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05-16-2014 , 05:14 PM
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Originally Posted by HighTillIDieT4L
No, he's the LUCKIEST player at 6-max atm. He's just on an insane heater like all those before him.
Just about the biggest load of bollox you've ever written. That's not even hyperbole as there are many idiotic posts that could contest that title.

Bokkie is a seriously good player. You're just about the only one dumb enough not to be able to see that fact.

It just amazes me you haven't been perma banned for such persistent bs.

Lay off the drugs, read Jared Tendler and come back when you have a seriously informed opinion/perspective on poker.
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05-16-2014 , 05:44 PM
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Originally Posted by streityboy
Just about the biggest load of bollox you've ever written. That's not even hyperbole as there are many idiotic posts that could contest that title.

Bokkie is a seriously good player. You're just about the only one dumb enough not to be able to see that fact.

It just amazes me you haven't been perma banned for such persistent bs.

Lay off the drugs, read Jared Tendler and come back when you have a seriously informed opinion/perspective on poker.
Yea yea shakeyshark/lockyfool, whatever you are.. I've only played thousands of games with bokkie and know his game inside out. I know intimately how he plays HU, how he plays his premium pre and how he plays the board and opponents. I guess with your 5 mins XP and basing your entire read on 2 SCOOP games in which he ran amazingly hot, you know better. Amazing you jokers who give lit reviews without reading the book first are allowed to post. Go read my other post on bokkie (when I did actually lavish praise), likely ITT, then get back to me.
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05-16-2014 , 05:55 PM
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Originally Posted by HighTillIDieT4L
Yea yea shakeyshark/lockyfool, whatever you are.. I've only played thousands of games with bokkie and know his game inside out. I know intimately how he plays HU, how he plays his premium pre and how he plays the board and opponents. I guess with your 5 mins XP and basing your entire read on 2 SCOOP games in which he ran amazingly hot, you know better. Amazing you jokers who give lit reviews without reading the book first are allowed to post. Go read my other post on bokkie (when I did actually lavish praise), likely ITT, then get back to me.
1. Luckyfool149. You might wanna use the post search function. I used to have 'interesting' discussions on hyper play with shakey. We were able to keep it grown up (just). He's just another solid player who's game I respect at hypers.
2. I have played 1000s of hands versus bokkie
3. I didn't know he won scoop till an hour ago
4. I have read the book cover to cover and have a copy....would you like it?
5. You lavished praise and showed respect? Wtf....post it please for the a mini one time fist pump.
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05-16-2014 , 06:00 PM
^^ I've actually lavished praise on quite a few players - ask scruff, aless, dacus, JJ, a few other 2+2ers. I posted 2 huge lists of guys I respect. I stated I learnt from personal (my fav player), bid23biz and coldbryan. I said bokkie used to be a flashy, flashy player but seemed to learn a lot from me and janiosmo in 6-max, went from scraping top 20 to #1. And I've played several thousand GAMES with bokkie over YEARS in many different formats, not 1000s of hands lol. And at stakes he used to care about too.
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05-17-2014 , 05:11 PM
[QUOTE=streityboy;43282576]1. Luckyfool149.

You came, you sat, you donked. This one is for you. Note the time stamp on the notes - which is a long time before I joined 2+2

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05-17-2014 , 05:28 PM
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Originally Posted by HighTillIDieT4L
No, he's the LUCKIEST player at 6-max atm. He's just on an insane heater like all those before him.
pretty sure hes been on top of the leaderboard now for 2 years, you he cant be on a 2 year heater allthough i do agree he has his fair share of luck, but if you play good enough ur entiled to ur share

as of him winning a scoop, he obvs ran good but its not like it wasnt coming.

who would u consider to be the best player at the minute?

Last edited by alexmck123; 05-17-2014 at 05:34 PM.
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05-17-2014 , 07:09 PM
[QUOTE=HighTillIDieT4L;43294907]
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Originally Posted by streityboy
1. Luckyfool149.

You came, you sat, you donked. This one is for you. Note the time stamp on the notes - which is a long time before I joined 2+2

This post made my day. Tytyty. To be called a fish by quant means I have finally arrived.

