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Old 02-02-2018, 10:36 PM   #51
Monteroy
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Re: When is it time to GTFO?

Tax filing / FBAR rules are probably the main reason people consider to or actually choose to drop their US citizenship standing, but that is of course among expats who are not living in the US (and generally have no intent of living there in the future).

I doubt any Americans living in the US who post in this forum would ever do it due to Trump, even if talking about it is cathartic in some manner, since once you give it up you don't get it back in the future, even with President Oprah.
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Old 02-03-2018, 12:07 AM   #52
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Re: When is it time to GTFO?

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Originally Posted by SuperUberBob View Post
Has anybody considered circumstances in which they'd renounce their citizenship?

Of course, I'm assuming that some of you can do that without becoming a stateless person.
I can do it without becoming stateless, and the scenarios for me doing so are so far fetched that it's not worth thinking about.
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Old 02-03-2018, 02:14 AM   #53
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Re: When is it time to GTFO?

I've got enough money squirreled away I could split time between Mexico and Vietnam for quite a few years if needed.
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Old 02-03-2018, 04:20 AM   #54
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GTFO to where ?

So a person determines it's time to GTFO.

You barely have 3 months of money.

What country would let you in where you can immediately find a decent job and adequate housing ?

It's not like Americans are wanted or liked elsewhere.
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Old 02-03-2018, 07:30 AM   #55
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Re: When is it time to GTFO?

Not really a matter of being liked or not, rather it is whether a person will add to or be a burden to the new country. Years ago after Black Friday a lot of poker players charged toward Canada assuming they would be greeted at the border by friendly Mounties offering donuts from Tim Hortons as they rolled out the red carpet. Many of them got a surprise, eh.
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Old 02-03-2018, 06:35 PM   #56
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Re: When is it time to GTFO?

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Originally Posted by zikzak View Post
I can do it without becoming stateless, and the scenarios for me doing so are so far fetched that it's not worth thinking about.
I don't know about that. If Trump goes full Hitler, I think it'd be time get moving.
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Old 02-03-2018, 09:16 PM   #57
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Re: When is it time to GTFO?

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I don't know about that. If Trump goes full Hitler, I think it'd be time get moving.
Having kids I'd have to get moving or at least get them out first, but if not...

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Old 02-03-2018, 11:00 PM   #58
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Re: When is it time to GTFO?

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I don't know about that. If Trump goes full Hitler, I think it'd be time get moving.
You don't need to renounce your citizenship to go live in another country where you also have citizenship. You just quietly file those documents away for the time being. There just aren't very many reasons where renouncing makes sense. You can't undo that. What if the US ends up totally awesome in 20 years but you can't move back because you burned that bridge for no damn good reason at all?
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Old 02-03-2018, 11:13 PM   #59
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Re: When is it time to GTFO?

Last Wednesday I took the day off and went up to the state capitol and spoke at a branch of the legislature on Utilities refunding the money realized by the tax reform generated by the White house.

Shortly after I spoke (as a ratepayer of state utilities) The chairman of the committee directed staff to prepare an 'accounting order' to make it happen.

I was the only ratepayer in the whole state to speak at the workshop.

First rule of life: Show up.

Second rule: Put up a fight and don't be a pussy.
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Old 02-03-2018, 11:43 PM   #60
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Re: When is it time to GTFO?

as a white male, I will stay to the bitter end bc I am lazy and whatever.

but there is 0% chance I would raise a kid in this country. if I happened to stumble into inevitable fatherhood, I would be feverishly researching and applying for ways to move to canada, germany,australia, nz and uk. then I would be researching the rest of the western european countries as well as korea and japan to see if living there was compatible with proper values.

the only reason I live here is inertia and selfishness. but there is no way would I saddle another human being with this effed up country. esp when it is apparent how the can has been kicked from the boomers on down the line and my kids generation will certainly be footing an outrageous bill.
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Old 02-04-2018, 01:04 AM   #61
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Re: When is it time to GTFO?

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as a white male, I will stay to the bitter end bc I am lazy and whatever.

but there is 0% chance I would raise a kid in this country. if I happened to stumble into inevitable fatherhood, I would be feverishly researching and applying for ways to move to canada, germany,australia, nz and uk. then I would be researching the rest of the western european countries as well as korea and japan to see if living there was compatible with proper values.

the only reason I live here is inertia and selfishness. but there is no way would I saddle another human being with this effed up country. esp when it is apparent how the can has been kicked from the boomers on down the line and my kids generation will certainly be footing an outrageous bill.
lol Cavs
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Old 02-04-2018, 01:24 AM   #62
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Re: When is it time to GTFO?

I can't be the only one looking forward to a second career as a sadistic prison camp guard.
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Old 02-04-2018, 10:48 AM   #63
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Re: When is it time to GTFO?

The unabashed "librul" perspective ...

The answer to this GTFO question is political. If Republicans get clobbered in the upcoming mid-term elections, Trump will quickly find his wings clipped. Republicans, or those Republicans who are left, will suddenly develop a backbone and stand up to Trump. If the [predicted] Democratic "wave election" does not materialize, we may be in real trouble ... (I'm hoping that the "wave" is more like a tsunami.)

