I have to admit I don't remember what the board cards were, I just remember I had a nut low draw on the flop, a made nut low on the turn and the river was an ace. I don't remember any suits or suitedness. I probably have some of the action wrong too.

Table is remarkably loose and passive, the only maniacal player is to my left.

9-handed. 4 limps. I'm on the button with A245r and I raise. Both blinds and all limpers call.

7 players, 14sb, flop K78r.

blinds check, UTG bets, 2 callers, I raise, SB folds, BB and everyone else call.

5 players, 12BB, turn 4.

BB checks, UTG bets, folds to me, I considered raising but with a low and no high prospects and only one other player besides the bettor in the pot I opted to just call. BB called.

3 players, 15BB, river A.

BB checks, UTG bets.

Am I behind any other low besides 23? I've got a 7542A low which is still pretty darned good.

UTG could have A2 as well, but I think he has a high hand (I have no O8 wisdom or experience to support it, I just felt like he wouldn't bet like that with a nut low).

I have to be concerned with BB as well, if he c/rs I'm not going to be happy. But he's pretty passive so it's unlikely.

I think I have to call here and hope my low takes at least a quarter of the pot.

Thoughts?

Thanks
DTXCF

No. On a board of K784A, 23 is the nut low, and 25 is the second-nut low. You have 25.

Yes, but that's not the most useful way of thinking about it, because "still pretty darned good" is not as precise as it could be.

Think of it this way. Anytime a low is possible, there will be exactly 10 different lows. It doesn't matter if there are 3 low cards on the board or 4 or 5.

On any board, you should be able to identify the 10 low hands in order from best to worst (or from worst to best; if your hand is closer to the worst low possible, it may be faster to rank it from that direction).

On the turn the board was K784. The best low hands in order are as follows:
A2
A3
23
A5
25
35
A6
26
36
56

On the river the board was K784A. The best low hands in order are as follows:
23
25
35
26
36
56
Live 2
Live 3
Live 5
Live 6
(All the "live" hands make an 8-low; all the others make a 7-low on this board.)

On the turn you had the nut low (obviously). On the river you got counterfeited, but you had a 5 for backup, so you went from having the nut low to having the second-nut low. If you did not have that backup, you would have gone from having the nut low to having the seventh-nut low (a live 2). Do you see the crucial difference having that backup card makes?

I think so too. Sometimes you'll be beat, sometimes you'll be quartered, and sometimes you'll still be good for the low by yourself. But you've made it this far in the hand, and you can't be certain (based on the action and your reads) that anyone has exactly 23. So you should call and hope for the best.

And let's not forget that you also have two pair on this river (Aces and 4's). Maybe UTG has A23x (without two pair), in which case he has you beat for low, but you have him beat for high. Maybe UTG has something like KJ98, so he flopped top two pair and a gut-shot straight draw, but you just rivered a better two pair. With a combo hand like second-nut low plus Aces up, you're even more compelled to call a single bet on the river.

I think you actually have a pretty strong hand in this spot, given how the action has gone, and would call quite happily. If it had checked to you I would definitely bet this hand. It’s really hard for either player to have you beat both ways. It is possible they could each have you beat a different way, but nothing about BB’s actions suggest he’s likely all that strong.

Very standard call.

I'm inferring that the term "live card" does not come into play unless there are four or more low cards on the board.

I'm guessing a low card is a live card if at least one other low card that matches one of the four or more live cards on the board is also in the player's hand.

That is correct.

On a board of K784A, the following hands all make the same low:
82
72
42
A2

For simplicity's sake, players and dealers often announce or read all these hands as "a live deuce."

However, when we add a fifth low card to the board, things get a bit more complicated. Let's replace the King with a 3, so the board is 3784A. Now we have five different hands that could be announced or read as "a live deuce":
82
72
42
32
A2

But not all five of these hands are equal. The 82 must play the 8, for a low hand of 84321. The other four hands all play the 7, for a low hand of 74321. This situation comes up rarely and confuses even experienced dealers and players.

If you're ever in doubt about what you have at showdown, (1) table your hand, and (2) read both your low and your opponent's low as five-card hands starting with the highest low card and moving down.

