Hero utg with A2347 no nut suit, I elect to limp for the $5 bring in. 4 or 5 handed to a flop of A27 all diamonds. Check to me I lead for $15, folds to btn who puts in a less than pot raise of i think $45, bb calls, and I call. Turn is an 8, we check to the button who pots, bb calls and I call. River is a brick, button pots again for around $225, bb calls, and I call with just the nut low hoping to get 25%.
It is pretty obvious what everyone's hands are on the turn so maybe i should repot the turn to get the bb to fold his low? Only issue is bb might not fold if he has a set with the nut low...Is anyone repotting flop after the btn reraises and getting it in?
As played I just need to call river and hope I am getting atleast 25% right?
This is a spot where all your money is made. Folding being absolutely freerolled is how you win in this game.
This is a VERY common spot in O8 where being IP is everything
He is not gonna fold ever because no one ever does, that is why you can fold river and print money
You can fold turn too because you have no protection (but prob shouldnt for fh outs) but folding river is the nuts
for the most part i don't understand this post, but one thing it seems to indicate is that hero should fold the river. This is wrong under most circumstances.
the OP hh doesn't actually make sense.
Spoiler:
preflop either 4 or 5 people contribute $5 each
flop ia Ad2d7d, its a limped pot, either $20 with 4 people or $25 with 5 people
hero bets 15, btn raises to 45, bb calls, hero calls (there was ether 1 or 2 check/folds)
turn is 8x, pot is either 135 or 140.
bb, checks, hero checks, btn bets either 135 or 140, bb calls, hero calls
river is brick, pot is 540 or 560
bb, checks, hero checks, btn bets either 540 or 560, bb calls, hero calls.
(you say that the river pot bet is 225, which can only be true if the turn bet is 30)
nonetheless if the river is 3way and hero's call closes the action facing a pot bet (no matter the actual value), calling and getting 25% of the pot or folding are equal.
so the river decision concerns the probability of getting 1/6th and the probability of getting 1/2.
since calling p makes the final pot 4p then getting 1/2 is +p better then folding, and getting 1/6th is -1/3p worse then folding.
therefore if you get 1/6th more often then 3 times as often as you get 1/2 then folding is better than calling, otherwise calling is better than folding.
if the river bet is less then pot. lets say the river is 3way and hero closing the action faces a 1/2 pot bet and a call, calling and getting 25% of the pot is 1/8p better then folding. (the pot become 2.5p, the bet was 1/2p and your 25% of the pot is 5/8p)
getting 1/2 is 3/4p better then folding and getting 1/6 is -1/12p
worse then folding, you would need to be very certain that you are getting 1/6th for folding to be correct.
the turn (and even the flop really requires a better hand history.
for the turn and river both to be pot means the effective stacks is $700+ which is pretty deep. with effective stacks less the decision involves the SPRs involved.
Yeah calling and folding are exactly the same minus a,couple dollars here or there so just fold and save variance but FOLD turn. You dont have low protection and villain always has half, so do the math on turn and fold and you will be the big winner at this game
You can call if you have protection on your lows. You are pretty much crushed by the 5s. 345xx is your worst enemy. You have no way to beat that hand
Now, you do have 6 high outs and will quarter the low when you get there on turn but dont expect to get paid by the flush when you hit, so math says fold turn if v2 never folds, which he wont
Not sure what the effective stack sizes are. But, if your plan is to call pot sized bets on the turn and river (even when you don't make a full house), then you may as well re-pot on the flop.
This is how you get max value when you do improve to a full house. Also, you put pressure on other player and may get him to fold "nut low".
Is it really that likely that one or even both opponents have the nut low? I'd understand the concern if the nut low was A2 but I thought 34 is one of the rarest nut lows. I suppose the concern is do the opponents play as they did without having the nuts for at least one side. I haven't played enough Big O to know if people ever call down here with 2nd nut low or 2nd nut flush.
They dont. This is a classic O8 hand. This exact scenario should happen A LOT. The player in the middle should always lose money and the player IP and OOP should make all the profit. OOP always has nut high. Middle guy should always have 345xx. When OP recognized this OTT he should fold. When we fold turn we make most of the profit.
If we re raise the flop then the middle guy can fold but we did not necessarily want him to fold at that point and its a disaster when he makes the mistake of calling
Yea sorry the $225 river bet is the only one i remember exactly, the rest were guesses.
To answer zoogenhiem's question: The 2nd nut flush and low would not call down in this game. There was even one instance in a previous hand where a guy (correctly) folded the nut flush to a repot on the river because a straight flush was possible.