If Democrats take over the House and/or the Senate, they will be wise not to go after Trump via impeachment. Trying to impeach Trump will be futile (and a waste of time) since it's unlikely that 67 senators would vote to convict - even if the House did pass articles of impeachment forcing a trial in the Senate. Better to let Trump remain in the White House figuratively bleeding and politically neutralized, (slowly twisting in the wind), while he continues to unilaterally destroy the Republican party.
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Old 02-04-2018, 10:54 AM   #64
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Re: GTFO to where ?

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Originally Posted by w00t View Post

What country would let you in where you can immediately find a decent job and adequate housing ?
You won't need a decent job if you can make $600 per month profit selling Go Gamble hats online. $150 per month in Thailand or the Philippines for a 1 bedroom in a good neighborhood - sofa in the bedroom, bed in the living room.
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Old 02-04-2018, 01:08 PM   #65
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Re: When is it time to GTFO?

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Originally Posted by zikzak View Post
You don't need to renounce your citizenship to go live in another country where you also have citizenship. You just quietly file those documents away for the time being. There just aren't very many reasons where renouncing makes sense. You can't undo that. What if the US ends up totally awesome in 20 years but you can't move back because you burned that bridge for no damn good reason at all?
The main reasons would be financially related. Depending on which country you live in, you may be subject to double taxation if you make over a certain amount of money. Thankfully, the UK (and most of Europe I believe) has a tax treaty with the US to prevent double taxation of US citizens. I also don't believe I make enough money to pay taxes to the US anyway.

New laws also state that any bank account with more than $10,000 or its equivalent in foreign currency needs to be disclosed to the US government. They claim that it's a way to prevent money laundering or some nonsense like that but the truth is that they want to monitor your finances more effectively.

In the unlikely event that something extreme happens like reinstituting the draft or requiring that people living overseas return to America under threat of legal action, then yeah I'd have to renounce.
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Old 02-04-2018, 03:14 PM   #66
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Re: When is it time to GTFO?

I went and got citizenship certificates for both my kids at the Canadian consulate immediately after the election. There was another couple with two small kids doing the same that day. I have been in WAAF mode earlier and more often than most, and I can't gauge ****, but I do know that the things everyone told me I was crazy for thinking could happen have been happening this past year. I think it's pretty ridic to depend on the previous norms as a safeguard when norms are clearly out the window.

People love to say that Germany was different because the economy was bad. Look at what they have achieved with this economy. The bubble pops, the housing market crashes, the tax cuts do their worst, the windfall that all the donors just received gets partially channeled into more propaganda, domestic/foreign election interference, nullification of election results, war or attack on us soil either real, allowed or staged---what will they be able to achieve behind that?....what indication is there that anyone is even slowing them down? It's American exceptionalism that people are leaning on pure and simple.

Like what is the end game here? We often wonder how wealthy people can be so short sighted in ruining the environment and ignoring climate change etc. I disagree. A simple solution for those who have an advantage is to usher in a mass population reduction globally. All it takes to accept that is a feeling of superiority and the power to do it. Hoarding resources until a large portion of the population dies off is probably the most logical and likely way to beat climate change. The idea that greediest, evilest people who also believe they are the smartest and hold the most power are not planning for that is the crazy thought.

I love my kids but I would not have had them after last year. Even if my worst fears are fantasy and all we are about to face is things getting much worse for the lower class, I have brought them into a pretty ****ty world.
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Old 02-04-2018, 04:01 PM   #67
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Re: When is it time to GTFO?

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Originally Posted by SuperUberBob View Post
The main reasons would be financially related. Depending on which country you live in, you may be subject to double taxation if you make over a certain amount of money. Thankfully, the UK (and most of Europe I believe) has a tax treaty with the US to prevent double taxation of US citizens. I also don't believe I make enough money to pay taxes to the US anyway.

New laws also state that any bank account with more than $10,000 or its equivalent in foreign currency needs to be disclosed to the US government. They claim that it's a way to prevent money laundering or some nonsense like that but the truth is that they want to monitor your finances more effectively.

In the unlikely event that something extreme happens like reinstituting the draft or requiring that people living overseas return to America under threat of legal action, then yeah I'd have to renounce.
OK, but if things get that bad in the US then I'm just not complying with US law while living outside of the country. It would have to be a scenario where the US is forcing foreign nations to enact punitive US laws against resident citizens of that foreign country, but somehow also be willing to drop the matter if the person in question goes through some formality of renouncing US citizenship. I'm sure I can imagine some set of contrived circumstances where that happens, but it seems really implausible.

Another scenario would be if the other country in question stops recognizing dual citizenship and says you have to choose: renounce your foreign nationality or leave. Some countries do this now, but none of the ones where US expats are likely to want to live. If we live in a world where Canada or New Zealand or wherever says "renounce or GTFO" then things have already gotten really really really bad and that's going to seem trivial in comparison.
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Old 02-04-2018, 05:53 PM   #68
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Re: When is it time to GTFO?

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Originally Posted by Former DJ View Post
...