In regards the hand. Beyond standard. Gl at the tables.
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05-17-2014 , 08:13 PM
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Originally Posted by alexmck123
pretty sure hes been on top of the leaderboard now for 2 years, you he cant be on a 2 year heater allthough i do agree he has his fair share of luck, but if you play good enough ur entiled to ur share

as of him winning a scoop, he obvs ran good but its not like it wasnt coming.

who would u consider to be the best player at the minute?
Talking 6-max, I think there is an entire field of players of roughly similar ability that are separated by only 1 thing - luck. IF you wanna push me, I always liked janiosmo in $15 +. In low stakes I probably like mastahdonk although statistically I don't think either would shine like bokkie, salisero, wadzon, juicy_j, etc.

I just played a few hours of hypers and lost virtually every hand of every game. Bokkie only sucked me out once tonight but in the past, he just used to kill me HU. He auto-shoves any 4, hand after hand after hand, and just destroys my A 3 4 8 with 5 6 9 K. This went on for many months until I took an extended hiatus from 6-max. I honestly believe some players just can't win regardless of play while the reciprocal holds true for winners.

Take hunmatt and johnniewalk. Hunmatt sucked out my A A L X with 2 6 Q K more than once, won a few games. Johnniewalk won 11/12 hands vs me, not a single time ahead when the money went in. You can't talk about skill in the face of numbers like that. Of the 30 or so times I had premium hands, I lost 29. Of the 30 or so times that bokkie had premium, he won virtually 100% and even on the rare occasion he did get sucked out, he still had chips and could phoenix his way back to a win.

Not saying bokkie isn't a good player because clearly he is but go look at billygstar's recent posts for the $2100 SCOOP (u can find it in May Misc). It's like he is racing using rocket fuel while the rest of us are driving hybrids.
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05-17-2014 , 08:20 PM
[QUOTE=streityboy;43296271]
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Originally Posted by HighTillIDieT4L

This post made my day. Tytyty. To be called a fish by quant means I have finally arrived.

In regards the hand. Beyond standard. Gl at the tables.
Yep, I'm generous with the F-word

OK lemme help you out here. That hand is not close to standard unless you are position-shoving in hyper or playing HU. With turbo blinds and even with your stack, I think I'm folding there 80% +. You were beyond dominated in every sense, needing to spike a J or a 5-card hand to even have a chance - and that doesn't change much even if the two later players call with rags, never mind premium.
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05-18-2014 , 01:07 AM
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Originally Posted by HighTillIDieT4L
Talking 6-max, I think there is an entire field of players of roughly similar ability that are separated by only 1 thing - luck. IF you wanna push me, I always liked janiosmo in $15 +. In low stakes I probably like mastahdonk although statistically I don't think either would shine like bokkie, salisero, wadzon, juicy_j, etc.

I just played a few hours of hypers and lost virtually every hand of every game. Bokkie only sucked me out once tonight but in the past, he just used to kill me HU. He auto-shoves any 4, hand after hand after hand, and just destroys my A 3 4 8 with 5 6 9 K. This went on for many months until I took an extended hiatus from 6-max. I honestly believe some players just can't win regardless of play while the reciprocal holds true for winners.

Take hunmatt and johnniewalk. Hunmatt sucked out my A A L X with 2 6 Q K more than once, won a few games. Johnniewalk won 11/12 hands vs me, not a single time ahead when the money went in. You can't talk about skill in the face of numbers like that. Of the 30 or so times I had premium hands, I lost 29. Of the 30 or so times that bokkie had premium, he won virtually 100% and even on the rare occasion he did get sucked out, he still had chips and could phoenix his way back to a win.

Not saying bokkie isn't a good player because clearly he is but go look at billygstar's recent posts for the $2100 SCOOP (u can find it in May Misc). It's like he is racing using rocket fuel while the rest of us are driving hybrids.
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Originally Posted by HighTillIDieT4L
Yep, I'm generous with the F-word

OK lemme help you out here. That hand is not close to standard unless you are position-shoving in hyper or playing HU. With turbo blinds and even with your stack, I think I'm folding there 80% +. You were beyond dominated in every sense, needing to spike a J or a 5-card hand to even have a chance - and that doesn't change much even if the two later players call with rags, never mind premium.
Man, billy is missing out a lot having you on ignore, just sayin'

If you just get rid of that believe in magic, it'll be perfect!

