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Old 06-12-2018, 11:37 PM   #151
Onlydo2days
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

The NBA in general does create a race to the bottom where taking less can give you a very nice competitive edge. KD did it this year. The Spurs/Heat both did it and were the two dominant teams in the league until the Warriors ascended.The Warriors didn't really have to do it because they had Curry on that discount deal and then they signed Dray/Klay before the cap went up.

Going forward, taking less is probably going to be a big component of how championship teams are built.
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Old 06-12-2018, 11:43 PM   #152
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

LeBron won't give up money to maximize his chances of winning a ring because the teams he has been on make moves where avoiding luxury tax is more important than putting the best possible team on the floor. Why should the onus be on him to give up money to win when teams won't give up profits to win?

I would consider myself a LeBron hater, but this is something where I can agree with his sentiment.
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Old 06-12-2018, 11:45 PM   #153
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

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How does it affect other players? It doesn't change the salary cap. If anything it puts LeBron James on a better team and thus that team makes the finals and competes for a title and that grows the league revenue pie.

I don't think a 34 year old on his last deal taking less is that big of a deal. Does Brady taking less affect other players?

I think the point I raised is the biggest roadblock. Brady was still always the highest paid in his locker room, can LeBron take 20 and make less $ than Julius Randle and Playoff P, then Ingram in 2 years? Seems like a tough hurdle.

maybe he thinks it "could" not that it "does." i think him taking less would prob be mostly inconsequential, but it does (further) establish a precedent of players taking more $ for winning situations and maybe he doesn't want players to do that. or maybe the players as a group have an issue w/it and as a union rep he is on board. there are plenty of reasonable explanations, but either way i don't think it's difficult to understand that perspective even if you disagree w/it
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Old 06-12-2018, 11:46 PM   #154
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

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LeBron won't give up money to maximize his chances of winning a ring because the teams he has been on make moves where avoiding luxury tax is more important than putting the best possible team on the floor. Why should the onus be on him to give up money to win when teams won't give up profits to win?

I would consider myself a LeBron hater, but this is something where I can agree with his sentiment.
Heat amnestied Miller but besides that they spent as much as they could. So did Cleveland.

And the Lakers would as well. Obviously you don't do it for a team that isn't going to spend as much as they can to win.
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Old 06-12-2018, 11:49 PM   #155
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

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Going forward, taking less is probably going to be a big component of how championship teams are built.
Going forward, I think a big component of how championship teams are built should be trying to have your core on different timelines, so that you have a player who is only on a 25% max or even a rookie-scale contract to go with max salary veterans. You might also want someone who is older and preferring to get a last big contract for maximum length over a shorter deal with a bigger salary.
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Old 06-12-2018, 11:53 PM   #156
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

fwiw, i was glad iggy squeezed the dubs for the cash last offseason even though there's a strong chance it busts the team up a couple years down the road. let lacob and co sacrifice some also.

edit: curry too really as there were rumors that they would try to get him to take less than the super max. dunno how much truth there was to that though
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Old 06-13-2018, 12:06 AM   #157
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

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Going forward, I think a big component of how championship teams are built should be trying to have your core on different timelines, so that you have a player who is only on a 25% max or even a rookie-scale contract to go with max salary veterans. You might also want someone who is older and preferring to get a last big contract for maximum length over a shorter deal with a bigger salary.
The rookie scale contract is really nice to have. I was thinking the Celtics might want to trade their SAC pick next year for one down the road in order to try to bink a top tier rookie once Tatum and Brown need to get paid.
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Old 06-13-2018, 12:10 AM   #158
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

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Heat amnestied Miller but besides that they spent as much as they could. So did Cleveland.
Cleveland let multiple trade exceptions expire and had a habit of trying to keep unused roster spots open as long as possible to decrease their luxury tax bill. Maybe GM LeBron thinks the Cavs should have matched Dellavedova's offer sheet.

It's not luxury tax related, but a request for a raise seems to be part of why David Griffin is no longer GM, as well.
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Old 06-13-2018, 12:10 AM   #159
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

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why would James rather play for the Sixers than the Celtics?

Tatum looks like he is a perennial all star and he has shown that high performance in high stress situations. He just seems like he has it.

James + another all star + Tatum GOAT on the Celts would be epic.

They just need to dump Kyrie and GH fast since they will turn into a ball and chain if they end up sucking post injury.
Recency bias towards Tatum. Brown is just as good btw.
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Old 06-13-2018, 12:13 AM   #160
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

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They can basically keep the same team they had with a few tweaks here and there.

Colin Cowherd brought up an interesting idea today that LeBron could get Chris Paul to go with him and then the Lakers could trade for Paul George. They'd probably have to give up Lonzo and Ingram to do that. The only Laker that's untouchable to me is Kyle Kuzma.
Nobody on Lakers is untouchable. Common now. They aren't Boston or Philly.
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Old 06-13-2018, 12:14 AM   #161
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

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Cleveland let multiple trade exceptions expire and had a habit of trying to keep unused roster spots open as long as possible to decrease their luxury tax bill. Maybe GM LeBron thinks the Cavs should have matched Dellavedova's offer sheet.

It's not luxury tax related, but a request for a raise seems to be part of why David Griffin is no longer GM, as well.
Yeah, I mean they still had a top 3 payroll in the league like every year after the first one.

A team like the Lakers isn't going to be in the repeater tax for a few years so they would likely be more interested in paying to compete the next 3-4 years. Also, they just have way more $ to throw around than the Cavs.

