The fuel that keeps white supremacy powerful in the US is not cross burning. It's respectable white people fighting against admitting the obvious every single time. Maximum obstruction means the conversation never gets past the first sentence.

It will surprise some but white supremacy is actually a white people problem. White people talking to white people and saying do better is necessary. I think enough of that would lead to progress but I also think most of us would rather not have progress because there would be non-zero personal cost.

I'm white. If I went to a Starbucks 100 times and sat for 15 minutes without making a purchase, or asked to use the restroom, I would be asked to leave exactly zero times. To claim otherwise is ignorant to reality. This case is textbook racism.

And it is becoming law in many states that you can't deny access to a restroom, even if you only have an employee restroom. So that argument doesn't hold much water.

Not even. I kind of feel like it's way more up to whites to protest obvious racist ****. Like tell all the black people who were out protesting the next day, it's cool, but you can go home if you want because we got this! Anything less than that is the ****ing problem imo.

This exactly. Same as it's incumbent on men (not women) to fix sexism.

Disagree.

1. The optics of "Stay back, black people, this is a job for whitey!" are pretty terrible, even if that isn't your intent.

2. If these people respect the protest of white people but not black people, then that says that there is still a big problem in how they think about black people.

Wookie when you get around to banning this guy, curious if he has a previous identity.

Probably that gbv nut job who’s been obsessed with Wookie the past week

Spot on. I travel a lot to NYC for work. For years I’ve always met with clients ahead of time at the Starbucks/DD/local coffee shop nearest to whatever building our actual meeting is in. Spend about 15-30minutes going over prep work before leaving. I’ve never once bought anything and usually the client doesn’t either. More often than not I bring an outside drink/snack in and eat it there. Number of times I’ve been asked to buy something or leave is 0.

Hmm. Pretty interesting disagreement then because I think the optics of seeing almost exclusively black people and very few, if any, whites protesting obvious straight up racism are also pretty terrible. In fact, it makes me sick. Since the election I've shown up at protests and marches and as a white male it's a very powerful feeling. How much more powerful would the optics be if instead of a sprinkling of white people (or men among women), our true majority were represented?

It's not a matter of who's job it is. It's a matter of who's problem it is. If you think racism is strictly a problem reserved for non-whites to handle for themselves, then I don't know what to say. As American citizens we should have each other's backs. Leaving it solely, or even mostly, to non-whites to fight for every inch of their rights is just wrong imo. JFC it's 2018. When will whites become every bit as outraged when black people get kicked out of a Starbucks and ARRESTED for something that no white person ever would? Or shot DEAD by law enforcement for something no white person ever would, or when a Hispanic man gets a ****ing gun pulled on him for buying mementos. Like that would ever happen to a white person? Or AirBnB guests leaving a home and having cops called on them because they were black. Or two people visiting a college and having cops called on them because they weren't white... And this is just the most obvious **** that makes the news. When do white people rise up in unison and shout enough!

I'm not saying go home, this is a job for whitey. I'm saying racism and discrimination is a problem for EVERYONE who wants to live in a culturally diverse, educated, and progressive society. I think it's not only necessary, but mandatory that more white people are fighting along side non-whites in the battle for equal rights and treatment. And it should be to the point where non-whites shouldn't even have to show up. Whites should beat them there.

Last note: I agree it's sad that non-whites don't get the respect that whites do, but it's unfortunately still a fact. When "Trump's America" sees a bunch of blacks protesting it's an affirmation of what they fear most. An uprising from oppression and there go them blacks getting outta line again. It's important to remind them they are a minority among whites and think having huge turnouts of majority whites protesting makes a much bigger impact and lets racists know this is NOT their America and they will not win.

I mostly just browse the politics forum because there are a lot of smart and knowledgeable posters here. Maybe I'm thinking about it all wrong. If there's a better way towards progress way I'm all ears.

You can join the protest and get behind the black leaders. That is very different from pushing them aside.

Racism aside, it’s amazing that the way businesses deal with loiterers at Starbucks or a golf course is to call the cops instead of like walking up to them and asking them to leave.

I never said push anyone aside. My point was that a lot of this is so obvious they shouldn't even have to show up. It should outrage whites every bit as much.

Edit: That was probably poorly worded. Of course, it should outrage the discriminated more. But the majority needs to step up in a much bigger way.

These people seem to have a good approach:

Coalition of Anti-Racist Whites (CARW)

Yeah, seems fine, although I half expect to be disappointed by stories of idiots in the organization if I Google too hard.

Why should a barista whose job it is to make lattes have to confront vagrants who wander into the store? I've seen it 2 or 3 times at SB myself - somebody harassing the customers for money - the manager asks them to leave sometimes but if it's a repeat offender or someone who looks unstable,why not call in people trained to handle these situations?

This is the typical fantastic businessdude posting we all know and love

Except this part didn't happen. They skipped the "ask the guys if they want to buy coffee" part and went straight to "call the cops."

Like, I like to think of myself as a fairly privileged white guy, but this is some next-level privilege when your snap reaction is to call emergency services on customers who haven't ordered yet. What do you even tell dispatch here? "Help! There are black people not buying coffee! Come quick!"

What does this have to do with the story, unless you’re implying black guys automatically = vagrants? Oh right that’s probably what you’re doing.

This is like virtue signalling, but it's not virtue. Maybe A-hole signalling?

If one of the employees didn't ask them to leave what is the crime they are committing? It can't be trespassing. They weren't harrassing any customers either. Why would the police get involved?

Because someone said they were trespassing.

Then they first question the dispatcher should ask is:"Did you ask them to leave?" and if the answer is "no" tell them to try that first.

I wasn't referring to a particular situation, just the idea of the police getting involved being logical for any business. Maybe the Philly case was a false positive, but I'm sure that store deals with the non-paying customer issue constantly. Maybe the employees just didn't want to deal with it - yet have gotten complaints from customers - so immediately calling for help is prolly understandable, and you can't expect the baristas to be perfect analyzers of everything happening in the cafe in between slinging cappuccinos.

We really need to close down these "Starbucks" untill we can find out whats going on.

Businessdude a strong defender of what he imagines happens in hypothetical Starbucks.