Oh, I do agree with Buzz that a break every couple of hours is advisable. But not quitting sessions early based just on statistical noise!

Oops, to clarify, I meant how many mistakes by other people can you count?

This is your best indication that you're in a good game: When you see other people making plenty of plays that you know are wrong, and ideally that you can give a theoretically grounded explanation why they're wrong. So if you notice a dozen in your first two hours, and three in your next two hours, then you're probably not as sharp as you were at the beginning of the session.

However, what I expect will happen is, you'll become extra-vigilant after the two hour mark, which means my lousy "experiment" will have done its job.

Sometimes I think there are too many mistakes to keep track of. It is a bit frustrating because I believe I should do much better in this game. The players are weak, but they do get rewarded a lot for their bad play.. I know that's poker. So with me believing I should do better, I guess I need to do more internalizing on my own mistakes. It would be nice to have a person in the game to be a soundboard on my play, but I still like the advice provided on here.

Thank you everyone for their advice, btw!

I'd recommend the section in Super System II regarding Omaha hi/lo if you want to learn the basics.

It will teach you the fundamentals that will allow you to win in full-ring, loose-passive O8 cash games (5+ players to a flop, not a lot of raising or at least raises don't really thin the field)

I'm generally playing a 6/12 O8 game with a full kill in Tampa and the game is pretty good. There are a number of fish with awful hand selection and the good players aren't great, which allows you to usually know where they're at and run bluffs with the naked suited Ace against them (don't do that with the calling station fish though, they pay off with non-nut flushes so just take them to ValueTown when you can)

I was wondering everyone's thoughts on AA2x...with x being a card 6 thru 9... Lets say the Ace is one suited once. Also, the table is like my table at the local casino, therefore, you can expect to see four to the flop. The game is 4/8 LO8. Is this a raising hand in any position? Being new at this I have trouble letting go of this hand. The hanger card always seems problematic. Just wondering everyone's thoughts on it. Thanks.

I raise and reraise to the cap preflop with this hand. But I also have no trouble check/folding the flop after capping preflop. If you're having trouble with it, then by all means limp preflop. I think you lose some value but it's better than pissing away numerous bets on later streets.

No offense intended, but your question probably doesn't belong in the newb thread.

I'll provide my answer, but if anyone posts disagreement, I'll move your question and related posts to their own thread (because the newb thread is for simple, non-controversial beginner questions... questions where there's no serious difference of opinion as to the answer... and there likely will be a difference of opinion as to whether the hand is a "raising hand in any position").

Here's my answer:
In my opinion, AA2x hands are all playable in cash games with any number of players. Tournaments are a different story and whether or not AA2x is playable depends on the situation.

In any event, AA26, AA27, AA28, and AA29 are all strong starting hands. You should especially like them when one ace or both aces are suited, but even as rainbows they're all premium starting hands. (That's not to say any of them doesn't turn to dung after the flop, especially a flop with a deuce).

Whether or not a hand is a raising hand depends more on your opponents and your interaction with them than the actual cards in your hand. I think you can raise or not with any playable starting hand.

That's my opinion. If anyone posts a different opinion, I may move this discussion out of the newb thread.

Buzz

I like dalerobk2's answer (even though I probably don't play AA2x hands the same). When I started composing my reply, dalerobk2's answer was not posted.

Thanks dalerobk2 and Buzz for your response. Sorry for putting this question in the wrong spot. I appreciate the advice. I guess I really need to work on pre flop play ,and remind myself to let go of the hand instead of being caught up with the "Hey I have aces syndrome."

What are the chances of a low hand being possible by the river in O8, i.e. what are the chances that out of 5 cards (assuming no blockers), at least 3 of them will be different cards that are 8 or lower? How does this % change if we hold low cards in our hand?

thankss

In any given deal there is a 60% chance of a low being dealt by the river. Correct.

2 Low Cards (example A-2-J-Q), probability of making a low by river = 24% Incorrect, I think. I believe 36.52% is correct
3 Low Cards (example A-3-4-K) probability of making a low by river = 40% Incorrect, I think. I believe 47.35% is correct
4 Low Cards (example 3-4-7-8) probability of making a low by river = 49% Incorrect, I think. I believe 53.08% is correct

I think this is what you are asking.

This isn't a strategy post, but more of a which should I rather do.

I play 1/2-1/3NL (and looking at 2/5) and beat it for a pretty decent clip with little variance.

Most places (in vegas), only spread 8/16 O8. Sometimes it's with half-kill.

Unsure of places that will spread it higher than that (maybe a 20/40 O8 at bellagio).

Is it worth learning O8 for a better hourly than 1/2-1/3 (when 2/5 doesn't run) and is it worth learning it for O8 tournaments?

Also, Difference between O8 cash and O8 tournaments?

Well, I don't think you have anything to apologize for--in some ways it is a "newb" question--but I agree with Buzz that it would probably be better in another thread.

Most people would say, "Wait until you have a specific hand history and then post in its own thread." That's the bread and butter of many 2+2 forums, but I suggest we could use more of the following:

• Threads with specific hand histories, perhaps even made up ones, but not just one hand. Better for me is to change variables. What if we have (A2)A9? What about (A9)A8? What about at a passive table, or if we expect 8 to see the flop, etc. etc.
• Threads based on theoretical principles. Many of us learn best from big-picture principles backed up by examples, not just by throwing out 1000 examples and sorting them out.