Maybe the Cavs didn't spend the absolute most they could but they spent a ton. If they used those trade exceptions it would be spending like another 50mill a year after the luxury tax bill came.
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Old 06-13-2018, 12:17 AM   #162
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

Kuzma is extremely touchable. Way more than Zo.
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Old 06-13-2018, 12:24 AM   #163
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

So, having thought about it more, I think LeBron might give up a little bit of money to enable a team to sign another star (who he is friends with) as a free agent, but he's not going to give a discount to save the owner luxury tax.

Give him a max-length, max-dollar contract and don't give up useful rotation players for nothing to save luxury tax while building a championship-caliber team around him and maybe he will do your team a favor by taking a bit less on his next contract.
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Old 06-13-2018, 12:28 AM   #164
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

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So, having thought about it more, I think LeBron might give up a little bit of money to enable a team to sign another star (who he is friends with) as a free agent, but he's not going to give a discount to save the owner luxury tax.

Give him a max-length, max-dollar contract and don't give up useful rotation players for nothing to save luxury tax while building a championship-caliber team around him and maybe he will do your team a favor by taking a bit less on his next contract.
That's what MagnumMike was talking about. He wasn't talking about LeBron saving an owner $. He was talking about him taking less with a team with cap room like the Lakers so they can have the room to get George/Randle as well.

And again, he would do this because the $ will come back to him as his legend grows even further by winning championships. Similar to Brady in the NFL.
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Old 06-13-2018, 12:46 AM   #165
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

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Recency bias towards Tatum. Brown is just as good btw.
I've watched almost every game they've both played and couldn't disagree with you more. Brown had an amazing jump from year 1 to 2 but his trajectory is still far from Tatum's.
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Old 06-13-2018, 01:48 AM   #166
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

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I've watched almost every game they've both played and couldn't disagree with you more. Brown had an amazing jump from year 1 to 2 but his trajectory is still far from Tatum's.


Tatum is The Truth 2.0

Ya digg.
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Old 06-13-2018, 02:20 AM   #167
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

I wasn't seeing Lebron to the Lakers before, but the Zo/Kuz diss-tracks and Lavar's recent antics make me even more sure of it...

or maybe it's a smoke-screen.

Something tells me Lebron isn't going to want to play with children and a crazy father of said child in his golden years.
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Old 06-13-2018, 02:42 AM   #168
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

Lebron is really gonna play for a fanbase that believes and will always believe that he's worse than Kobe Bryant?? I can't see it.
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Old 06-13-2018, 02:55 AM   #169
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

More like 2018 NBA Offseason - TZ Taking You To The Mind Of Lebron thread amirite
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Old 06-13-2018, 02:56 AM   #170
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

Details on ESPN+ takes you inside the mind of Kobe Bryant

TZ offseason on 2+2 takes you inside the mind of LeBron James
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Old 06-13-2018, 03:12 AM   #171
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

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That's what MagnumMike was talking about. He wasn't talking about LeBron saving an owner $. He was talking about him taking less with a team with cap room like the Lakers so they can have the room to get George/Randle as well.

And again, he would do this because the $ will come back to him as his legend grows even further by winning championships. Similar to Brady in the NFL.
He might take $32-33 million. He ain't taking $20 million to facilitate a super-team.
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Old 06-13-2018, 03:15 AM   #172
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

LeBon must also know how much money he's worth to a franchise. Even $35+ doesn't get anywhere near his value to a team.
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Old 06-13-2018, 03:21 AM   #173
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

I don't think he'll do it either. Just saying it makes sense if the situation is right.

As he gets older the team can make him whole later on as well. I.e 3 years from now the Lakers give him 30mill a year at age 37 similar to what they did to Kobe.
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Old 06-13-2018, 09:30 AM   #174
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

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I don't think this is happening but lemme toss it out there since we got 9 days until the draft and 3 weeks until FA starts.....

Why doesn't KD just go to the Lakers and take Playoff P with him?

Given the age of the two players, LA would be wise to take KD over LeBron. He immediately weakens the Warriors and they can't really replace him because of their cap situation. I'd probably make the Lakers the fav to win the title if this happened (not accounting for what LeBron would then do)

Then you win a few rings in LA and people are no longer saying you just hopped onto the Warriors train, they're gonna start saying the only reason you didn't win in OKC was for other reasons (Russ, Brooks, Presti, owners, etc)

This is a legitimate pathway for him to be remembered as the best player of this generation if it pans out.

It's a boss move. Don't think he would do it and he already told Nichols he'll be back in GS but just something I thought of.
Only problem is that such a roster has a very high probability of getting their asses kicked by the current Houston line-up and probably even by the current GSW line-up sans KD. And that would only reinforce the narrative that he needs his super-team to win titles. There's no way he would take that chance.
If he would play for that roster, then why leave OKC in the first place since RWB + Adams + dipo and himself is a far more established outfit with which he'd be closer to winning a ring than he would be as a laker next year
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Old 06-13-2018, 12:15 PM   #175
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Re: 2018 NBA Offseason

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Originally Posted by Seadood228 View Post
I wasn't seeing Lebron to the Lakers before, but the Zo/Kuz diss-tracks and Lavar's recent antics make me even more sure of it...

or maybe it's a smoke-screen.

Something tells me Lebron isn't going to want to play with children and a crazy father of said child in his golden years.

they're just two friends goofing around
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