Last edited by plaaynde; 05-18-2014 at 01:19 AM.
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05-18-2014 , 04:40 AM
[QUOTE=HighTillIDieT4L;43296855]
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Originally Posted by streityboy

Yep, I'm generous with the F-word

OK lemme help you out here. That hand is not close to standard unless you are position-shoving in hyper or playing HU. With turbo blinds and even with your stack, I think I'm folding there 80% +. You were beyond dominated in every sense, needing to spike a J or a 5-card hand to even have a chance - and that doesn't change much even if the two later players call with rags, never mind premium.
No. Let me help you out.

1. Dead money
2. Not a great multi-way hand
3. Stack sizes
4. Limping ranges

All adds up to 5. Fold equity

You're being super results-orientated here. The only downside is I ran into someone else behind who had an even better hand. Meh. It happens.

You can learn something from different styles/thought processes. If you don't you are standing still.

You seem to think 18 mans is all about pre and post flop play and out playing your opponent. Everyone seems to have the same attitude except the better players. I might have to start playing these seriously again.
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05-18-2014 , 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by HighTillIDieT4L
Talking 6-max, I think there is an entire field of players of roughly similar ability that are separated by only 1 thing - luck. IF you wanna push me, I always liked janiosmo in $15 +. In low stakes I probably like mastahdonk although statistically I don't think either would shine like bokkie, salisero, wadzon, juicy_j, etc.

I just played a few hours of hypers and lost virtually every hand of every game. Bokkie only sucked me out once tonight but in the past, he just used to kill me HU. He auto-shoves any 4, hand after hand after hand, and just destroys my A 3 4 8 with 5 6 9 K. This went on for many months until I took an extended hiatus from 6-max. I honestly believe some players just can't win regardless of play while the reciprocal holds true for winners.

Take hunmatt and johnniewalk. Hunmatt sucked out my A A L X with 2 6 Q K more than once, won a few games. Johnniewalk won 11/12 hands vs me, not a single time ahead when the money went in. You can't talk about skill in the face of numbers like that. Of the 30 or so times I had premium hands, I lost 29. Of the 30 or so times that bokkie had premium, he won virtually 100% and even on the rare occasion he did get sucked out, he still had chips and could phoenix his way back to a win.

Not saying bokkie isn't a good player because clearly he is but go look at billygstar's recent posts for the $2100 SCOOP (u can find it in May Misc). It's like he is racing using rocket fuel while the rest of us are driving hybrids.
yeah i do agree with most of this but its all relivtive, bookie n hunmatt dont seem to suck out on me as much as others do but seem too on everyone else where as angribob, jonnywalk n jj allays do, just depends whos running good on the day tbh. but ur roi doesnt lie. would be interensing to see a accurate ev graph for the top players atm see how hot they are running.

ive allways found mastadonks game pretty std and dont reli mind him at the table coz he rarely gets it in behind enough to hand out bad beats. the reason the top players are where they are is coz they seem to put alot of preasure on players when they need to n play lots when theyre running hot.

one of my biggest flaws is playing to much when im running cold and playing to little when running hot

we should get a home game going for this thread be a fun game.
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05-18-2014 , 01:02 PM
[QUOTE=streityboy;43301025]
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Originally Posted by HighTillIDieT4L

You're being super results-orientated here. The only downside is I ran into someone else behind who had an even better hand. Meh. It happens.
Nope. A 8 J J is a suicidal hand and only playable from position, HU or a limp if it's ds. You actually finished 4th in the hand behind me, A 2 5 6 and rags in the BB. With your stack shoving utg, very high chance you find at least one caller. Up against 2 random hands, again I stress you need a 5-card or a J to hold.

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You can learn something from different styles/thought processes. If you don't you are standing still.
I learn from every game I play vs every player. You don't know my base-line game used to be like JJ in 6-max, bluff, shove, steal, fllip but then I became Borg and assimilated the tendencies and strategy of players like the dude I owe a lot to - personal (German, tight-aggressive, zero mistakes).