If Democrats take over the House and/or the Senate, they will be wise not to go after Trump via impeachment. Trying to impeach Trump will be futile (and a waste of time) since it's unlikely that 67 senators would vote to convict - even if the House did pass articles of impeachment forcing a trial in the Senate. Better to let Trump remain in the White House figuratively bleeding and politically neutralized, (slowly twisting in the wind), while he continues to unilaterally destroy the Republican party.
If Democrats take the house or senate I would hope they would do a thorough and public investigation of Russian attempts to influence the 2016 election and 2018 elections as well.

I agree that impeachment would be futile but the votes in the House and then Senate would be problematic for Republicans if evidence points conclusively to Trump campaign collusion with Russia. I see no way that congressional Republicans would vote against Trump en masse because his base would revolt. But if they vote for Trump, the establishment base will erode.

The most important thing right now IMO is registering voters. I did it in NYC in 1984 and 1988. In 1984 we registered over 25,000 voters with a tiny budget (over 90% were registering as Democrats). For statewide elections this can be the difference. And it is the antidote to voter suppression...
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Old 02-05-2018, 08:09 PM   #69
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Re: When is it time to GTFO?

Quote:
President Donald Trump mocked Democrats Monday for their stony reactions during his State of the Union speech last week, saying that it was even "treasonous."

"They were like death and un-American. Un-American. Somebody said, 'Treasonous.' I mean, yeah, I guess, why not," he said to laughter. "Can we call that treason? Why not," he added. He made the remarks during a speech at a manufacturing plant in Cincinnati, Ohio.

"I mean they certainly didn't seem to love our country that much," he said, adding it was "very, very sad."
.
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Old 02-05-2018, 10:12 PM   #70
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Re: When is it time to GTFO?

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Originally Posted by red_Eyes_Bot View Post
go to canada there you can go to jail if you say, the wrong pronoun.
basically, you can't speak with people who are gender fluent, with out risking jail time.
Citation please.
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Old 02-05-2018, 10:16 PM   #71
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Re: When is it time to GTFO?

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Originally Posted by Max Cut View Post
.
saying that cultural marxist are anti-american is not a far stretch.given that america stands for individual rights.

capitalist america- individual rights,
cultural marxist america- no individual rights, only group rights.
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Old 02-05-2018, 10:16 PM   #72
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Re: When is it time to GTFO?

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Citation please.
Bill C-16 aka Act to amend the Canadian Human Rights Act and the Criminal Code
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Old 02-05-2018, 10:21 PM   #73
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Re: When is it time to GTFO?

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Originally Posted by red_Eyes_Bot View Post
Bill C-16 aka Act to amend the Canadian Human Rights Act and the Criminal Code
That does not support your claim that "basically, you can't speak with people who are gender fluent, with out risking jail time."

Find another citation or do not repeat the claim here unless you want to risk a ban.
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Old 02-05-2018, 10:25 PM   #74
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Re: When is it time to GTFO?

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That does not support your claim that "basically, you can't speak with people who are gender fluent, with out risking jail time."

Find another citation or do not repeat the claim here unless you want to risk a ban.
a ban? LOLLLLLLLLLL

"The law amends the Criminal Code by adding "gender identity or expression" to the definition of "identifiable group" in section 318.[7][8] Section 318 makes it a criminal offence to advocate or promote genocide against members of an identifiable group, which now includes gender identity or gender expression. Since the definition of "identifiable group" is also used in s 319 of the Code, the amendment also makes it a criminal offence to incite or promote hatred because of gender identity or gender expression.[9]

The law also adds "gender identity or expression" to section 718.2 of the Criminal Code.[10] This section is part of the sentencing provisions and makes gender identity and gender expression an aggravating factor in sentencing, leading to increased sentences for individuals who commit crimes motivated by bias, prejudice or hate based on gender identity or expression."

it is not called criminal code for the funs of it

https://lop.parl.ca/About/Parliament...ce=library_prb

Last edited by red_Eyes_Bot; 02-05-2018 at 10:30 PM. Reason: criminal code+ link
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Old 02-05-2018, 10:31 PM   #75
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Re: When is it time to GTFO?

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Originally Posted by red_Eyes_Bot View Post
a ban? LOLLLLLLLLLL

"The law amends the Criminal Code by adding "gender identity or expression" to the definition of "identifiable group" in section 318.[7][8] Section 318 makes it a criminal offence to advocate or promote genocide against members of an identifiable group, which now includes gender identity or gender expression. Since the definition of "identifiable group" is also used in s 319 of the Code, the amendment also makes it a criminal offence to incite or promote hatred because of gender identity or gender expression.[9]

The law also adds "gender identity or expression" to section 718.2 of the Criminal Code.[10] This section is part of the sentencing provisions and makes gender identity and gender expression an aggravating factor in sentencing, leading to increased sentences for individuals who commit crimes motivated by bias, prejudice or hate based on gender identity or expression."

it is not called criminal code for the funs of it
The only way this supports your claim is if you have a hard time speaking to people without bringing hate speech (threats of genocide, for example) into the conversation. Even if that describes you, it does not apply to most people. Therefore it does not support your claim.

You can also be banned for using an alt account to circumvent an existing ban, by the way.
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