These are closely related.

So, specifically, I'd love to see a thread with "problem AA hands", even though AA2x is never a problem hand preflop.

"I wish I could get infinite bets in preflop and get them to call me. But instead, under the rules of limit poker, how can I get the most money preflop?"

If many of them will call, raise. You have a monster and want a big pot. A2 and A-suited are very robust multiway.

If most of them will fold, raise. In contrast to the previous paragraph, knocking opponents out increases the value of your AA, so I don't mind getting the pot shorthanded with a huge advantage. Basically you have the best of both worlds with this great hand.

If one of them is almost sure to raise, limp planning to reraise. In the games I play in, someone with a weak hand is likely to cap just because they like to gamble.



That's true but of course it depends on pot size, opponents, etc. This hand doesn't completely whiff the flop that often, though, and will often have odds to continue with overpair (top set draw)+BDLD+BDFD.

Without consideration of the cards in your own hand, there are at least three different low ranks on the board (thus enabling low) very close to three deals out of five (60.09%).

But then someone also has to be playing a hand that qualifies for low. In actual full table play, someone actually makes low roughly half of the time.

If you hold A-2-3-4, low is less likely than if you hold K-Q-J-T. That's because when you are dealt low cards, fewer low cards are available for the board.

• If you have four unpaired low cards there is about a 55% chance of low.

• If you have three unpaired low cards there is about a 58% chance of low.

• If you have two unpaired low cards there is about a 62% chance of low.

• If you have one low card there is about a 65% chance of low.

• If you have no low cards there is about a 69% chance of low.

By "chance of low" I mean "low is enabled on the board... at least three different low ranks."

The following from our FAQ sticky is not what you asked, but might be of interest to you:
17)What percentage of the time does a starting hand end up qualifying for low?

• When a starting hand has exactly two different low ranks, it will end up qualifying for low 36.52% of the time.
• When a starting hand has exactly three different low ranks, it will end up qualifying for low 47.35% of the time when it has a pair, as in A233, A223, or AA23....
and 49.52% when it doesn't have a pair, as in A239 or A23K.
• When a starting hand has exactly four different low ranks, it will end up qualifying for low 53.08% of the time.

Buzz

Are you basically asking us whether you can make more money playing no-limit Texas hold 'em or Omaha-8?

I don't know. (How could anyone know)?

If you're asking whether there is a difference between playing in O8 cash games and playing in O8 tournaments, the answer is, "Yes there is."

If you're asking what is the difference between playing in O8 cash games and playing in O8 tournaments, briefly, for me I think the main difference is I'm more concerned with surviving in tournaments than in cash games.

Buzz

That would be interesting. I have no problem with that.
That would be interesting too. I have no problem with that either.

Feel free to start one if you like. We'll see how it goes.

My problem with past threads with multiple hands is the particular hand some responder is discussing is not always clear. I believe you would make it clear, but I don't think everyone would. But go ahead and try it, if you like. Perhaps I'm wrong.

Buzz

One thing I love about this post, though, is that you're thinking like this. Indeed, danglers are generally bad, as you would very much like to have all four cards working together. (Occasionally your dangler can win for you, though, e.g. by making trips.)

This hand is an exception, though, because the three "good" cards are absolutely premium.

Incidentally, IMO AA2K isn't all that much better than AA29, and AA26 is quite a bit better than AA2K. When you already have two aces, you already have a draw to beat top two pair so the king is devalued (relative to A2Kx which is usually much stronger than the same hand without the king).

In fact, HU or 3 handed, AA27 or AA28 are better hands than AA2K, because shorthanded the "emergency lows" will win the low half much more often than in a multiway pot.

I'd like to play the HU NL 0/8 superturbo on ftp

I can't find any resources on 0/8 much less short stacked version of it

Thanks Buzz, your post was super helpful and answered all my questions

Thanks for your insight. I really appreciate it.

I know this has probably been asked before, but is there a PLO8 mtt schedule for all the big sites combined?

I think there was one knocking about but may be dated now.

Cheers.

http://www.omahaplanet.com/best-tournament-sites/

My question is what is the best way to do homework ? How to look at hand history and now what I did wrong ? Any help I play on bovada . I have omaha indicator so it does help ton with vpip
Thanks

I don't know what the best way is. But I think "doing your homework" is a good idea.

I think your goal should be twofold. (1) Identify your own mistakes so as to correct them, and (2) Identify the mistakes of your opponents so as to exploit them.

If you have hand histories available, study them. Ideally you get an expert coach to look at your hand histories and give you expert coaching feedback. I'm not personally interested in doing that, but there are others who post here who are. (But they're not allowed to advertise here, else we'd be overwhelmed with advertising... the coaching forum is the place where they're allowed to advertise).

If you don't overwhelm us with your hand histories, you can post a few here and you'll probably get feedback. A problem with doing that is you'll likely get different view points as to how best play a hand... and then you'll have to decide for yourself who has the best approach for your particular game opponents.

But in posting here and studying the replies, perhaps you'll learn.

I don't know how to answer that question. Perhaps someone else does.

Buzz

What is a good vpip on a good player in plo8 compare to a fish . Is it 20% for a reg and 75% to 100% for a fish ?