams, Rafael doesn't look good doing it. Where to pass, where to move, when to rush forward, where and when to defend. He failed all over the place.

On the opposite end of that it pretty much looks like we have Alex Sandro. An exemplary young Brazilian left-back. Great pace. Good tactically already both when defending and going forward where he also has considerable skill. It just makes sense to me that he becomes Rafael's stop-block.

Can't believe that Boateng and Höwedes are in the low 30s and Schmelzer doesn't even make the list.

51

25: 16 Alvaro Arbeloa - Spain - Real Madrid
24: 24 Mathieu Debuchy - France - Lille/Newcastle
23: 21 Benoit Assou-Ekotto - Cameroon - Tottenham
22: 4 Maicon - Brazil - Manchester City
21: 18 Patrice Evra - France - Manchester United
20: 15 Domenico Criscito - Italy – Zenit

Ok I'm finally more down on Arbeloa beyond just the obvious unavoidable worst starting player for Spain and Real Madrid eye-test syndrome. His right and left-back know-how saves his ranking for now but ALL THOSE FOULS he has to make all the time (top 5 in the league), it can't be a great sign defensively and going forward his lack of decisiveness don't compare well too many.

Holding out a bit to see how Debuchy fares at Newcastle. I really liked him at Lille.

Ekotto is also someone that I seem to like a lot more than most. In fact if he hadn't been injured all season I'm pretty sure I would have had the excuse I needed to put him ahead of many of those in front of him. He has some of that old-school-left-back playmaker or at least distributor qualities that certain Brazilians at that position used to have (I dunno if anyone remember Felipe) and he just has a lot of ability when it comes to control and passing/building play.

Man Maicon sure didn't waste his time making my choice to keep his ranking more or less where it was after last season, look very unfortunate. I'm not sure he's shown he has any legs left at any point this season. He just struggles mightily physically where he used to be elite. Now, I'll still maintain his last season was pretty good compared to a lot of fullbacks so there is a little bit of final goodwill left in the bank even he can look as one of the worst players on the list right now.

Something of a rebound season for Evra. The most important thing for me though is that he still has his pace (and great stamina doing sprints) and with the ball especially can drive things forward more dynamic than most going from defense to offense.

Criscito I don't think has been at quite the level of the last couple of years but still a good performer all ways both ways setting him apart from a lot of others.

Dinner break.