well suzzer under your system we wouldnt be allowed to opt out. so therefore we have to pay the tax increase like everybody else when we essentially have already paid for a lifetime policy.

I'm pretty sure if you're covered by the VA you don't have to purchase health insurance on top of that nor pay the penalty.



So are you all for it now?

yes but i was really asking about the single payer uhc that you guys want.

No. You'll get a tax break. Happy?

id be really happy if you go back to your old avitar

donkey woman bays at you

That IS his old avatar

Is anyone ITT actually arguing that the current system is awesome and shouldn't be changed?

I honestly don't know, I hardly read any of it.

Seems most agree that what we have sucks, and we either need full free market or full govt control

Maybe I'm wrong, but that's the gist of what I've read.

Newbs with their 2009 reg date lulz

So all the healthy people pay for the sick people? I guess I just think it is really unfair to the people who actually take care of themselves and are health responsible that they end up paying extra so people can eat poorly, not exercise, smoke, etc.

I get that accidents and unexpected things happen, which is why we have health insurance available in the market. I just still can't wrap my head around why a really healthy person who spends a lot of time making sure they stay healthy has to pay for the lack of health conscious of others. I guess I just think that healthy and health aware people should pay less money for health insurance than the average fast food eating, smoking, no exercise American.

What do you think insurance means? Everyone pays in and if you happen to get sick, it's the other healthy people who pay for it.

Oh noes so should all the people whose houses aren't on fire pay for the people who are? I should be able to opt out of fire insurance ten buy it on the spot when my house is on fire.

No one is against making people who live unhealthy lifestyles pay a premium. Smokers already do.

Why not have everyone pay the same for uhc, but tax healthy food and gym memberships less?

I think insurance is a useful thing. I am not saying that I don't want insurance. I have it. I am saying I don't want to pay the same amount of money into a system if I am spending more time and money on keeping myself healthy than the rest of the people.

I think that tax system Low Key presented is both immoral and a tool for desired result. If people want to eat very unhealthy, smoke, and not exercise, the insurance company will judge this with their actuarial team and charge them more. They make a wager on how likely it is for you to need their service. People who are less likely, would pay less and vice versa.

But we still have to pay for those people now even if they don't get insurance. How is this still not getting through?

So you're against moving costs around to ensure that everyone has health care? (you pay slightly more in taxes for insurance, but all your healthy food is cheaper, offsetting the cost)

What about a "good health habits" tax credit? I'm guess it would be a nightmare defining who qualifies. Maybe you do <x> preventative things, don't smoke, etc.

Pfft, what idiot would check the "yes I smoke, tax me more" box?

Japan does that, they use waistline and some other metrics.

is there anyone fat in japan except pro sumo wrestlers?

I think if people want to give to charity, and that charity wants to help people without money or insurance, that is their prerogative. Otherwise, they will die. This is about being responsible. If we as a society have an obligation to save every single life, should we just send every single dollar and good possible to every single country and person in the entire planet to make sure every living human has equal health care?

I don't support subsidies, so I don't like the tax credits on health food or gym memberships, etc.

Healthy habits credits on taxes are not any different from getting cheaper premiums from insurance companies for having healthy habits. I'd rather let the insurance companies figure it out in a free market than trust the US government.

Summary of this thread: american politicians are dumber than the politicians of the rest of the world and can't be trusted.

DOES THAT MEAN AMERICANS ARE DUMBER TOO?

Next time tune in for "Logic? **** LOGIC!"

Let us just let the government decide what our jobs are, hobbies we do, who we marry, who gets to procreate, things we own, etc. They obviously are smarter than us. We can't make our own decisions or be responsible.

I'm sure a doctor could verify if you were a smoker or not.

So when the ambulance shows up at the scene, do we wait to verify insurance before carrying someone to the hospital? If not, now that they've arrived, do you operate on them before verifying whether or not they have insurance?

Do you really let someone bleed out on the side of the road because they don't have insurance?