Amen. Paul Ryan voted for all three of these FWIW.

That analogy is pretty terrible. Newt allegedly started the fighting 15 years ago and so he's to blame for antagonistic relations between different members of the parties today? At what point do current officeholders have some accountability?

lol I'm sure the pelosi 'obstructionism' was all in retaliation to Newt. Couldn't be that there's actual parity between the two parties, the economy wasn't doing so well and they have different ideas of what to do. Must be the ulterior motive and not the super obvious one.

People compromise when they have little to no power. When two parties have about the same amount of different ideas and power, or at least enough power to stop things they don't like from happening, they don't compromise much.

Agree with ikes, bipartisan stuff usually means we're getting ****ed.

Yes.

But I beleive another four years of this is a more aggressive form of cancer for the country.

Too countless to name beleive the same if a republican were to be elected.


In the past, we could come together by supporting their stuff if they support ours. But doing so makes the costs of legislation go way up.

Now we are in a spot from debt and demographics that we are going to hit the wall. Europe only has 20-25 years lead time on all the social services, but we have spent SO much money on deffense (allowing them to spend all their money on social), that we are running right behind them on debt.

I'm not going to stand down when someone says we need to have free health care like the rest of the western world, when the rest of the western world is falling apart because of social services they can't afford to provide.

Its all going to blow up towards the end of my life. I hope by electing strong conservative leaders the inevitable happens after I'm dead. If we are going to have it out, I'd rather do so while I'm sharp and strong and can shoot straight.

I kept waiting for Cain to check for writing on his hand with the answer.

Somebody buy this man a pen.

Please show where I said current office holders aren't accountable.

But lets see we have the republicans holding the House from what 1994-2006? Then Pelosi has the house for 4 years (and apparently does all the damage). Then Ryan and Boehner throw an ongoing temper tantrum since 2010.

Add to that unprecedented stuff like Mitch McConnell saying that getting Obama out of office is his #1 priority. The republicans signing pledges that effectively hamstring their ability to legislate. The republicans apparently being willing to default on our sovereign debt before raising the debt ceiling that was raised dozens of times under Bush and Reagan.

Every developed nation on earth has UHC. Yet not only did the republicans refuse to move one inch to make that better legislation (Obama had tort reform on the table), they completely closed ranks and broke the record for fillibusters.

But yeah dems and repubs are equally culpable for the partisan rancor we have today. No false dichotomy here. Move along.

This! I don't understand how people can be so baffled that it ends up as one side vs the other when one side is w/o a doubt a bunch of old white fascists.

bbbbbbbbbbb but the demmycrats is gonna raise der taxes!!!! TYRANNY!


So i will leave you with the words of wisdom of the beacon of conservative light in the senate, Jim Demint, and his words of wisdom

"said if someone is openly homosexual, they shouldn't be teaching in the classroom and he holds the same position on an unmarried woman who's sleeping with her boyfriend -- she shouldn't be in the classroom."

FASCISM pure and simple. No other way to define or sugarcoat it. And i know the democratic party sucks and etc, but i mean to me voting for a republican over a democrat would be like voting for Mussolini over Neville Chamberlain, sure Chamberlain was a spineless ninny but at least he wasnt a fascist prick like Demint, Gingrich etc

/end rant

Like I said before, anyone who actually believes the republicans were willing to default completely fell for it, and should be embarrassed.

Please list some examples of "Pelosi obstructionism" that you feel were egregiously outside the norm for normal House procedure. Or do you just want to assert your way to false dichotomy?

Sure the republicans held a gun to the head of the country. But they were never actually going to pull the trigger. So it's all good. Lol at you for being scared.

Can you not grasp how just threatening to do that, and screwing up our credit rating, broke all kinds of new ground for those kinds of negotiations?

lol I don't think anything Pelosi did was out of the norm. That's kinda the whole point.

The reason why politics is so mean is because the electorate has given us an executive with different ideas than congress because they've been not happy and anti-incumbent for the past 2 cycles. That's the cause for deadlock, not some mean dude/chick/whatever.

You put the blame on one person and then drew a poor analogy to act as though the party of the person who allegedly started the fight is more culpable than anyone else even if the fight has gone on for 15 years and the alleged starter of the fight is long gone.

You don't have to explicitly say they aren't accountable to leave the clear implication there. And your initial statement did imply that Gingrich is somehow to blame for today's state of congressional politics.

That's because you hate govt, which dovetails nicely with the republicans' plan for gunking up the works. When everyone hates congress the dems definitely lose more than the republicans.

Yeah, completely unheard of, despite people like Obama voting to do the same thing a few years ago.

BTW suzzer, it's funny you keep bringing that up, because they did compromise.

oops

There are a lot of causes for deadlock - extremely partisan districts where the candidate has a lot more to fear from the primary than from his opponent is a big one. Grover Norquist doesn't help. 24-hour news doesn't help. It's not just because people are pissed at the incumbent. They gave Bush congress for 6 years.

Yeah Obama casting a meaningless vote against the debt ceiling is definitely the same thing as what the republicans did this year in turning it into a gigantic political football for the first time in history.

If by compromise you mean the republicans got everything they wanted, then yes.

Everyone can't have started it. I gave you one moderate democrat's opinion, with examples, of how Newt changed the game for the worse. The dems have only had the House for 4 years since 1994. Are you really going to claim 50/50 culpability?

Shockingly, democrats weren't complaining about a lack of cooperation between 2000-2006 suzzer.

Also, let's not pretend when you say you wish there was more bipartisanship you really mean that you wish the republicans would cave more to the Democrats. If the situations of the parties were reversed I'm 100% certain your position on this would be as well.

Sure ikes, just keep asserting your false dichotomy with vague handwaves while I keep giving examples of republicans breaking new ground in partisanship. Beyond standard for you.

Also wtf do you even mean about 2000-2006?

I don't know to what level I can apportion culpability between the two (it's not as though the minority party magically is less culpable in these matters due simply to having less power at any given time); I really only said anything because it was a wild extrapolation of your perception of Newt's actions in the mid-90's to say that he caused 15+ years of bitter partisanship afterwards.

Like with all of the candidates, there are reasons not to vote for Newt, but that was a weak point to cite in a quick hit against him in apparent support of why.

How can you quote a statement about Pelosi and blame Grover for a nice chunk of everthing? Gridlock is good. Politicians generally screw up when they pass anything other than the simplest laws. A law will either suck right off the bat, or it will blow the snot out of the budget in 10 years,

Its been going on from the founding of the country.

Please, Please, Please spend an hour researching the campaign rhetoric between Jefferson and Adams.

This, jfc.