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You seem to think 18 mans is all about pre and post flop play and out playing your opponent. Everyone seems to have the same attitude except the better players. I might have to start playing these seriously again.
long-term that's how it should be, right? Are you insinuating that it's just all about being hot and shoving it? To a certain extent I might agree with that, 100% in 6-max, but longer blinds, 9 man tables yield much greater opportunity for strategy and actual poker.
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05-18-2014 , 01:22 PM
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Originally Posted by alexmck123
yeah i do agree with most of this but its all relivtive, bookie n hunmatt dont seem to suck out on me as much as others do but seem too on everyone else where as angribob, jonnywalk n jj allays do, just depends whos running good on the day tbh. but ur roi doesnt lie. would be interensing to see a accurate ev graph for the top players atm see how hot they are running.
I ****ing HATE johnniewalk, hunmatt, lukro8, exit4aflilm2, bleu329, bullstopper and bokkie in those games. I'm angry just thinking about it - I have had so many days when I literally can't win a hand vs these players. At a guess I would say overall johnniewalk runs best as he can crush bokkie and humatt consistently with the worst hand and in flips. In HU without a doubt, bokkie runs best by a long, long way. I don't have an issue with bob though, other than he doesn't always reg for the 18-man during his 6-max sessions. JJ crushed me for a while in $60 + but he posted some unflattering (from his POV) graphs in play vs me. They showed that long-term over thousands of games, I got in ahead way, way more often than he did. Got a lot more respect for JJ now than I used to tho. He''s a fellow stoner and has a lot of interesting things to say on 2+2 IMO.

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ive allways found mastadonks game pretty std and dont reli mind him at the table coz he rarely gets it in behind enough to hand out bad beats. the reason the top players are where they are is coz they seem to put alot of preasure on players when they need to n play lots when theyre running hot.
Yea I agree with that. Mastah will still auto-shove A 4 5 8 in the SB but not 2 3 6 K from the button. Also the pressure thing is standard in higher stakes - basically button or SB shoves 75% if no earlier action. Only works if you're hot but the thing is, from my POV anyway, the same players are ALWAYS hot, EVERY day. Over 2-3 years I've never had a winning streak vs lukro8, hunmatt, johnniewalk, bokkie or wadzon. Yet they have 100s vs me. Insane.

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one of my biggest flaws is playing to much when im running cold and playing to little when running hot
Is why I advocate no more than 15 buy-ins per session (although I dropped 50 BIs last night). I'm never playing hyper-turbos again. I'm sick of donating my $s to these luckbox idiots.

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we should get a home game going for this thread be a fun game.
I'll bring the special items, you lot bring the $s
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05-18-2014 , 02:07 PM
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Originally Posted by HighTillIDieT4L
I'm never playing hyper-turbos again. I'm sick of donating my $s to these luckbox idiots.
No no no. Welcome to my table.
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05-19-2014 , 11:52 AM
Ah what an irony.. Like you don't run hot Quantum? You're great player but I don't like the way you're bad mouthing the others and I also hate the way you're overstating facts.

Why do you hate:
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I ****ing HATE johnniewalk, hunmatt, lukro8, exit4aflilm2, bleu329, bullstopper and bokkie in those games.
Because of how hot they may run? Imo you're blind because of luck terms and you won't even see how much some of these players imroved their gameplay (Of course I'm only talking about Hypers). For me Hunmatt has made the biggest jump in his skill level and bookie.. Well, I'd love to play like him but it's still a long way for me.

Also I'm sorry for being so late. Congratulations Quantum and Bookie for great scores at SCOOP events
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05-19-2014 , 02:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Ziemni0k
Ah what an irony.. Like you don't run hot Quantum?
Nope. Put it this way - I went 6 weeks without holding with A A 2 X in SnGs. I lost $500 in 18-man games in that period, which amazes me no end. Lost about $1500 in hypers. Same players every day suck me out, including you if you care to remember.

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Why do you hate: Because of how hot they may run?
Well DUH! I play those guys for years and virtually every session they win 90%+ of all hands vs me (inc 2 nights ago when I was 1/30 hands when AHEAD, the 1 hand I won I had like 0.8 BBs). Even if I was the worst player in the world, how can I lose virtually every hand vs the same players?