Your A4 two pair isn't that bad either for a high.

Standard call unless the other 2 start raising each other, then one probably has 23 and the other 56 unless backdoor flush made.

IMO it's unlikely BB was calling all the way with 23 unless they had something good for high going on or they are very ambitious let's say.

In this situation you should be happy about your hand on this river, particularly given it puts other A2 hands in very bad shape. However it's not good to raise because the max you want to lose in this spot is 1 bet and you want BB to overcall. Call is the play or bet if checked to.

If BB checkraises and UTG 3 bets, you should strongly consider folding.

Tell me if I have this one right:

Board is A235H

The 10 best possible lows, from best to worst, are:
live 4
64
live 6
74
live 7
76
84
live 8
86
87

correct?

Here's another - it took me awhile to think through this one so I hope I got it right:

board 2356H

from best to worst:
A4
live A
live 4
A7
74
live 7
A8
84
live 8
87

One more - I think I'm starting to get this:

4568
a2
a3
23
a7
27
37
live a
live 2
live 3
live 7

It's interesting to observe that in this case, all of the live cards make an 8 low. The live cards all made different lows in the other 2 examples.

It seems to get a little more complex when there are 5 low cards on the board:

board: A2345

10 lows from best to worst:
any two cards between A and 5
64
65
74
75
76
84
85
86
87

In your first three examples, your rankings are correct.

In this last example, I would qualify that there are multiple ways of making a 64 low, a 74 low, and an 84 low.

However, you have correctly perceived that a live 6 with a 4 beats a live 6 with a 5. And that's what may confuse some players and dealers.

Now that you know how to read the lows correctly, you really only need to worry about the two or three best lows on any given board. In a loose, full-ring, low-limit game with lots of multiway action, the winning low hand will be the nut low about 60% of the time; it will be the second-nut low about 25% of the time and something worse than that about 10% of the time; and no one will have a qualifying low hand about 5% of the time.

These are rough estimates, of course. But you could track results during your next session and see how closely they match these numbers.

If you've got something like third-nut low plus two pairs and only one opponent, you can call, hoping you're good in one direction or the other. But if there's a bet and a call and all you have is the third-nut low, you should probably fold—unless you have a strong reason to think that both your opponents are going high.

Here's a spot I saw recently. The final board read K3457. There was a bet and a call. A player then overcalled with 26xx. The original bettor had A2xx for the nut low. The first caller had 67xx for a 7-high straight (which was the second-nut high). The player who overcalled lost in both directions. He turned to me and said, "I had second-second; I had to call." My response: "You had third-third, but who's counting?"

Quoted for story time

Here's another - how's this one look?

Board: A2346
5432A 54,53,52,5A
6432A 64,63,62,6A,43,42,4A
65432 65
74321 74,73,72,7A
75432 75
76321 76
84321 84,83,82,8A
85321 85
86321 86
87321 87

you left out 32,3A,2A in the 5432A LOW if you are interested in absolute completeness.

and you switched from using A to using 1 (although probably it was a switch from 1 to A)

but YES, correctness that having 65 makes a better low then A7.
and that 75 makes a better low then A8. etc.
so it looks good

65 and 75 actually make a 6532A/7532A low, but their relative positions don't change, so it doesn't matter much. And ng is right that you left out 32/3A/2A, but I think those should all be in the 6432A category. Agree that it's most important to know what beats what as opposed to the exact low it actually makes.

this is correct. as well that 32,3A,2A belong in 6432A. (no 5 in the hand no 5 on the board and yet i placed them in 5432A. d'oh)

Greybeard thanks for noticing and posting the corrections for DalTx.

DalTx i apologize.

Are you all ok with the raise flop ?
Don't we want to keep as many players as we want on the flop to fully realize our equity ?

He's in last position, a raise is unlikely to fold out anyone.

9-handed there's a 36% chance that someone else has A2.
When you have four low cards in your hand and 2 more on the flop you make your low 70% of the time.
The only way there could be a downside to raising is if UTG 3-bets and the other 2 villains fold. But there's so much money already in the pot that that downside isn't that big.