jfc lirva. we need a lirv containment thread.

did anyone actually read the article i linked? it's good i promise.

In the fire case, note that the department in question is a city agency and the people who pay the $75 are outside the city (it's "free" for city residents).

What you're looking at is a failure of the county government.

ez game

I was wondering where the hell the other city's fire department was or whether the county just has unprotected areas under its jurisdiction.

pvn - I'm glad you're finally on board that there is significant benefit to be gained from govt doing it's job well, and that a failure of govt leaves people in a worse state than when the govt does it's job well. So I'm sure you'll agree the obvious solution is that the country govt should simply be stronger and do a better job like it does almost everywhere else in the country.

Do counties have their own fire departments where you guys are? Around here the cities handle it.

You don't have to institute anything. It already exists. The fire department doesn't have to prove a callous point by watching a house burn down. They can charge a reasonable fee after the put the fire out, just like a doctor can send you a bill even if you didn't agree to treatment while in a coma.

My guess is if word got about about the reasonable fee, most people would just opt to pay that. Also the fire department would probably take just as much heat for price gouging.

It seems to me that if you're going have this FUBAR system, you have to let a house burn down every now and then to make a statement and validate the business model.

We have tons of volunteer fire departments for the outlying areas.

Plenty of counties have fire departments.

By now you should know, that the correct answer to this is that the real problem is the existence of the city fire department. This is a rare case where the state doesn't use force or theft to do its job. OTOH the city's fire department having a quasi monopoly is obviously the only reason that there is no private fire-fighting service with more flexibility e.g. "on the spot" payment. Can't work with the city department causing artificially low prices.

Think about who you are talking to. It is always the states fault. There might even be regulation that prevents a private fire-fighting service.

Our smaller towns have volunteer forces but don't think the counties do.

If I'm not mistaken, our county is subdivided into districts, each with its own volunteer fire department. Theoretically, everybody should be covered by one of them.

The city or town departments cover the counties here. I don't think they charge fees but not sure.

lol at distinguishing between medicinal marijuana and marijuana. if anyone can post a reason that marijuana should be illegal while making sense at the same time, i'll eat my mousepad. it shouldn't have to be "medicinal" for people to get benefits from it and/or enjoy using it.

the reason people like lirva constantly harp on the marijuana issue is it's demonstrative of the existence of the us gov't in a nutshell. there's no reason whatsoever for its illegality. it's not anyone's business aside from the user's, yet it remains illegal ... and not only that, we pay taxes to fund the manpower that must exist to lock people up for possessing it. ****ing baffling.

in general, people who want to use violence to control what other people do are "bad people," yes. there are lots of things that can make someone a "bad person"; that's clearly one of them.

So every statist is a bad person iyo?

I can't imagine what it's like to go through life thinking that 95% of the people on the planet are fundamentally bad people.

Excellent.

If you read the old thread the bolded was repeatedly stated by ACists without, you know, any evidence or support for that theory. I'm pretty sure it's been long enough that we can expect a repeat.

goofy,

a lot of the people on the planet are clueless and brainwashed.

Notice, just like the child prostitution thread, the eventual libertarian consensus position will end up being that:

A) Nothing bad happened here, a person did not pay a fee and was thus did not receive a service. Decisions have consequences.

B) But also don't worry the market would fix it(even as per A, "it" isn't a problem, so ???).

guys like mitt romney and barack obama are absolutely "bad people" imo. they're self-serving and power-hungry and get a kick out of being in control of other people. and they have no real beliefs about anything -- they'll say w/e they think will cause them to obtain/maintain a position of power at any time, even if that means telling straight-up lies.

from jsnipes' nyt article:

that causes alarm bells to go off in my head. i don't know about you, but i don't care what people call me and i'm not conscious of my place in any hierarchy ... definitely not one that's proven to be as nonsensical, inefficient, and bureaucratic as the us gov't.

i don't think everyone who votes for an obama-esque candidate is a "bad person." i do think they're guilty of not thinking much or at all about politics, not being able to think rationally about politics, or some combination of those things. they're people that candidates like obama have succeeded in fooling, imo; that doesn't mean they're "bad people."

Well, I work in healthcare and enjoy making sick people better but I still like to be able to pay rent at the end of the day. I imagine the firemen feel the same way and thus the fire department needs a source of money.
Agree. People's short-sightedness and stupidity require making certain things mandatory, but
If they don't live in the city there's no way the city can charge them mandatory taxes.

The system in place seems reasonable to me.

...or they're people who see Obama (or whoever)'s flaws, but would still prefer him to the alternative, and accept that this two-party system is not changing at this time. They might be thinking a lot about politics, and doing so perfectly rationally, without being fooled at all.

CNN/Time Iowa 11/29-12/6

33% Gingrich
20% Romney
17% Paul
9% Perry
7% Bachmann
5% Santorum
1% Huntsman

Source

Interesting about this one, is they polled registered Republicans only. You can change registration at the caucus site if you want to cross over, so Independents and even Democrats can participate if it tickles their fancy. This is Gingrich's highest number in Iowa ever, and it's amazingly Romney's highest poll number in Iowa since October.

CNN/Time New Hampshire 11/29-12/6

35% Romney
26% Gingrich
17% Paul
8% Huntsman
3% Bachmann
2% Perry
2% Santorum

Source

This is the second closest Gingrich has been to Romney in a poll, and it matches Paul's best result of the campaign in New Hampshire. Huntsman continues to struggle to move in the polls.

the same can be said of anybody in a position of strength over someone else. be it a politician, a forum moderator, a poker coach. Your parents were considered the same I would suppose when you hit puberty.

I am serious here, you are some sort of poker player, your money is derived from lieing to people to take their stuff. can you see the hypocrisy in your position?