Didn't say any of them play bad just that I ****ing hate them lol. Esp hunmatt, lukro8 and johnniewalk. Bokkie is invincible vs me HU. And honestly, I rate them all about the same skill-wise. Maybe johnniewalk or bullstopper are the worst, no, exit4afilm is the worst, but there's not much in it.

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Also I'm sorry for being so late. Congratulations Quantum and Bookie for great scores at SCOOP events
Thanks You should read how Bokkie made the FT of the $2100 SCOOP. Unsurprisingly, he had several huge slices of luck after making questionable plays. And before you say it, I'll give you my hand histories and show you that I had ZERO suckouts for the FT. The one hand I got in behind, I lost and bust.
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05-19-2014 , 02:44 PM
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Originally Posted by HighTillIDieT4L

Nope. A 8 J J is a suicidal hand and only playable from position, HU or a limp if it's ds.
To be fair even though I don't like this hand preflop, he does have the best position being on the button. Please don't reply with 4 paragraphs elaborating on this...I just wanted to point that out.
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05-19-2014 , 03:26 PM
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Originally Posted by spimp13
To be fair even though I don't like this hand preflop, he does have the best position being on the button. Please don't reply with 4 paragraphs elaborating on this...I just wanted to point that out.
Concise - utg limper + 1 caller with significantly larger stacks. They were never folding and going all-in negates position advantage post-flop.
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05-19-2014 , 03:37 PM
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Originally Posted by HighTillIDieT4L
Concise - utg limper + 1 caller with significantly larger stacks. They were never folding and going all-in negates position advantage post-flop.
UTG+1 has what I consider significantly larger stack. UTG has only $255 more than the button to start. Less f/e multiway though...I agree there, especially with big stack UTG+1 limping. I can't speak for him, but maybe he had a note on UTG and UTG+1?

Like I said I don't like the hand preflop since the hand value isn't very strong, but it is probably within the marginal range IP...sort of a meh spot though with that UTG+1 limp. If UTG+1 folds pre I don't mind the raise as much.
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05-19-2014 , 03:48 PM
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Originally Posted by spimp13
UTG has only $255 more than the button to start.
to clarify - the replayer does funny things sometimes. The A 8 J J player was all-in for 730 chips, he didn't bet exactly half his stack.
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05-19-2014 , 04:00 PM
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Originally Posted by HighTillIDieT4L
to clarify - the replayer does funny things sometimes. The A 8 J J player was all-in for 730 chips, he didn't bet exactly half his stack.
lol, that slightly changes things!
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05-19-2014 , 04:04 PM
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Nope. Put it this way - I went 6 weeks without holding with A A 2 X in SnGs. I lost $500 in 18-man games in that period, which amazes me no end. Lost about $1500 in hypers. Same players every day suck me out, including you if you care to remember.
Swings happen and I understand your frustration.

Actually I don't care about who I suck outed/being suckouted because I play a lot and it's common for me. But I do remember. Especially when I missclicked by calling trash hand - the one after I apologized you.
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Originally Posted by HighTillIDieT4L


Thanks You should read how Bokkie made the FT of the $2100 SCOOP. Unsurprisingly, he had several huge slices of luck after making questionable plays. And before you say it, I'll give you my hand histories and show you that I had ZERO suckouts for the FT. The one hand I got in behind, I lost and bust.
.
Hahahah yea I was railing some guys at high stake tournaments to learn something from them but the spot AQQ8>AA?? was the sickest one I've seen in a long time.

GL at the tables.
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05-19-2014 , 04:32 PM
Here are all my hypers. First $1.50 with a few $3.50, then $3.50, $7 and $3.50 again.

At a total of $0 it's time to go back from where I started from, to the $1.50s. Ev and chips are giving some hope for the future. You just have to feel confidently rolled.




Last edited by plaaynde; 05-19-2014 at 04:43 PM.
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05-19-2014 , 05:13 PM
^^ those graphs look good. Shows you've taken a few beats but otherwise run only slightly below average.

Just gotta ask - why do you not play the equivalent 18-man or even 9-man turbos? There is less volatility, a greater premium on strategy and also if you play just for fun, they last 5 times as long.

Btw if you reflect green line of the 2nd graph in the x-axis, that is what my chip graph looks like
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